Author Topic: The Economy is Going to Implode  (Read 127811 times)

1 Member and 15 Guests are viewing this topic.

Online patentlymn

  • Conservative Hero
  • ****
  • Posts: 3977
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #800 on: July 21, 2022, 04:58:44 PM »

More of the same from Michael Hudson. How finance, not production, dominates US economy.
https://thesaker.is/finance-capitalisms-self-destructive-nature/

Finance Capitalism’s Self-Destructive Nature
10568 Views July 20, 2022 18 Comments

Posted with Michael Hudson’s permission

Transcript of Interview on The Left Lens with Danny Haiphong May 25th, 2022
...
MICHAEL HUDSON: Well, most people think of all kinds of capitalism as being the same and the assumption is that industrial capitalism of the nineteenth century somehow was always financialized because there were always banks but financial capitalism is you just pointed out is a political system and as a political system it’s very different from the industrial capitalism dynamic. In industrial capitalism, the whole aim or the hope of the industrial capitalists in the late nineteenth century, especially in Germany and central Europe was that banking would no longer be just usury, it wouldn’t be just consumer lending to exploit labor, and it wouldn’t be lending to the government somehow.
...
 
In other words, finance capitalism instead of trying to promote overall economic growth for the 99 percent, instead of financing the industrialization of an economy with rising productivity and rising living standards, is now cannibalizing the industrial sector, cannibalizing the corporate sector. As you’re seeing in the U.S., finance capitalism is the economic doctrine of deindustrialization that has occurred in America in England and is now occurring in Europe.

Well, the problem is how do you survive if you’re not industrializing, if you’re not producing your own means of subsistence and how are you going to get this from other countries? Well, the answer is you don’t go to war with them like countries used to go to war with each other to grab their money and their land, you use finance as the new means of war so finance capitalism is the tactic of economic warfare by the United States against Europe and the global south to sort of draw all of the economic surplus of these countries in the form of debt service and the debt service is supplied by basically economic rent seeking from land rent, natural resource rent,  and just plain interest charges on economy. So, none of these are really the result of industrial profits that are made by employing labor and uh selling its products at a markup.
...
When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #801 on: July 22, 2022, 09:34:32 AM »
Like I said in the PI thread...they/them chose to yield industrial capacity to China and elsewhere...

I blame Kissinger for seducing Nixon...lured him with the China card to wedge them from the Soviets...what cold warrior wouldn't like that...but the payment in silver was surrendering your national security down the river by offshoring your industrial needs to a Communist nation...

It was even easier to seduce those greedy pricks in business...cheap labor...and look at all those new customers...

After that it's all kabuki because your industrial base is not in enemy hands...they have you by the balls...all you can do is rack up debt and fend off with an ever-increasing military complex that is now being morally bankrupted with psychotic woke bullsh*t...

Rome's collapse is going to seem organized and gentle in history books of the future...if anybody is around to write or read them...

H/T-CTH:


« Last Edit: July 22, 2022, 10:19:14 AM by Libertas »
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #802 on: July 27, 2022, 10:11:52 AM »
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/07/consumer-confidence-drops-month-month-home-sales-slide-us-economy-falters-video/

Housing the last to fall here in my neck of the woods...perhaps I need to eject?

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/tomorrow-fed-hikes-75bps-what-happens-next-has-wall-street-hopelessly-split

The worst case, for bulls, is not if the US slides into a recession - after all that will prompt the Fed to panic and unleash the usual liquidity tsunami - it would be if Wilson is right: the Morgan Stanley strategist who has been among the most vocal bears on US stocks and correctly predicted this year’s selloff, said that even though inflation could indeed have peaked “from a rate of change standpoint,” the "demand destructive nature of high inflation that is presenting itself today will not easily disappear even if inflation declines sharply because prices are already out of reach in areas of the economy that are critical for the cycle to extend--i.e. housing, autos, food, gasoline and other necessities."

Snort!  That basket of goods the elites are purposely destroying?!

A recession is noting to fear...continued reign of terror by these SOBs, that is the real problem!

Look  -  https://basedunderground.com/2022/07/27/globalist-takeover-new-sri-lankan-president-uk-pm-candidates-are-world-economic-forum-members/

Just insert the next plug & play despot to stay on script!

