Topic: Secession Petitions

[trapeze]

I own property in Texas so I am all for secession but there is no way that I would put my name to any WH database. No way do I want this admin to be aware of my name.

[Weisshaupt]

I own property in Texas so I am all for secession but there is no way that I would put my name to any WH database. No way do I want this admin to be aware of my name.

They already know about you Trap. All about you. What you have bought. What you read. Where you live.
Plus you don't need to make it easy.  My WH login is under the "special" email account - the petition site was only an attempt to get addresses for Organizing for America anyway, and like all Obama websites, there is 0 verification  that you are who you say they are.  Set up  a fake email using the ialproxy site and and then use the proxy to access the Whitehouse.  It will at least make them work for the info.  But seriously, they don't need the petition list to find you, and label you a threat. Any GOP registration at any point in your past will be proof enough that you are a threat.  Any of your on line posts prove you are a threat, and they can back track your login here as easily as they can do it via the method above.

Conservatives are the new Jew - There is already a petition to strip anyone who signed the succession petitions of their citizenship - retroactively of course. Liberals don't understand or care about ex-post-facto, rule of law or justice. They vote for revenge. They have been told all of their lives that you and people like you are the reason they don't live on the Beach in a mansion, and that rhetoric is only going to increase.  They ARE going to call for us to wear the equivalent of a "Star of David"  - just this time via bar coding or RFID tagging. They are going to start killing us by the millions. They have no choice if they want to achieve their agenda.   We are the 10-15 million (now 30 Million) Bill Ayers claimed would have to be liquidated as people who won't accept the new regime.  Obama called us "Bitter Clingers" for a reason, and his handlers have every intent of using every means at their disposal to silence us: Re-education or death.  Petraeus was obviously not loyal, or loyal enough. He is being removed, as are others, and they will be replaced with people on board with the agenda.  we have time still, and they don't as they have to execute this at or during the collapse, and we are awake, armed and ready. Its not a foregone conclusion, but this is the only place it can go now ..

[Glock32]

All 50 states have a petition going now.  It is what it is, a protest statement.

http://dailycaller.com/2012/11/14/white-house-secede-petitions-reach-660000-signatures-50-state-participation/

Oh, BTW, Perry is a pussy!  There, somebody had to say it.  Can't wait to hear Beck kiss his ass this morning...

That's just one of the reasons I'm leaning away from Texas and more towards TN right now.  That, and the fact that Texas is becoming less and less White.

That's my problem with it as well. Its proximity to Mexico is its undoing. Already there is speculation that it will become a blue state in the Electoral College within about 10-15 years (of course, those time scales are now officially meaningless).

[Weisshaupt]

That's my problem with it as well. Its proximity to Mexico is its undoing. Already there is speculation that it will become a blue state in the Electoral College within about 10-15 years (of course, those time scales are now officially meaningless).

After Amnesty and more Obama advertisement for Food Stamps in Mexico, it will be Blue next year. Its gonna be a rough ride no matter where you decide to go. The balance of power in the world is shifting, and all of western civilization is under attack. NZ/AU and the Pacific is going to become a protectorate of China, Europe will be split up between Russia and the new Caliphate ( and there will be one - and it will look just like the last one in every way)  who will probably establish an uneasy truce (Russia is still a West-Civ nation in many respects)  Mexico will become a Warlord based Feudal system, and they will start to expand their effective territory into the US ( Its already happening)  Canada came about too late, and will be left to fend for herself with inadequate resources, and will be forced to play the parties off each other.  If Obama fails to consolidate the country militarily under a totalitarian dictatorship (Oh sorry, One Party Democracy) a balkanization  will occur. California will become a protectorate of China. The East Coast will fall under Russian influence, and "Fly Over country"  will be the last bastion of freedom  if it survives the breakup,  and be - "flanked on both sides"  ( as Barnhardt says) - and our only hope will be reconquering  one or both coasts my military force.  Or fly-over country  may just end up another collection of militias and warlords.

None of that is set in stone, and WWIII may bring some dramatic shifts in allegiance , depopulate whole areas with Nukes, and change the final outcome. However, I don't think there is any place on earth you will be able to go and "sit this one out"  unless you really he huge piles of cash and are connected with the right people.

[Libertas]

I own property in Texas so I am all for secession but there is no way that I would put my name to any WH database. No way do I want this admin to be aware of my name.

They already know about you Trap. All about you. What you have bought. What you read. Where you live.
Plus you don't need to make it easy.  My WH login is under the "special" email account - the petition site was only an attempt to get addresses for Organizing for America anyway, and like all Obama websites, there is 0 verification  that you are who you say they are.  Set up  a fake email using the ialproxy site and and then use the proxy to access the Whitehouse.  It will at least make them work for the info.  But seriously, they don't need the petition list to find you, and label you a threat. Any GOP registration at any point in your past will be proof enough that you are a threat.  Any of your on line posts prove you are a threat, and they can back track your login here as easily as they can do it via the method above.

