Author Topic: Solar systems slows dropping in price.  (Read 174 times)

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Online Weisshaupt

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Solar systems slows dropping in price.
« on: July 18, 2017, 08:58:47 AM »
This is a pretty good deal:

http://mailchi.mp/ironedison.com/our-biggest-sale-ever-nickel-iron-batteries-and-complete-solar-systems?e=3f8881df3e

The NiFe batteries s are bulkier and heavier , and probably shouldn't be discharged as much as this guy designs  the systems to discharge,  but are far better tan the Lead ones I bought-- These will last with proper watering for over 100 years. Mine? I will be lucky to get 20

Solar panels have been slowly dropping,  and  that complete 48 Volt Outback system is a pretty good deal.  Its large enough to power most homes, A/C and all ( no baseboard heat)  A normal home uses about 800 KW-Hrs a month, or around 28 a day.  A 6.7kw Array should generate between 26 and 33 KW-hrs.. so this package is sized right and the batteries store 29 KW in total -  so You have about a days worth of "extra"  and more if you go into conservation mode and just run freezer, fridge, water pump and other essentials. 

Be aware the math is funky. The system cost is $37K.  You can tack on  another 5K for wiring , and panels, and switches and other " Balance of system " items.  If you install it yourself you can also claim the cost of your (or someone else's) labor, but now you will have to start proving stuff to the IRS if you are audited.
You can deduct 30%  of the cost of installing your system straight off your taxes.. so if you pay more than 10-13K to the government in income tax NOW, then you can shift that payment to these guys.  That is true only through 2019 , and then the amount you can deduct falls. ( unless they change the law, which they might..)

So around 11-13K  is money you would normally have paid in taxes that now goes to the PV system dealer, along with another 25K or so out of  your pocket.  So still not "Cheap" but it is awesome when the lights stay on and it will pay itself off over about 20 years.  You will not save money. You will simply pay your electric bill for the next 20 years, now at something near current rates .  It will probably NOT add to the value of the home, so if you think you might move, don't do it.  If you are at or near retirement and this is your house till you die, well this is another cost you won't pay later on your fixed income, no matter ow the Government tries to mess with oil prices, Coal production or other factors. 

Solar IS a viable technology for local, personal use.  Depending on local electricity prices the ROI is awful to poor. But you are gaining independence and insurance against future price changes.

Online Libertas

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Re: Solar systems slows dropping in price.
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2017, 12:32:32 PM »
Basically the decision comes down to how much a person values being independent from the retail providers and having the means to do so...the assumption being one desires electricity.  If the crap hits the fan...something so routine and dependent will be a luxury.  And losing a luxury may kill some folks...and I am not talking just about those younger folks going apesh*t because their phones no longer entertain them 24-7.  I would like electricity to power only the most necessary things...like to recharge batteries for use in flashlights and radios...or to operate a well pump.  But as for the latter if I had none of that but had an old fashioned hand-pump for the well, could I live?  Yes.  Would things be easier...nicer with electricity, sure.  The other thing I worry about with solar is that up here storms can blanket the sky for days and at any time of the year.  Those longer stretches will force people to have other alternative for energy...wood, wind, gas, geothermal...whatever.  And limited means mean picking the least potentially problematic option for a primary source.

Well, write these losers off when the wall sockets shut off...

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-07-18/another-reason-men-dont-work-imaginary-world-more-enjoyable-real-world
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 12:55:30 PM by Libertas »
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Online Weisshaupt

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Re: Solar systems slows dropping in price.
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2017, 03:20:17 PM »
 The more calories you don't burn pumping a well and carting water , the less food you will need to obtain.  Being able to preserve calories by freezing/refrigerating them could make the difference between surviving the winter and not.
It could very well mean the difference between survival and not- especially if calories are tight.
And sanitation.. we use water to was everything.. still think you will keep everything as clean as you do now ( including your own body) if you have to tote every Gallon to where you need it for those activities?

I think you are making a mistake classifying this as luxury. Its a major survival advantage -- to a certain size system.  Then its luxury.