So tired of this crap!  Fortunately, I don't think they have much time left before angry peasants are chasing them down...

We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Alphabet Soup

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 5610
  • Hier standt ich. Ich kann nicht anders
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #803 on: July 27, 2022, 05:37:58 PM »
My 401K plan is hemorrhaging value and there doesn't seem to be much I can do to stanch the flow. So I'm researching cashing it out and paying off my mortgage - while there's still some money in the account.

Thank you Bidenomics!

 ::cussing::

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #804 on: July 28, 2022, 09:30:42 AM »
Yeah, a lot of 'em, even ones using big ass outfits with thousands of investment options...limit participation to a couple dozen different funds...unless of course you follow their bait and get a personal brokerage account...then magically everything expands...

 ::cussing::

I shut mine down back during the DemoCommie-stoked summer-of-hate-and-violence...figuring I needed more income for party favors and such...second...maybe third time I've done that...

Safest thing I could park into was  TIPS fund, not perfect...but whatever...

Suckworld gives only suck options....starting to make me want to pull a Claude Raines....

ETA - second straight quarter with negative growth...

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/07/official-second-quarter-gdp-comes-minus-0-9-percent-us-officially-economic-recession-video/

...staglation confirmed.  And DemoCommies put the screws to Manchin and he caved and McConnell threw in the towel (his favorite and only move) on Build Back Broker-than-ever...

...so the suck can only get much worse...
« Last Edit: July 28, 2022, 10:27:01 AM by Libertas »
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Online patentlymn

  • Conservative Hero
  • ****
  • Posts: 3977
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #805 on: July 29, 2022, 12:31:38 PM »

Tucker just nails it. I noticed the same thing. To many people words mean more than reality. He starts with Biden video clip then features all these admin people redefining recession.
"Is reality optional?" - Thomas Sowell
"You can ignore reality but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality." - Ayn Rand
"The New Left-The Anti-Intellectual Revolution"-book title by Ayn Rand

https://youtu.be/2TdRdn6BqrA

 Tucker Carlson: It turns out we're insane
774,864 views  Jul 28, 2022  Fox News host Tucker Carlson rips President Biden for denying the United States is in a recession despite what economists say on 'Tucker Carlson Tonight.'
When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown

Online Pandora

  • Administrator
  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 19529
  • I iz also makin a list. U on it pal.
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #806 on: July 29, 2022, 09:26:50 PM »

More of the same from Michael Hudson. How finance, not production, dominates US economy.
https://thesaker.is/finance-capitalisms-self-destructive-nature/

Finance Capitalism’s Self-Destructive Nature
10568 Views July 20, 2022 18 Comments

Posted with Michael Hudson’s permission

Transcript of Interview on The Left Lens with Danny Haiphong May 25th, 2022
...
MICHAEL HUDSON: Well, most people think of all kinds of capitalism as being the same and the assumption is that industrial capitalism of the nineteenth century somehow was always financialized because there were always banks but financial capitalism is you just pointed out is a political system and as a political system it’s very different from the industrial capitalism dynamic. In industrial capitalism, the whole aim or the hope of the industrial capitalists in the late nineteenth century, especially in Germany and central Europe was that banking would no longer be just usury, it wouldn’t be just consumer lending to exploit labor, and it wouldn’t be lending to the government somehow.
...
 
In other words, finance capitalism instead of trying to promote overall economic growth for the 99 percent, instead of financing the industrialization of an economy with rising productivity and rising living standards, is now cannibalizing the industrial sector, cannibalizing the corporate sector. As you’re seeing in the U.S., finance capitalism is the economic doctrine of deindustrialization that has occurred in America in England and is now occurring in Europe.

Well, the problem is how do you survive if you’re not industrializing, if you’re not producing your own means of subsistence and how are you going to get this from other countries? Well, the answer is you don’t go to war with them like countries used to go to war with each other to grab their money and their land, you use finance as the new means of war so finance capitalism is the tactic of economic warfare by the United States against Europe and the global south to sort of draw all of the economic surplus of these countries in the form of debt service and the debt service is supplied by basically economic rent seeking from land rent, natural resource rent,  and just plain interest charges on economy. So, none of these are really the result of industrial profits that are made by employing labor and uh selling its products at a markup.
...

