Author Topic: Misleading article about federal cuts  (Read 2474 times)

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Online IronDioPriest

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2013, 12:28:46 PM »
At least I can choose to not give my money to the deadbeats that stand at the street corners with the patently fake "Will Work For Food" signs. It's both funny and sad that the professional beggars are actually the overachievers in the deadbeat demographic...those who are not content to merely collect government welfare but instead have the initiative (and the lack of self respect) to pretend that they will work...that they are hungry and beg for additional money from sympathetic suckers.

During my time working in drug/alcohol rehab (faith-based, privately donor-funded BTW, for our new friend), I encountered a man who had been an addict for over a decade, who WAS one of these sign-holders. He claimed that without exception, the homeless people holding the signs are: addicts, loosely-organized, and using any money given them by do-gooders to feed their addiction.

He said that the sign-holders in Minneapolis have a network of flophouses or "safe areas" like stairwells and foyers, where they gather, sleep, and buy/sell/use drugs together. He said that food is their last consideration - that their first priority is drugs/booze, and a place to use them.

He said the very absolute worst thing you can do for these people is give them money. It is the opposite of what they need.
"A strict observance of the written laws is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self-preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to written law, would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the end to the means."

- Thomas Jefferson

Offline ChrstnHsbndFthr

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2013, 02:10:06 PM »

I have one final thought. I am sure not everyone here ascribes to the teachings of Jesus but I wanted to share them with you.

In Matthew 25 it states that Jesus said,

"For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’"

Thank you for the previous replies. And I hope you all have a great day.

Good quote, do you know this one also in Luke 18:20 <Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.>


Pay special attention to that "Do not steal" one.

Both these scriptures are about personal conduct to please God.  I am to give. There is no moral value in stealing from another at gun point through taxes, for him or me, so that it might be given another. What is given is given of MINE, not given of yours. Do you understand the moral and scriptural difference? 
Every man who follows Christ gives to the poor. Without doubt. The conservatives give of their own, as God has prospered them. The liberals give what they take from others, excepting of course for the cut they keep for themselves. Which is better in your opinion?

“My mission today is to go forth and tell people about why I follow Christ and also what the Bible teaches, and part of that teaching is that women and men are meant to be together.

“However, I would never treat anyone with disrespect just because they are different from me. We are all created by the Almighty and like Him, I love all of humanity. We would all be better off if we loved God and loved each other.”
Phil Robertson an elder in the church of Christ

Offline LadyVirginia

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2013, 03:35:03 PM »
Every man who follows Christ gives to the poor. Without doubt. The conservatives give of their own, as God has prospered them. The liberals give what they take from others, excepting of course for the cut they keep for themselves. Which is better in your opinion?

nice!
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Online Pandora

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2013, 03:35:28 PM »
Synchronicity a la Fran Porretto.

Quote
After all, Jesus Himself told us to "help the poor," didn't He?

Well, actually, no, He didn't. Once again, with trumpets:

    “Be careful not to display your righteousness merely to be seen by people. Otherwise you have no reward with your Father in heaven. Thus whenever you do charitable giving, do not blow a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in synagogues and on streets so that people will praise them. I tell you the truth, they have their reward. But when you do your giving, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your gift may be in secret. And your Father, who sees in secret, will reward you. [Matthew 6:1-4]

Also remember this scene:

    Now while Jesus was in Bethany at the house of Simon the leper, a woman came to him with an alabaster jar of expensive perfumed oil, and she poured it on his head as he was at the table. When the disciples saw this, they became indignant and said, “Why this waste? It could have been sold at a high price and the money given to the poor!” When Jesus learned of this, he said to them, “Why are you bothering this woman? She has done a good service for me. For you will always have the poor with you, but you will not always have me! When she poured this oil on my body, she did it to prepare me for burial. I tell you the truth, wherever this gospel is proclaimed in the whole world, what she has done will also be told in memory of her.” [Matthew 26:6-13]

The Christian message of material compassion -- that is, charity toward the "poor," however they may be defined -- is a qualified message. It emphasizes the individual conscience and underscores questions all too frequently sloughed in discussions of charity:

    Does the beneficiary really need help?
    Is the benefactor really capable of helping?
    Should the help be of a specific material nature?
    Will it really help the recipient, or will it leave him as he was or degrade him further?


All sorts of observations derive from those questions. Perhaps the most important one is that he who ponders whether to give must first position himself so that he can answer them, both before and after giving alms. Most State-administered "charity" fails even to ask them, which should be refutation enough for any thinking man.

All the above having been said, most of the inveterate boosters of State "charity" are unconcerned with the Christian message, except for its utility as a rhetorical bludgeon.

