Author Topic: Firefly  (Read 7284 times)

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Offline BMG

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2011, 08:24:21 PM »
Quite right Trap. They didn't even get completely through that first season before they were canceled. The last few episodes were barely finished in time to go out and at least one of them was never even aired.  Though I liked the movie, I REALLY wish they had made it a two part deal. It was too rushed in my opinion and could have benefited greatly with a second part.

You know, right around that same time frame Star Trek Enterprise was airing too. That was another series that I really liked. Though it ran for 4 seasons, I thought it was cancelled way before its time too. I liked that one more than any of the other Star Trek series', though Next Generation ran a close second.

Though Voyager, DS9 and the Original Star Trek really sucked in my opinion.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2011, 08:41:47 PM by BMG »
“The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government.” 
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Offline Libertas

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #21 on: November 22, 2011, 10:02:01 PM »
Quite right Trap. They didn't even get completely through that first season before they were canceled. The last few episodes were barely finished in time to go out and at least one of them was never even aired.  Though I liked the movie, I REALLY wish they had made it a two part deal. It was too rushed in my opinion and could have benefited greatly with a second part.

You know, right around that same time frame Star Trek Enterprise was airing too. That was another series that I really liked. Though it ran for 4 seasons, I thought it was cancelled way before its time too. I liked that one more than any of the other Star Trek series', though Next Generation ran a close second.

Though Voyager, DS9 and the Original Star Trek really sucked in my opinion.

It's probably a generational thing, I liked the original Trek series, grew up in that era, we all talked about the latest episode in school the next day.  IMO the original cast was superior, and I liked them better in the movies that followed, even though I watched the rest.  I thought Voyager & DS9 blew and could have killed the franchise.  TNG could have some dull episodes too and I recoiled at their more prevalent preachy do-gooderism.  The Q stories are lame and the holodeck gets silly at times.  IMO the genre works better when an evil protagonist is there to slay.  More bazooka, less chick flick!
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline BMG

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #22 on: November 22, 2011, 11:27:11 PM »
@Libertas:

You're probably right about the generational comment, at least to some extent. When I was growing up and watching the original I was watching re-runs in the early 80's and by those standards they were pretty campy and cheesy...even though new shows, like Buck Rogers were on that were at least just as campy and cheesy. lol

Even now, whenever I happen to watch an episode of the original with an objective eye, I still don't much care for them though. When I was a kid, watching TV was serious business you know? Now I can watch and see past some of the campy stuff and attribute it to the era in which it was produced.

But there is largely one reason why I don't care for it much still today and that is William Shatner.

I...absolutely...hate...the...way...he ...haltingly...delivers...his...lines.
“The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government.” 
- Patrick Henry

"The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates."
- Tacitus

Offline Delnorin

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2011, 11:40:26 PM »
I'm on episode 11.

It's hands down 200% better than "Walking Dead".

Is there some rule written on stone tablets that says if the show is actually good.. you must discontinue is quickly.  But if it sucks... make sure it runs for decades?

Offline Delnorin

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2011, 04:53:51 AM »
Take my Love;
Take my Land.
Take me to a place;
Where I can not stand.

I don't care;
I'm still free.
You can't take;
The sky from me.

Take me out;
To the black.
Tell them all;
I ain't come'n back.

Burn the Land;
and boil the sea.
You can't take;
The sky from me.

I've a place;
where I can be.
Since I found;
Serenity.

But you can't take the sky from me......


Lovin this show... I'm getting pissed I'm nearing the end of it so soon.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 05:49:18 AM by Delnorin »

Offline Libertas

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2011, 06:39:33 AM »
@Libertas:

You're probably right about the generational comment, at least to some extent. When I was growing up and watching the original I was watching re-runs in the early 80's and by those standards they were pretty campy and cheesy...even though new shows, like Buck Rogers were on that were at least just as campy and cheesy. lol

Even now, whenever I happen to watch an episode of the original with an objective eye, I still don't much care for them though. When I was a kid, watching TV was serious business you know? Now I can watch and see past some of the campy stuff and attribute it to the era in which it was produced.