I read most of this today.  From what I understand, Hudson is advocating for socialism .....as most of us don't understand what socialism really is.

Do I have that right
"Under certain circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer." - Mark Twain

"Let us assume for the moment everything you say about me is true. That just makes your problem bigger, doesn't it?"

Online patentlymn

  • Conservative Hero
  • ****
  • Posts: 3977
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #807 on: July 30, 2022, 08:11:35 AM »

More of the same from Michael Hudson. How finance, not production, dominates US economy.
https://thesaker.is/finance-capitalisms-self-destructive-nature/

Finance Capitalism’s Self-Destructive Nature
10568 Views July 20, 2022 18 Comments

Posted with Michael Hudson’s permission

Transcript of Interview on The Left Lens with Danny Haiphong May 25th, 2022
...
MICHAEL HUDSON: Well, most people think of all kinds of capitalism as being the same and the assumption is that industrial capitalism of the nineteenth century somehow was always financialized because there were always banks but financial capitalism is you just pointed out is a political system and as a political system it’s very different from the industrial capitalism dynamic. In industrial capitalism, the whole aim or the hope of the industrial capitalists in the late nineteenth century, especially in Germany and central Europe was that banking would no longer be just usury, it wouldn’t be just consumer lending to exploit labor, and it wouldn’t be lending to the government somehow.
...
 
In other words, finance capitalism instead of trying to promote overall economic growth for the 99 percent, instead of financing the industrialization of an economy with rising productivity and rising living standards, is now cannibalizing the industrial sector, cannibalizing the corporate sector. As you’re seeing in the U.S., finance capitalism is the economic doctrine of deindustrialization that has occurred in America in England and is now occurring in Europe.

Well, the problem is how do you survive if you’re not industrializing, if you’re not producing your own means of subsistence and how are you going to get this from other countries? Well, the answer is you don’t go to war with them like countries used to go to war with each other to grab their money and their land, you use finance as the new means of war so finance capitalism is the tactic of economic warfare by the United States against Europe and the global south to sort of draw all of the economic surplus of these countries in the form of debt service and the debt service is supplied by basically economic rent seeking from land rent, natural resource rent,  and just plain interest charges on economy. So, none of these are really the result of industrial profits that are made by employing labor and uh selling its products at a markup.
...

I read most of this today.  From what I understand, Hudson is advocating for socialism .....as most of us don't understand what socialism really is.

Do I have that right

I do not know what Michael Hudson is advocating. I have never heard him lay out any plans.
I recall he may have advocated a tax on land but am not sure.
I do not believe he has some secret subversive plan up his sleeve.
I do know he has visited some countries including China and they listen to him.
He believes that China, and maybe Russia(?) have taken steps to prevent the financial interests from taking over the govt. That means internal AND foreign financial interests. Financial globalists want into those countries.

From memory, he has described how the rich avoid paying taxes by taking out loans against capital???? He can go into great detail.

Socialism? If we had capitalism in this country all the major Wall Street big banks would have been wiped out in 2008, with Goldman Sachs being the last one to go. NN Taleb said that in France the govt took over the banks but in the US the banks took over the govt.

It would be a mistake to call him nasty names until you have paid a lot of attention. He mentioned once how he quit some place because it was a bunch of left wing flakes. Some low rent places he spoke at had lefty posters on the wall, like Marx or Lenin, but I would not put much weight in that. He worked for Citibank, Standard Oil, etc. .

If you have the time, there is a video below where describes his interesting life. I watched this more than once. He has other videos.

https://youtu.be/hH9pzzIIEj4
 Michael Hudson - Life and Thought 20180507
83,052 views  Jul 11, 2018  The interview with Professor Michael Hudson was conducted on 7 May 2018 in Beijing, by Professor Lau Kin Chi and Professor Sit Tsui Jade.

He is big into Vol 3 of Marx's Capital, whatever that means. He says no one reads that volume.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2022, 08:15:36 AM by patentlymn »
When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown

Online patentlymn

  • Conservative Hero
  • ****
  • Posts: 3977
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #808 on: July 30, 2022, 09:09:46 AM »
I did not mean to say that you were calling Michael Hudson nasty names BTW.
I found myself waiting for him to say something which would reveal he was a commie but was disguising or hiding it. I never found that.