Conservatives are the new Jew - There is already a petition to strip anyone who signed the succession petitions of their citizenship - retroactively of course. Liberals don't understand or care about ex-post-facto, rule of law or justice. They vote for revenge. They have been told all of their lives that you and people like you are the reason they don't live on the Beach in a mansion, and that rhetoric is only going to increase.  They ARE going to call for us to wear the equivalent of a "Star of David"  - just this time via bar coding or RFID tagging. They are going to start killing us by the millions. They have no choice if they want to achieve their agenda.   We are the 10-15 million (now 30 Million) Bill Ayers claimed would have to be liquidated as people who won't accept the new regime.  Obama called us "Bitter Clingers" for a reason, and his handlers have every intent of using every means at their disposal to silence us: Re-education or death.  Petraeus was obviously not loyal, or loyal enough. He is being removed, as are others, and they will be replaced with people on board with the agenda.  we have time still, and they don't as they have to execute this at or during the collapse, and we are awake, armed and ready. Its not a foregone conclusion, but this is the only place it can go now ..

I'm looking hard for an area of disagreement and I am coming up empty.

[Libertas]

That's my problem with it as well. Its proximity to Mexico is its undoing. Already there is speculation that it will become a blue state in the Electoral College within about 10-15 years (of course, those time scales are now officially meaningless).

After Amnesty and more Obama advertisement for Food Stamps in Mexico, it will be Blue next year. Its gonna be a rough ride no matter where you decide to go. The balance of power in the world is shifting, and all of western civilization is under attack. NZ/AU and the Pacific is going to become a protectorate of China, Europe will be split up between Russia and the new Caliphate ( and there will be one - and it will look just like the last one in every way)  who will probably establish an uneasy truce (Russia is still a West-Civ nation in many respects)  Mexico will become a Warlord based Feudal system, and they will start to expand their effective territory into the US ( Its already happening)  Canada came about too late, and will be left to fend for herself with inadequate resources, and will be forced to play the parties off each other.  If Obama fails to consolidate the country militarily under a totalitarian dictatorship (Oh sorry, One Party Democracy) a balkanization  will occur. California will become a protectorate of China. The East Coast will fall under Russian influence, and "Fly Over country"  will be the last bastion of freedom  if it survives the breakup,  and be - "flanked on both sides"  ( as Barnhardt says) - and our only hope will be reconquering  one or both coasts my military force.  Or fly-over country  may just end up another collection of militias and warlords.

None of that is set in stone, and WWIII may bring some dramatic shifts in allegiance , depopulate whole areas with Nukes, and change the final outcome. However, I don't think there is any place on earth you will be able to go and "sit this one out"  unless you really he huge piles of cash and are connected with the right people.

And you have a secret base deep in the ground in Antarctica.

[Libertas]

I heard Beck bloviating on how great TX is and how great their nullification efforts are and that this is the way to fight, not sign petitions and let the govt know who we are (that latter part debunked well by Weisshaupt above)...God Bless him he does a good job on educating people and gets it 90-95% right, but that other 5-10% will get people killed!  He still thinks there is a country that will survive, that nice will suffice and violence isn't inevitable...drives me freakin' nuts with that shyt!

ETA - Here he is...

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/heres-why-glenn-beck-says-to-stop-all-those-secession-petitions-are-you-out-of-your-mind/

Discard the "don't sign the petition" nonsense, the rest is vintage Beck trying to have it both ways.

First, assuming you are right Mr. Beck and the Feds come after you once they learn who you are by signing this petition...how does this NOT lead to Civil War?

Second, secession is settled...OK, lets say you are (like Scalia) right again (see link below)...then why if Obama is not as bad as you fear, which you state above, is there any cause for harm or fear?  You say the Constitution is not a suicide pact but then agree that it has become that since secession has been romoved from the realm of the possible, so your answer is...no to Civil War, no to violence of any sort but blind faith in people to be nice and do the right thing in the end? 

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/there-is-no-right-to-secede-see-the-letter-where-justice-scalia-shoots-down-idea-of-leaving-the-union/

Third, you say "“If the government begins arming itself against the citizens at the federal level, and say ‘by the way, we’re your new state police,’ that would indeed be the point in the course of human events where it becomes necessary to dissolve political bands,"...umm, you think we are not there already?

And lastly - You say  " 'secession is not an option,' and so it is up to you to contact your governor, find out what your kids are learning, and change the media.  Because the next step isn’t going to be easy."...Really?