But there is largely one reason why I don't care for it much still today and that is William Shatner.

I...absolutely...hate...the...way...he ...haltingly...delivers...his...lines.

Hey, many a comic would be missing a lot of material without Shatner's Capt. Kirk!   ;D

But yeah, watch 'em now and they are silly and campy, but back in the day it was pretty neat, and as a result I like those characters more.  Although of the newest vintage, the recent flick with Chris Pine and the alternative timeline I have to say was pretty good.
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2011, 06:41:21 AM »
I'm on episode 11.

It's hands down 200% better than "Walking Dead".

Is there some rule written on stone tablets that says if the show is actually good.. you must discontinue is quickly.  But if it sucks... make sure it runs for decades?

I'm almost certain it's carved in cement somewhere...making a social statement    ::puke::  trumps quality entertainment in the long run.

 ::)
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline BMG

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2011, 07:41:33 AM »
Quote
Is there some rule written on stone tablets that says if the show is actually good.. you must discontinue is quickly.  But if it sucks... make sure it runs for decades?

There certainly is! And those nasty Fox exces seem to cherish that rule more than their own children!
“The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government.” 
- Patrick Henry

"The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates."
- Tacitus

Offline BMG

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2011, 07:51:30 AM »
Alright, so who is your favorite character and why?

For me, I guess I'd have to say Jayne Cobb. That dude was a great character, you loved to hate him and he was likeable at the same time. Aside from that Adam Baldwin was freaking hilarious in the part. He had some of the absolute best lines...

"...Awww! And I was gonna git me an ear too!"

Heheh...

Of course as far as favorite scenes go, I'd have to vote hands down for the Book/River interaction in the 'hair' scene. Good stuff right there...
“The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government.” 
- Patrick Henry

"The more corrupt the state, the more it legislates."
- Tacitus

Online ToddF

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2011, 10:17:05 AM »
I've seen the movie but not the series.  It's on my list.  Right now, I'm finally watching Farscape ( ::danceban:: Netflix for streaming formerly out of print series  ::danceban:: )  Next I'll finally watch Seasons 3 and 4 of Lexx, which once again has been out of print.

Before this I watched the 1st season of Star Trek.  Amazing watching it in HD, compared to 20 or so years ago watching it on VHS quality at best.  All the detail!  And I didn't realize Chekov was not in Season 1.


Online Pandora

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2011, 12:03:00 PM »
Alright, so who is your favorite character and why?

For me, I guess I'd have to say Jayne Cobb. That dude was a great character, you loved to hate him and he was likeable at the same time. Aside from that Adam Baldwin was freaking hilarious in the part. He had some of the absolute best lines...

"...Awww! And I was gonna git me an ear too!"

Heheh...

Of course as far as favorite scenes go, I'd have to vote hands down for the Book/River interaction in the 'hair' scene. Good stuff right there...

Hahah; I'd forgotten that!
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Offline Miltrainer

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #31 on: November 23, 2011, 07:37:58 PM »
I've seen the movie but not the series.  It's on my list.  Right now, I'm finally watching Farscape ( ::danceban:: Netflix for streaming formerly out of print series  ::danceban:: )  Next I'll finally watch Seasons 3 and 4 of Lexx, which once again has been out of print.

Before this I watched the 1st season of Star Trek.  Amazing watching it in HD, compared to 20 or so years ago watching it on VHS quality at best.  All the detail!  And I didn't realize Chekov was not in Season 1.


On that note, here is a little trivia. The reason they brought in Chekov was that the producers wanted to capture the young female crowd. The Monkeys, at the time, were huge. Sooooo, they brought in a character that looked like Davey Jones.  ::saywhat::
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Online Pandora

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #32 on: November 23, 2011, 07:45:29 PM »
I've seen the movie but not the series.  It's on my list.  Right now, I'm finally watching Farscape ( ::danceban:: Netflix for streaming formerly out of print series  ::danceban:: )  Next I'll finally watch Seasons 3 and 4 of Lexx, which once again has been out of print.