He describes in detail how he understands the financial world works.
I read some of his books a while back.
One big idea of his is that incomes cannot keep up with the compound interest of debts so there has to be a crash or rest of some sort.

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=michael+hudson&i=stripbooks&crid=6PKBSMU7DYDV&sprefix=michael+hudson%2Cstripbooks%2C144&ref=nb_sb_noss_1
« Last Edit: July 30, 2022, 11:46:09 AM by patentlymn »
When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #809 on: August 01, 2022, 09:26:16 AM »
"I do know he has visited some countries including China and they listen to him."

So he advocated for the thuggish response to the mortgage rebels?

It's so funny watching Communists use the conveniences of capitalism but only so far as it does not threaten The Party and its leadership.

If this mortgage rebellion expands...those red devils could find themselves in a position where they either have to capitulate to peasant demands or slaughter millions of them...we know Mao and his early heirs favored the latter...Xi has in the past with Uyghurs and rebellious covid-captives in Shanghai et al...
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Online patentlymn

  • Conservative Hero
  • ****
  • Posts: 3977
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #810 on: August 01, 2022, 11:27:57 AM »
"I do know he has visited some countries including China and they listen to him."

So he advocated for the thuggish response to the mortgage rebels?

It's so funny watching Communists use the conveniences of capitalism but only so far as it does not threaten The Party and its leadership.

If this mortgage rebellion expands...those red devils could find themselves in a position where they either have to capitulate to peasant demands or slaughter millions of them...we know Mao and his early heirs favored the latter...Xi has in the past with Uyghurs and rebellious covid-captives in Shanghai et al...

No he did not do that. I am always on guard for closet pinkos to say something that reveals them as leftists.
He has not said anything like that. He is quite the scholar and spent most of his professional life advising large corporations and banks. It would be wrong to view him as a flaky leftist.

I read a few books by him. It is a complicated subject and I do not understand international finance stuff.
In short, with the current tax code and laws financial interests will own almost everything. This could be changed but that is unlikely as finance controls the US govt. Finance says this is just capitalism. He says it is finance capitalism not industrial capitalism.
When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #811 on: August 01, 2022, 11:37:54 AM »
"I do know he has visited some countries including China and they listen to him."

So he advocated for the thuggish response to the mortgage rebels?

It's so funny watching Communists use the conveniences of capitalism but only so far as it does not threaten The Party and its leadership.

If this mortgage rebellion expands...those red devils could find themselves in a position where they either have to capitulate to peasant demands or slaughter millions of them...we know Mao and his early heirs favored the latter...Xi has in the past with Uyghurs and rebellious covid-captives in Shanghai et al...

No he did not do that. I am always on guard for closet pinkos to say something that reveals them as leftists.
He has not said anything like that. He is quite the scholar and spent most of his professional life advising large corporations and banks. It would be wrong to view him as a flaky leftist.

I read a few books by him. It is a complicated subject and I do not understand international finance stuff.
In short, with the current tax code and laws financial interests will own almost everything. This could be changed but that is unlikely as finance controls the US govt. Finance says this is just capitalism. He says it is finance capitalism not industrial capitalism.

Yeah, I know what he is saying...and despite what he may not want to admit...there is the implication in what he is saying..."finance capitalism" for the elite vs the people compared to the "industrial capitalist" for the people vs the elite...has a (not liking the word) "democracy" versus socialist implication that is not even correct because the elite in socialist (especially) communist nations fleece the people quite well...and in the communist/fascist totalitarian states have the added benefit of employing physical violence to ensure the orders of the elite are obeyed.  It's a mixing of terms that is at best oxymoronic and at worst disingenuous and deceptive...I reckon if someone tried to pin him down on it he would rationalize out of it...

