Topic: If Cars Were Invented Last Week

[Castaway]

I've had inspections in VA (the worse state), TN, NC and now none in KY.  However they did raise our gas tax two cents a gallon this summer so the lack of inspections is a moot point.  The latest is going to a tax on miles since the vehicles are getting better mileage (mandated by the feds) and revenue is down.  Can't win for losing.   

[John Florida]

Ford's PATS (Passive Anti-Theft System): RF chip in the ignition key and a transponder
on the steering column are linked to the ECM.  If the chip and the transponder do not
shake hands the ECM will not allow the engine to run.  THERE IS NO WORK AROUND.

The work around is to yank the whole gawdamn sh*t out and replace it with chipless mechanics; engine, tranny, braking system; a reverse restoration project.  Except, Charles, you know what?  It's illegal to replace an engine with an older model engine.

My truck started stuttering on the way home today and I'm fit to be tied right now.

 Do you have motor vihicle checks in N.C.?

What's a motor vihicle check?  Inspection?

 If that's the case do what you wnt and keep it to yourself. Pull the motor use the bock and go back as far as you want.

[Pandora]

Ford's PATS (Passive Anti-Theft System): RF chip in the ignition key and a transponder
on the steering column are linked to the ECM.  If the chip and the transponder do not
shake hands the ECM will not allow the engine to run.  THERE IS NO WORK AROUND.

The work around is to yank the whole gawdamn sh*t out and replace it with chipless mechanics; engine, tranny, braking system; a reverse restoration project.  Except, Charles, you know what?  It's illegal to replace an engine with an older model engine.

My truck started stuttering on the way home today and I'm fit to be tied right now.

 Do you have motor vihicle checks in N.C.?

What's a motor vihicle check?  Inspection?

 If that's the case do what you wnt and keep it to yourself. Pull the motor use the bock and go back as far as you want.

That's what I say:  keep it to ourselves.  Gunsmith sez we'll see ... after the '55 is done.  We're getting there.  Carpet in and seats fitted; new tranny just waiting 'til after the holidays, and the interior guy (head liner, seat re-upholstery and door panels) just waiting for the word.

Like I said, with the Lariat, it's a reverse-restoration project and a lot of work, so we WILL SEE.  (I WILL PREVAIL!)

Oh -- the truck?  The fifth cylinder had an ignition coil failure, so not the trans, as I feared.  Tomorrow.  After $700, a coil, all new plugs, rubber boots (in oldspeak: wires) and tranny flush.  I asked the Service Manager how much of a PiTA replacing the plugs was and her answer, "well, you need to be a bit of a contortionist to reach two of 'em" -- sealed the deal; let them do it long as they're in there.  Shades of my Dad's, "I hate these @#$% engineers; they shove the stuff in there with no regard for what the mechanics need to do to fix it".

[charlesoakwood]

Pan, I'm glad you've got your baby back on the road.

Those big old mechanical V8s could drop a plug and
one might not notice it right off the bat.  Today every-
thing is wound up so tight that the slightest failure
is a real problem.

This is the second week of the PATS problem and
::crossing fingers:: it may be resolved.  Problem:
The key always in use had an RF failure.  I'm using
the original backup key and if all goes well I'll get a
new second key. 

Costs: wrecker, three trips to the mechanic, one trip
to the Ford dealer, and six days for a rental car.  If
the vehicle were a mechanical system any one of us
could have repaired the switch and been on our way. 
Digital, they can't diagnose it till it's broke (ah ha),
as the dealer said, "it will be 'hunt & peck'...
rocket science.

[BigAlSouth]

  Problem:
The key always in use had an RF failure.  I'm using
the original backup key and if all goes well I'll get a
new second key. 

Yeah. Coded keys.
Be prepared, they cost about $100.

[Pandora]

Pan, I'm glad you've got your baby back on the road.

Not yet, so we'll see if the Diagnostic Computer (which used to be a person) diagnosed the right thing.

Those big old mechanical V8s could drop a plug and
one might not notice it right off the bat.  Today every-
thing is wound up so tight that the slightest failure
is a real problem.

Exactly. 

This is the second week of the PATS problem and
::crossing fingers:: it may be resolved.  Problem:
The key always in use had an RF failure.  I'm using
the original backup key and if all goes well I'll get a
new second key. 

Costs: wrecker, three trips to the mechanic, one trip
to the Ford dealer, and six days for a rental car.  If
the vehicle were a mechanical system any one of us
could have repaired the switch and been on our way. 
Digital, they can't diagnose it till it's broke (ah ha),
as the dealer said, "it will be 'hunt & peck'...
rocket science.

Oh, good grief!  This is what I'm talking about when I bitch about "the chips".

BAS is right about the cost for a spare key, but it's worth it, IMO.

[Glock32]

I could fill paragraphs with my disdain for NC annual inspections revenue enhancements.

The pre-96 vehicles are exempt from the emissions portion of the inspection because they don't have OBD systems installed. Everything after that has an OBD with an interface port that the shop connects to the diagnostic computer. They used to use a tail pipe sniffer to read the emission content, but now the "sniffer" is built right into your car from the factory, along with who knows what else.

So, yes, if your Check Engine light is on, you'll fail the test. My light is always on because it detects a leak in the evap system. This has no bearing on the performance of the car, it's strictly environmental horse sh1t. When fumes come off the fuel in your tank, rather than escaping into the atmosphere they are absorbed into a canister filled with charcoal. When the engine is running, it sucks the fumes back out of the charcoal and burns them. My canister has a leak somewhere. Replacing it requires dropping the fuel tank, as it was ingeniously placed above it solely to confound people like us who prefer to be self-sufficient.  Instead I have left it alone, and each year I play the game of trying to get the inspection after a) resetting the check engine light and b) before the fault condition trips it back on. To further compound things, when you reset the fault code, that in itself triggers another code (a "Recently Reset") code that will also cause it to fail inspection. So I have to reset it, drive around long enough for it to give me permission to try for an inspection, and hopefully hit the window of time just right before the light has come back on.