Before this I watched the 1st season of Star Trek.  Amazing watching it in HD, compared to 20 or so years ago watching it on VHS quality at best.  All the detail!  And I didn't realize Chekov was not in Season 1.


On that note, here is a little trivia. The reason they brought in Chekov was that the producers wanted to capture the young female crowd. The Monkeys, at the time, were huge. Sooooo, they brought in a character that looked like Davey Jones.  ::saywhat::

"Where are your nuclear wessals?"
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Offline michelleo

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #33 on: November 23, 2011, 11:04:08 PM »
On that note, here is a little trivia. The reason they brought in Chekov was that the producers wanted to capture the young female crowd. The Monkeys, at the time, were huge. Sooooo, they brought in a character that looked like Davey Jones.  ::saywhat::
I can't believe the long hair/little boy look is back again.  How can any self-respecting woman find that attractive?!

Offline Delnorin

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #34 on: November 24, 2011, 12:17:41 AM »
Favorite Character:   Jewel Staite as Kaywinnit Lee "Kaylee" Frye.

I just fell in love with the girl.  She's not that sexy and sultry girl, she's also not that butt-ugly friend.. she's got this adorable cute look with a soft and caring heart.  She's also a genius when it comes to mechanics (impressive) and she doesn't hesistate to call people out on their crap when she sees it.  Those eyes... (sigh)... breathtaking.

Least Favorite Character:   Adam Baldwin as Jayne Cobb.

A bonafide douche bag that I would put out the air-lock after the 2nd episode if I was captain.


Offline trapeze

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #35 on: November 24, 2011, 02:17:46 AM »
Though Voyager, DS9 and the Original Star Trek really sucked in my opinion.

When I was growing up and watching the original I was watching re-runs in the early 80's and by those standards they were pretty campy and cheesy...even though new shows, like Buck Rogers were on that were at least just as campy and cheesy. lol

Even now, whenever I happen to watch an episode of the original with an objective eye, I still don't much care for them though. When I was a kid, watching TV was serious business you know? Now I can watch and see past some of the campy stuff and attribute it to the era in which it was produced.

But there is largely one reason why I don't care for it much still today and that is William Shatner.

I...absolutely...hate...the...way...he ...haltingly...delivers...his...lines.

Ahhh, Grasshopper...you lack the wisdom of historical perspective.

The original Star Trek was revolutionary in so many ways.

First, Gene Roddenberry was a genius for even getting it on the air. At the time (late 1960's), television science fiction was almost universally crap. With the notable exception of The Twilight Zone* (and to a lesser degree The Outer Limits) most television sci-fi of the era** spent almost nothing on quality writing. You can spend a bundle on fancy production values and special effects but if you have  crap for a story then the series will suck because the foundation is mush. Lost In Space, Time Tunnel, Land of the Giants and most of the episodes of Voyage To The Bottom of the Sea (all produced coincidentally by Irwin Allen) were far more typical of 1960's sci-fi fare.

Roddenberry spent money on quality writing and what he wanted and got were morality plays set in a 23rd century space exploration framework. And, contrary to your assertion, he also recruited very good, if relatively unknown, actors to do the work. Shatner may not be to your taste but he is an unforgettable actor nonetheless. What Shatner did require and sometimes got was discipline meted out by a strong director.

Anyway, Star Trek was a revolution in science fiction produced for the small screen. There had never been anything like it before and it was many, many years before there was anything on television that approached its level of quality. There is a very good reason that to this day there are still Star Trek conventions but no (1970's) Battlestar Galactica conventions. Or Six Million Dollar Man conventions. Or Buck Rogers of the 25th Century conventions. When Star Trek was under threat of cancellation viewers actually wrote letters to the network imploring that it be kept in production...the network gave in. I don't believe that had ever happened before.