Easy test...trying to convince me the Communist Chinese have better government and business models will not fly...no matter how effective they may be vs the competition that is largely assisting them by killing themselves...
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #812 on: August 03, 2022, 07:44:54 AM »


H/T-WRSA@GAB
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #813 on: August 08, 2022, 11:49:48 AM »

H/T-CTH
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #814 on: August 08, 2022, 12:05:15 PM »
A new variant of the original contagion of socialism...like [ur=]https://www.zerohedge.com/political/revolution-has-begun-75000-brits-stop-paying-power-bills-amid-inflation-storm]the Chi-Com mortgage rebellion[/url]...this time in the UK...

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/revolution-has-begun-75000-brits-stop-paying-power-bills-amid-inflation-storm

The spread of rebellion to statist insanity wherever it is IMO is not a bad thing...especially since they all really got it coming!

This should help jump-start rage here...

The latest in porkulus mainly benefiting the well-heeled vs everybody else...

Winners:

*Wealthy (The get the rich campaign was a hoax)
*Private equity fund managers (Loophole protection assured)
*Manchin & Sinema (un-green pork)
*IRS (Add'l $80B and 87k more agents to go after the 99%)
*Green (Marxists)
*Medicare (Obamacare premium hikes punted out 3 years)

Losers:
*Everybody not in the above

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/here-are-winners-and-losers-inflation-reduction-act
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #815 on: August 13, 2022, 01:05:48 PM »
Getting closer to the SHTF moment...

https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/its-game-over-fed-expect-monetary-rug-pull-soon

Of course they cornered...they had to corner themselves...the BigGov DemoCommies and Cucks spent us into Hell, and the Fed gets to hold the bag as it all goes to sh*t!

Goodbye currency, goodbye personal wealth held in (dis)trust outside your direct physical control...

Don't have Au/Ag or other barterables on hand?  You're a goner...

Literally, the elite will have no use for you...

https://anonymouswire.com/wef-advisor-common-people-should-live-in-fear-we-dont-need-the-vast-majority-of-you/

...you are expected to perish quietly...
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #816 on: August 15, 2022, 08:40:29 AM »
Netflix, TikTok...PayPal(istine)...

https://www.zerohedge.com/personal-finance/war-world-economy-spark-mass-tech-layoffs

...if they're trying to make me care about the DemoCommie/Cuck economic sh!tshow's destruction of jobs...listing leftist orgs probably going to generate only a derisive snort...
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #817 on: September 09, 2022, 08:59:35 AM »
https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/fed-about-start-losing-money-what-does-mean

It means business as usual...from the corner in which they put themselves in long long ago...
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #818 on: September 13, 2022, 08:35:57 AM »
27th straight month of the corrupt government unable to game & hide rising inflation...

https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/us-consumer-prices-blow-away-expectations-rise-27th-straight-month

...nothing (new) to see here. move along, slave!

JoeFlation sweeping the nation...
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.

Offline Libertas

  • Conservative Superhero
  • *****
  • Posts: 64006
  • Alea iacta est! Libertatem aut mori!
Re: The Economy is Going to Implode
« Reply #819 on: September 15, 2022, 08:59:47 AM »
https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/peter-schiff-fed-spitting-wind

I like Peter, blessed with a healthy dose of common sense.  But the Fed may have officially sold it's soul in 2008...but the seeds go back further...like to 1913 and everything that followed leading up to the installation of the Halfrican bi-sexual closet Muslim Marxist POS.

H/T-CTH

The corner they put themselves into will be their and our demise.  The cannot stop easy money, they cannot raise rates sufficiently enough to offset increasing inflation and they cannot to both at the same time...and they cannot monetize the entire national debt that is about to eclipse $31 trillion without rendering the dollar worthless.  They would need to confiscate the entire wealth of every citizen in the nation and every corporation to wipe that out.  This is what totally screwed looks like.


https://theconservativetreehouse.com/blog/2022/09/14/bidenomics-august-2022-inflation-data-infographic/


Production seems to be fading at a time when the (temporarily financially beneficial for wholesaler's) inventories finish their purge and when shipping has virtually stopped...the coming shortages ensure all other things being equal inflation is far from over, but all other things are not equal...and with the worlds war machines gearing up...the coming several months look pretty awful.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/half-americans-think-us-will-no-longer-be-global-superpower-within-ten-years-new-poll

10 years looks wildly optimistic.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2022, 09:59:05 AM by Libertas »
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.