What if my Governor is a complete statist asshat like Obama?  Same for the entire legislature!  Don't you know what our kids are learning?  You think the public schools can be reformed before the crap hits the fan?  You think you have time to change the media?!  Hilarious!  You back on the sauce?  The next step will not be easy, you got that right, but you got a lot wrong about what to do about it!

PS-Pull those stupid "food insurance" commercials, they are embarassing!  The best food insurance is your own food!

 

Idiot!

 

[charlesoakwood]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

[Libertas]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

Cowardice.

[Pandora]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

Cowardice.

I dunno, Libertas.  Mark Levin has been treading a very fine line himself since the election; I think they all are.

[Libertas]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

Cowardice.

I dunno, Libertas.  Mark Levin has been treading a very fine line himself since the election; I think they all are.

I am not arguing against nuance, but avoiding the discussion helps...who?  The enemy?

[Glock32]

Armed conflict is inevitable. And secession is a right. Doesn't matter what Justice Scalia or anyone else says about it. You cannot say that government derives its legitimacy from the consent of the governed, and then on the other hand say there is no right to secession. What is secession but the governed withdrawing their consent to be governed? This country was founded in an act of secession.

But as I have argued before, I think secession is a red herring. I don't see it happening, nor do I see it being necessary. We are experiencing balkanization in the culture, so political dissolution will follow in due course.

The entire universe favors stable, low energy configurations. Volatile chemical compounds will release enormous amounts of energy to achieve a more stable configuration of separate compounds. I see human events in the same way. Right now we have crammed together different elements into high energy, uneasy state. The inexorable tendency is to a low energy state, and it will happen.

[Pandora]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

Cowardice.

I dunno, Libertas.  Mark Levin has been treading a very fine line himself since the election; I think they all are.

I am not arguing against nuance, but avoiding the discussion helps...who?  The enemy?

I get what you're saying, but who is helped when the FCC shuts down both Beck and Levin because they allowed a discussion of this type?

[Weisshaupt]

First, assuming you are right Mr. Beck and the Feds come after you once they learn who you are by signing this petition...how does this NOT lead to Civil War?

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

If they come after you for petitioning to leave the union, you have every right to resist.

[RickZ]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

Cowardice.

I dunno, Libertas.  Mark Levin has been treading a very fine line himself since the election; I think they all are.

As I said at another place, I went to the doctor's yesterday and I noticed a dangerous trend among the staff not to be open with me about the election, choosing self-censorship as they were afraid to upset the wrong people.  I don't do self-censorshp very well.

[Libertas]

Armed conflict is inevitable. And secession is a right. Doesn't matter what Justice Scalia or anyone else says about it. You cannot say that government derives its legitimacy from the consent of the governed, and then on the other hand say there is no right to secession. What is secession but the governed withdrawing their consent to be governed? This country was founded in an act of secession.

But as I have argued before, I think secession is a red herring. I don't see it happening, nor do I see it being necessary. We are experiencing balkanization in the culture, so political dissolution will follow in due course.

The entire universe favors stable, low energy configurations. Volatile chemical compounds will release enormous amounts of energy to achieve a more stable configuration of separate compounds. I see human events in the same way. Right now we have crammed together different elements into high energy, uneasy state. The inexorable tendency is to a low energy state, and it will happen.

Yup.  Right, wrong or indifferent we are condemned to respond to events, there is no interest in logically addressing core issues and choose a less unstable course, people will only act reflexively one way or another.  If that doesn't spell chaos I son't knwo what does.  So ignoring reality continues to be the default position.

[Libertas]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

Cowardice.

I dunno, Libertas.  Mark Levin has been treading a very fine line himself since the election; I think they all are.

I am not arguing against nuance, but avoiding the discussion helps...who?  The enemy?

I get what you're saying, but who is helped when the FCC shuts down both Beck and Levin because they allowed a discussion of this type?

Are more not harmed by ceding authority to the statists aims we profess to be against our nature and our Founding principles?  If we agree to censor ourselves we are in effect agreeing to the position of the government being the sole arbiter of everyones fate.  Plus, I would prefer they make the first overt act of open treason, let them be dictators, let them be thugs.

[Libertas]

First, assuming you are right Mr. Beck and the Feds come after you once they learn who you are by signing this petition...how does this NOT lead to Civil War?

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

If they come after you for petitioning to leave the union, you have every right to resist.

Amen.

[Libertas]

Talk of inevitable armed conflict would achieve little and would have the Fed on him like a duck on a June-bug.

Cowardice.

I dunno, Libertas.  Mark Levin has been treading a very fine line himself since the election; I think they all are.

As I said at another place, I went to the doctor's yesterday and I noticed a dangerous trend among the staff not to be open with me about the election, choosing self-censorship as they were afraid to upset the wrong people.  I don't do self-censorshp very well.

Choosing to accept the yoke of tyranny is not a choice I will make.