Consider some of the writers of the original Star Trek television series' episodes:

Robert Bloch
Norman Spinrad
Theodore Sturgeon
Richard Matheson
David Gerrold
Harlan Ellison

...all successful/famous/award winning writer/novelists before and after Star Trek aired.

We can reasonably guess how great Star Trek could have been if Roddenberry had been given a serious budget for the entire life of the series. Typical of the times, the budget was continually downgraded until the series was eventually cancelled.

But, as we know now, it would not die. Roddenberry got the last laugh and Star Trek made a staggering amount of money in television, film, books and merchandise. It will be making money long after all of us are room temperature.

And like it or not, it all started with Shatner & company and the best writing and production values available at the time. You may think of it as campy. I was there and it was not. I know this because at about the same time there was another fictional icon on television that was purposefully made in full throttle camp mode. That mistake has since been corrected. Can you guess what it was?

Here is the LINK to the answer.

I also liked the way that Roddenberry worked the "big enemy" allegory. He set up two alien races as enemies/challengers to mankind/freedom: The Klingons (who I always thought of as the Nazis...evil but beatable) and the Romulans (sort of like the Soviets...evil and mysterious, maybe not beatable, maybe an enemy in perpetual standoff mode). That might seem tame now but it was pretty edgy stuff back then.

So...sorry to differ with you but from my perspective the original Star Trek television series holds up quite well (especial with the new hi-def release) and made other high quality productions, like Firefly, possible. Anyway, that's my two cents on the issue. Your mileage may vary.

*which featured Shatner in at least two episodes that I can remember.

**note that I am not including anything in this argument but American productions so please don't tell me about any of the UK stuff...especially the puppet work by Gerry & Sylvia Anderson or any and all Dr. Who episodes. Not interested in going there.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2011, 02:58:30 AM by trapeze »
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Offline Delnorin

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #36 on: November 24, 2011, 02:49:38 AM »
Just..... think... how...







great.... star






trek..... would....





have.....



been.... with...... someone.....



other than......









Shatner.

I dare say there would be little to nothing to make fun of anymore.

Offline trapeze

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #37 on: November 24, 2011, 03:00:17 AM »
Christopher Walken, perhaps?

Shatner doesn't exactly have a monopoly on a halting and staccato script delivery.
In a doomsday scenario, hippies will be among the first casualties. So not everything about doomsday will be bad.

Offline Delnorin

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #38 on: November 24, 2011, 04:03:50 AM »
The Movie:

Bah.. only 14 episodes.  The last one (14th) was amazing.  Is it wrong that I really truly liked the bounty hunter?

Okay.. back to the movie...

I'm only 10 minutes into it and I have to ask:

Why the HECK did they make the ship all shiny new and painted and nice inside.  More color, better clothese (less ripped and dirty), pilot control panel is nice and clean looking with functioning panels.  The series was all crap-nasty dirty and broken looking all the time....

Pipes and conduits in the hallway are now colored various pretty colors and glossy/enamel... bah!

Good: They kept the kitchen/dining room the same... same mis-matchd chairs.. nice.

Bah... Kalyee has way too many clothes on now... those bib-overals pulls down to her hips showing some belly beauty... man.. missing that big time now.  What did they do to her hair ?!?!

Engine room is redesigned... 2 side engines now that were never there... the hammock area now has a handrail and is different too. 

doh.. they redesigned the medical room.


Offline Delnorin

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Re: Firefly
« Reply #39 on: November 24, 2011, 06:41:14 AM »
Just finished the movie.

That was fantastic.  Kaylee and the doc finally got together.

What happened to Wash surprised me (shock).. but it was a beautiful thing from the view of a writer.. after what happened to Serentiy... it was an artistic balance.

I SO loved River's moment with the reavers on the bloody side of the blast doors.  Oh yeah!

I did like the cleaned up version of the firefly in the movie.. more color.  The resolution of the video quality was much better than the series quality.. suppose you gotta paint her up a bit more if you want to run on the big screen.

I think I want to start over from episode 1 now and redo it all the way through again.