Topic: Here's A Dose Of Doom For Ya

[trapeze]

The mother of all world doom articles perhaps.

Accelerated demand from developing countries, especially China, has caused an unprecedented shift in the price structure of resources: after 100 hundred years or more of price declines, they are now rising, and in the last 8 years have undone, remarkably, the effects of the last 100-year decline! Statistically, also, the level of price rises makes it extremely unlikely that the old trend is still in place. If I am right, we are now entering a period in which, like it or not, we must finally follow President Carter’s advice to develop a thoughtful energy policy and give up our carefree and careless ways with resources. The quicker we do this, the lower the cost will be. Any improvement at all in lifestyle for our grandchildren will take much more thoughtful behavior from political leaders and more restraint from everyone. Rapid growth is not ours by divine right; it is not even mathematically possible over a sustained period. Our goal should be to get everyone out of abject poverty, even if it necessitates some income redistribution. Because we have way overstepped sustainable levels, the greatest challenge will be in redesigning lifestyles to emphasize quality of life while quantitatively reducing our demand levels. A lower population would help.

Very, very long, very depressing article.

Historically, human population has been checked by war, famine and disease. We haven't had much of those lately. And yes, that does apply to war. We haven't had a total war that results in mass (near genocidal), near extinction levels of casualties in many decades.

Makes you wonder when the hammer is going to fall.

[charlesoakwood]

Methinks you have found a Luddite huckster.

...after 100 hundred years or more of price declines, they are now rising, and in the last 8 years have undone, remarkably, the effects of the last 100-year decline!

Yup, happens everytime the Marxists take over innovation and production.

[Libertas]

There's a lot of Marxist trash to eliminate, the problem will thus resolve itself.

 

[trapeze]

On the other hand...we keep finding new sources of oil. Darnedest thing, eh?

[Glock32]

The Russians did some research in the 1950s on the possibility that oil is not necessarily a "fossil", but is in fact capable of being produced by an abiotic process deep within the Earth in a continuous cycle, not unlike the recycling of crust at subduction and eruption zones around the world. I don't know a great deal about what they discovered, but I think they were closer to truth than anything in the current dogma about "fossil fuels".

And even if it is due to an entirely biotic process, most of that biomatter was not dead dinosaurs or anything like that. Most of it is marine algae, diatoms, and single-cell organisms. I'm pretty sure trillions of those things have been living and dying ever since, so is it not reasonable that the process that turns them into oil has likewise been occurring on a continuous basis?

[LadyVirginia]

Years ago I heard Rush on his show speculate that perhaps the earth continually made oil and that the fear of running out was unfounded.

[AlanS]

Years ago I heard Rush on his show speculate that perhaps the earth continually made oil and that the fear of running out was unfounded.

I would have to say no. Otherwise we could go back to old reservoirs and get more oil. From my experience, once they're depleted, that's it.

[Pandora]

Years ago I heard Rush on his show speculate that perhaps the earth continually made oil and that the fear of running out was unfounded.

I would have to say no. Otherwise we could go back to old reservoirs and get more oil. From my experience, once they're depleted, that's it.

Really?  All of them?  Because it was from Rush that I heard too that in going back to the "depleted" wells, more oil was found.

[trapeze]

I am no chemist and I'm not a biologist so what I am about to say here is pretty much almost worthless. It's based on my belief that man is basically a problem solver with nearly unlimited potential.

I am of the opinion that we can and will at some point in the future create fuel oil. I think that there is a potential in genetically engineering organisms to create it in mass quantities. And why not? Oil is, after all, organic.

Again, this thought is based on no scientific knowledge of these various disciplines...just the belief that humans always seem to find a way to solve any problem, to engineer solutions to life's issues.

[AlanS]

Really?  All of them?  Because it was from Rush that I heard too that in going back to the "depleted" wells, more oil was found.

On the occasions they do go into an old well, it's USUALLY for a new zone (reservoir) that the casing and production string already run through. Sometimes, they pull the production string and sidetrack, or redrill, the well to a different location. Either way, the previous zone is depleted, empty, gone.

I'm NOT a petroleum engineer, so there may be cases where the zone was not economically feasible to produce, but technology has made it possible to produce today.

I can assure you, if oil reproduced fast enough, we'd have enough oil even with the drilling mandate in place. There are literally THOUSANDS of dried up wells in the shallow Gulf of Mexico.

[charlesoakwood]

Man has been working for better fuel since he understood fire.  That we will achieve new better fuels is a certainty.
It is also a certainty man will achieve better fuel before we run out of oil, regardless of consumption.

[Glock32]

I am no chemist and I'm not a biologist so what I am about to say here is pretty much almost worthless. It's based on my belief that man is basically a problem solver with nearly unlimited potential.

