I wouldn't dismiss Herman out of hand, gNewt can be baited, you just have to be oblique in the attack. The key is to get him talking by asking for more details...gNewt loves the sound of his own voice and will take the bait...sometimes gNewt talks too much, then you can pick up the candy he tossed out and have some sport with it. Being a business man surely Herman is not without wiles.
But a Lincoln-Douglas debate format with Barry with no notes or teleprompters? I would pay to see that.