Unless and until those questions can be answered correctly, don't "help".
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Offline warpmine

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #24 on: October 10, 2013, 05:30:21 PM »
When my heart aches, I buy them a hotdog or drink but I never blindly donate cash to them for the same reasons previously stated, they are mostly addicts and I don't contribute to their sins.
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Online richb

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #25 on: October 10, 2013, 05:57:25 PM »


Side note: Anecdotally, I do not remember having this problem (deadbeats for dollars) during the GWB years in my small town. Sure we had a guy who moved around from place to place who occasionally hung out a sign...we still have that guy and it's because he is a mental case...but now we have two or three professional beggars. We have had them for many months now. They are well dressed. They are clean. They are out there every day from 9 to 5 with their cardboard signs.  > But, yeah, we have definitely seen a serious uptick in the professional deadbeat demo since President Shutdown took office.

I too,  never saw panhandlers in my community until Barry became president.   I was shocked the first time,  now I see them regularly.   >:(

Online IronDioPriest

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #26 on: October 10, 2013, 06:44:30 PM »
When my heart aches, I buy them a hotdog or drink but I never blindly donate cash to them for the same reasons previously stated, they are mostly addicts and I don't contribute to their sins.

I wouldn't criticize you for following your heart in the spirit of giving. But I will say that according to the fella I interviewed (mentioned above) all you're really doing by giving them food is making more of the money they do have available for drugs and booze.

He thinks the best help they can receive is prayer and the quickest path to rock-bottom. Giving them anything delays rock-bottom.
"A strict observance of the written laws is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self-preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to written law, would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the end to the means."

- Thomas Jefferson

Offline LadyVirginia

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #27 on: October 10, 2013, 07:23:34 PM »
I prefer to give to established places like a church soup kitchen or food pantry.
"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

Offline trapeze

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #28 on: October 11, 2013, 12:33:22 AM »
We have five professional deadbeats in our small town. We used to have one. Well, maybe it is one and a half.

The one for real deadbeat is "Chris." Everyone knows Chris. Chris is mentally ill and he belongs in an institution. Thanks to the ACLU he cannot be confined in an institution against his will. So, instead of being cared for by mental health professionals he wanders between one end of our town and the other. Some people take pity on him and try to help him but, sadly, he is beyond help. He can be given clothing or money or cigarettes. If you give him money he will use it for food. Drugs are useless to him. His brain is permanently damaged.

There is another one...the half a deadbeat. I don't know her name. I'm not sure anyone does. I say that she is half a deadbeat because she will sort of work for her handouts. She sweeps sidewalks and sort of washes windows...stuff like that. She also belongs in an institution and is almost entirely beyond help.

The other three are new in town. The first one showed up in the spring. He is the "well dressed" deadbeat. He wears clean and new clothing. Nice jackets. Nice shoes. His usual place is standing at the outlet to the grocery store parking lot with a sign that says, "Need food. God bless." Sometimes he mixes it up with a "Need work" sign but I've never seen him anywhere but at this or one of his other stations. Sometimes he will be at an intersection with a traffic light and I will get to stop within a few feet. I will stare at him and he will quickly avert his eyes. He knows what I'm thinking about him, that he's a total deadbeat. I watched him leave the grocery store parking lot one day and, having a few minutes to spare, I followed him. I broke off when I saw him heading into one of the surrounding condos.

Toward the end of the summer we have had a couple of more professional deadbeats show up. One is a young male who does seem to be a drug addicted person. The other one is a grossly overweight female who also appears to be working on a drug habit judging by the way she is dressed and how she carries herself.

So...three new deadbeats this year in my small community. I think that it might be a sign of things to come. I think that it's entirely possible that we will get a few more in the next year although I am not sure how many deadbeats a small community can support. Deadbeats are like mimes. How many mimes can a community support before people start smacking them in the head?

Anyway, it was sort of comical about three weeks ago when all three of the new deadbeats were working the same intersection for some reason. I was kind of hoping that they might start fighting or something. They do seem to travel on foot. I've never seen any of them in a car.

As I said earlier, it is almost without a doubt that the "pros" are on welfare. The two that I mentioned at the beginning of this post...I'm not sure. Neither of them has any kind of a permanent address. They are usually seen "camping" on the outskirts of town or in the forest. I have no idea at all how they survive the winter. I feel sorry for them because, as I said, they are crazy and thanks to the ACLU assholes, beyond help. But the professional deadbeats I have no pity for.

In a doomsday scenario, hippies will be among the first casualties. So not everything about doomsday will be bad.

Online ToddF

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #29 on: October 11, 2013, 08:58:20 AM »
This sounds like other countries, in which street children are organized.  I guess it's only a matter of time before that "business" model makes it to the US, where your giving just goes to a criminal boss, anyway.

If you want to really help the homeless, Union Gospel Mission, Sharing and Caring Hands, or other places like that are the way.

Online Alphabet Soup

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Re: Misleading article about federal cuts
« Reply #30 on: October 11, 2013, 10:09:35 AM »
I recall a time when Random was about nine and we came across a bum at the bottom of an exit ramp. This wasn't one of the passive ones that just stand there holding a sign - this klown was aggressively intruding on the cars in line almost with a demanding tone.

Random: "What's that man doing?"

Me: "He's a panhandler sweetie. A bum"

Random: "What does he want?"

Me: "He's begging for money"

Random: "Why doesn't he go get a job?"

I couldn't have been prouder ;')