You don't need the 6KW system to do the above.. the 2 KW system for around 20K gross could provide the non-luxury amount of power needed.

If you have to supplement with generator power for a week of storms, so what? The rest of the time you run silent and you don't need fuel
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 03:25:10 PM by Weisshaupt »

Online Libertas

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Re: Solar systems slows dropping in price.
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2017, 07:32:48 AM »
Scale does matter...so does location.  Not is the current BOL subject to spotty weather, it is also more closely surrounded by neighbors not all of whom I know intimately enough to know what kind of people they are, and the main access road has a clear view to most of the homes on that stretch in the winter...there is the glimmering shimmer of sustenance to lure zombies to consider...not that they wouldn't be drawn any way...but more glitter makes security a higher priority too...

Just sayin' it isn't just this or that...a lot of stuff comes into play on every decision and everything has to get weighed against each other...I'm not saying I have all the answers...I may make mistakes...but I can cut down the latter if I at least know what all the questions are.
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Online Weisshaupt

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Re: Solar systems slows dropping in price.
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2017, 12:51:56 PM »
Scale does matter...so does location.  Not is the current BOL subject to spotty weather, it is also more closely surrounded by neighbors not all of whom I know intimately enough to know what kind of people they are, and the main access road has a clear view to most of the homes on that stretch in the winter...there is the glimmering shimmer of sustenance to lure zombies to consider...not that they wouldn't be drawn any way...but more glitter makes security a higher priority too...

Just sayin' it isn't just this or that...a lot of stuff comes into play on every decision and everything has to get weighed against each other...I'm not saying I have all the answers...I may make mistakes...but I can cut down the latter if I at least know what all the questions are.

Yeah, my panels are front and center -- but then that also means other people driving by can see you stealing them.. depends on how zombie we get I suppose, but panels are bulky, somewhat dangerous and  a lot of people will be too stupid to be able to hook them up correctly.. I don't know how much of a target they will be. Trying to "steal" a PV system is like trying to steal a truck.. by taking bits off at a time. Not that it can't be done, I know about the stripped cars on blocks in the ghettos - but it takes time and people around who are willing to let it happen.

  I do know that glitter form a panel requires a line of sight.. Sound from a generator? Not so much..  Supplying enough power to run the freezer and water pump is not optional IMHO. That is a huge number of calories saved and sanitation is preserved.  Batteries and an inverter are needed in BOTH applications. You can always add panels as you go.


Online Libertas

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Re: Solar systems slows dropping in price.
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2017, 07:07:46 AM »
Scale does matter...so does location.  Not is the current BOL subject to spotty weather, it is also more closely surrounded by neighbors not all of whom I know intimately enough to know what kind of people they are, and the main access road has a clear view to most of the homes on that stretch in the winter...there is the glimmering shimmer of sustenance to lure zombies to consider...not that they wouldn't be drawn any way...but more glitter makes security a higher priority too...

Just sayin' it isn't just this or that...a lot of stuff comes into play on every decision and everything has to get weighed against each other...I'm not saying I have all the answers...I may make mistakes...but I can cut down the latter if I at least know what all the questions are.

Yeah, my panels are front and center -- but then that also means other people driving by can see you stealing them.. depends on how zombie we get I suppose, but panels are bulky, somewhat dangerous and  a lot of people will be too stupid to be able to hook them up correctly.. I don't know how much of a target they will be. Trying to "steal" a PV system is like trying to steal a truck.. by taking bits off at a time. Not that it can't be done, I know about the stripped cars on blocks in the ghettos - but it takes time and people around who are willing to let it happen.

  I do know that glitter form a panel requires a line of sight.. Sound from a generator? Not so much..  Supplying enough power to run the freezer and water pump is not optional IMHO. That is a huge number of calories saved and sanitation is preserved.  Batteries and an inverter are needed in BOTH applications. You can always add panels as you go.

Your spread has the better ground too, y'all can see trouble coming from further out than I...I am still working on perimeter security planning, have several low-tech ideas and am gathering supplies...but a lot more has to be done on this score...plus not knowing what my goofy siblings plans are from moment to moment is a routine irritant...
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