The futility of the whole system becomes apparent if you live and commute in Charlotte, where half of the metro area is in South Carolina. They have no inspections in SC, and some of the junk heaps from there don't even have a single functioning tail light. So I get to jump through all the hoops while 1/4 or more of the cars around the city come in from SC.

The proximity does have its advantages too.  I haven't bought gasoline in NC in months.

[John Florida]

I could fill paragraphs with my disdain for NC annual inspections revenue enhancements.

The pre-96 vehicles are exempt from the emissions portion of the inspection because they don't have OBD systems installed. Everything after that has an OBD with an interface port that the shop connects to the diagnostic computer. They used to use a tail pipe sniffer to read the emission content, but now the "sniffer" is built right into your car from the factory, along with who knows what else.

So, yes, if your Check Engine light is on, you'll fail the test. My light is always on because it detects a leak in the evap system. This has no bearing on the performance of the car, it's strictly environmental horse sh1t. When fumes come off the fuel in your tank, rather than escaping into the atmosphere they are absorbed into a canister filled with charcoal. When the engine is running, it sucks the fumes back out of the charcoal and burns them. My canister has a leak somewhere. Replacing it requires dropping the fuel tank, as it was ingeniously placed above it solely to confound people like us who prefer to be self-sufficient.  Instead I have left it alone, and each year I play the game of trying to get the inspection after a) resetting the check engine light and b) before the fault condition trips it back on. To further compound things, when you reset the fault code, that in itself triggers another code (a "Recently Reset") code that will also cause it to fail inspection. So I have to reset it, drive around long enough for it to give me permission to try for an inspection, and hopefully hit the window of time just right before the light has come back on.

The futility of the whole system becomes apparent if you live and commute in Charlotte, where half of the metro area is in South Carolina. They have no inspections in SC, and some of the junk heaps from there don't even have a single functioning tail light. So I get to jump through all the hoops while 1/4 or more of the cars around the city come in from SC.

The proximity does have its advantages too.  I haven't bought gasoline in NC in months.

 Pull the bulb.

[Glock32]

Part of the diagnostics checks for a malfunctioning malfunction indicator.    

[BigAlSouth]

In NC, buried deep in the regs, there is a provision to the effect that you can get DMV "permission" to override the check engine light if the repair is prohibitively expensive and the defect is not safety related.

[charlesoakwood]

Part of the diagnostics checks for a malfunctioning malfunction indicator.    

If you pull the bulb and also cause the circuit to not be
broken, would that work?

[BigAlSouth]

Part of the diagnostics checks for a malfunctioning malfunction indicator.    

If you pull the bulb and also cause the circuit to not be
broken, would that work?

Whether the light is on or off, the tech is still going to to hook up the diagnostic computer to your car. And yes, in the regs, there is a provision for failing the vehicle if the check engine light is not working properly.

Dang, I thought the Republicans were gonna throw the whole system out.

Read this: It's not about safety, it's about revenue (as previously stated above):
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2011/10/31/2737051/garages-help-block-inspections.html

[Libertas]

Part of the diagnostics checks for a malfunctioning malfunction indicator.    

Well, if they reinstitute that stupidity here and model it on these rules I am screwed...my light stays on all the time and the dealer can;t tell me why.  They reset it and it goes off again.  They tell me it could be a loose gas cap, sounds like complete BS to me and a cover for them not knowing what to do about it, but, for now we don't test so I don't care!

[Pandora]

We picked up the truck and it seems to be running fine now.  However ....

.... suddenly ....

... the radio volume control knob no longer works.

As an auto mechanic's daughter, I know how these sorts of things often go -- in the engine, for instance.  Replace a part or parts, and the rest of the parts don't know how to act anymore; all the original parts and pieces were broken in together and now there's a new guy in the neighborhood, so, inevitably, the weakest one has a nervous breakdown and gives up the ghost, with the mechanic invariably, wrongfully getting the blame.  (This is the fanciful version; I've taken artistic license.)

But the radio knob?!

I am not a high-maintenance woman; I do not ask for much.

Yes, I know things could be a lot worse, but COME ON!! awready.

[Libertas]

 

(I'm laughing with you!)

 

[John Florida]

We picked up the truck and it seems to be running fine now.  However ....

.... suddenly ....

... the radio volume control knob no longer works.

As an auto mechanic's daughter, I know how these sorts of things often go -- in the engine, for instance.  Replace a part or parts, and the rest of the parts don't know how to act anymore; all the original parts and pieces were broken in together and now there's a new guy in the neighborhood, so, inevitably, the weakest one has a nervous breakdown and gives up the ghost, with the mechanic invariably, wrongfully getting the blame.  (This is the fanciful version; I've taken artistic license.)

But the radio knob?!

I am not a high-maintenance woman; I do not ask for much.

Yes, I know things could be a lot worse, but COME ON!! awready.

  Let me know when you figure that one out.

[Pandora]

Why don't you tell me, if you know the answer, as, you know, like, a Christmas present.

[charlesoakwood]

Is the radio getting juice? 
Does the clock work?
If it's getting juice will the knob turn on the radio
but not control the volume?

[Pandora]

Is the radio getting juice? 
Does the clock work?
If it's getting juice will the knob turn on the radio
but not control the volume?

The clock works, the radio works -- all stations -- just no volume control.

[BigAlSouth]

Can we eliminate sabotage? By You-know-who???