I am of the opinion that we can and will at some point in the future create fuel oil. I think that there is a potential in genetically engineering organisms to create it in mass quantities. And why not? Oil is, after all, organic.

Again, this thought is based on no scientific knowledge of these various disciplines...just the belief that humans always seem to find a way to solve any problem, to engineer solutions to life's issues.

There's no doubt about it. From a strictly technical standpoint, we're already capable of synthesizing a lot of useful chemicals, the challenge is often more economic than technical. A government throwing gravel in the gears doesn't help matters either. It's even possible to extract gold from seawater, it's just that the amount of energy required is more expensive than the gold they get. But it shows what we can do.

[rickl]

Really?  All of them?  Because it was from Rush that I heard too that in going back to the "depleted" wells, more oil was found.

I think it's more a case of what is economically feasible.  The oil that's easiest to pump was pumped when prices were lower.  At the time it didn't make economic sense to expend Herculean efforts to wring out every last drop from those wells.  When the price of oil goes up, then those old wells are revisited and some more oil can be squeezed out with newer and more expensive technology.  I think the same applies to gold mining.

[charlesoakwood]

Fracking those old wells too.

[John Florida]

I am no chemist and I'm not a biologist so what I am about to say here is pretty much almost worthless. It's based on my belief that man is basically a problem solver with nearly unlimited potential.

I am of the opinion that we can and will at some point in the future create fuel oil. I think that there is a potential in genetically engineering organisms to create it in mass quantities. And why not? Oil is, after all, organic.

Again, this thought is based on no scientific knowledge of these various disciplines...just the belief that humans always seem to find a way to solve any problem, to engineer solutions to life's issues.

 You're gonna love this!!!!!

Joule patents fuel made from water, sunlight, CO2


The mystery bug--a type of bacteria--behind intriguing biofuel start-up Joule Unlimited was revealed with the publication of a patent on Tuesday.

The Cambridge, Mass.-based start-up said that it has received Patent No. 7,794,969 for an engineered form of cynobacteria, or blue-green algae, which grows in water and is capable of secreting biodiesel fuel.

The company asserts that it can make diesel fuel directly using only sunlight and waste carbon dioxide in glass bioreactors for as little as $30 a barrel.



Read more: http://news.cnet.com/8301-11128_3-20016330-54.html#ixzz1V33v5vmq


Read more: http://news.cnet.com/8301-11128_3-20016330-54.html#ixzz1V33XsfY4

[Libertas]

Sounds good, but what kinf of scale are we talking about to be able to bring a significant market presence?

I wonder if they are underestimating the capital needed to make this relevant.

[AlanS]

Sounds good, but what kinf of scale are we talking about to be able to bring a significant market presence?

I wonder if they are underestimating the capital needed to make this relevant.

Kind of what I was thinking. With our oil demand, we'd need to turn the Atlantic into an algae farm.

[John Florida]

Sounds good, but what kinf of scale are we talking about to be able to bring a significant market presence?

I wonder if they are underestimating the capital needed to make this relevant.

 I'm doing this from memory cause I had people in the damned house wanting to talk( I don't even like them)But From what I caught they had made a land purchase  (1000 acres)I think in Arizona out in the desert and were starting a pilot plant to fine tune and then once that was up and running it's just a matter of time and they weren't talking that long.

 What caught my attention was that the diesel they produced could just be mixed in the regular supply line and it just mixed in and no ill effects on the system or the engines at all.

 I just suck at finding this stuff.

[John Florida]

Officials with the Energy Information Administration report that diesel consumption in the United States has steadily risen in recent years. In 2005, 9.4 million barrels were used. In 2009, 1.04 billion barrels were consumed. In 2010, diesel supplied 5.9% of the U.S. energy needs.

Joule is taking the first big step toward commercialization, leasing more than 1,000 acres of land in Lea County, New Mexico. They hope to prove the organism can produce fuel quickly, on a large scale, nearly anywhere.

Sims believes the technology can revolutionize part of the fuel industry, meeting transportation needs virtually anywhere around the world.

"What this approach brings is not only environmentally friendly, but it also brings localization to the fuel business for the first time. It also provides for consistency of availability or supply and cost. None of this has ever been present in the oil business in the past," said Sims. "It brings energy security. It brings job creation."



Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/08/02/energy-in-america-new-diesel-biofuel-faster-more-efficient-to-produce-says/#ixzz1V3sSBRh7

[Alphabet Soup]

On the other hand...we keep finding new sources of oil. Darnedest thing, eh?

Yea, but nothing that we are allowed to touch. Which brings up a question: If everywhere in the world gets the oil pumped out but the United states, will that cause the earth to get out of balance and develop a wobble?