Topic: Amash amendment to restrict NSA powers fails by 12-vote margin in House

[Pandora]

Speaking against the bill on the floor, Reps. Michelle Bachmann ....

.... who seems woefully misinformed about what the NSA is collecting -- not telephone call content, she says.  But they are doing just that, even if they're not listening to every call at this time.

[Weisshaupt]

Speaking against the bill on the floor, Reps. Michelle Bachmann ....

.... who seems woefully misinformed about what the NSA is collecting -- not telephone call content, she says.  But they are doing just that, even if they're not listening to every call at this time.

More GOP voted to keep the NSA spying than voted against, despite its pretty much been proven that the program is being used to blackmail and otherwise harass conservatives and elected representatives.  Another reason the GOP is dead. They have betrayed us for the last time, and really there is no hope of restoring the country via the political process anyway. They will get a war, a collapse, or both.  The liberals best case scenario is poverty spread equally in a "Utopian" police state. And then they will use votes like this to pretend conservatives wanted it that way.

[Dan]

I'm not sure, even with all the r's vave already done to prove their irrelevance and betrayal, there's anything that could have led me to despise them as much as I do now.

[Glock32]

And here's a fitting piece of news to follow up on this congressional betrayal:

The U.S. government has demanded that major Internet companies divulge users' stored passwords, according to two industry sources familiar with these orders, which represent an escalation in surveillance techniques that has not previously been disclosed.

If the government is able to determine a person's password, which is typically stored in encrypted form, the credential could be used to log in to an account to peruse confidential correspondence or even impersonate the user. Obtaining it also would aid in deciphering encrypted devices in situations where passwords are reused.

"I've certainly seen them ask for passwords," said one Internet industry source who spoke on condition of anonymity. "We push back."

A second person who has worked at a large Silicon Valley company confirmed that it received legal requests from the federal government for stored passwords. Companies "really heavily scrutinize" these requests, the person said. "There's a lot of 'over my dead body.'"

Some of the government orders demand not only a user's password but also the encryption algorithm and the so-called salt, according to a person familiar with the requests. A salt is a random string of letters or numbers used to make it more difficult to reverse the encryption process and determine the original password. Other orders demand the secret question codes often associated with user accounts.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-57595529-38/feds-tell-web-firms-to-turn-over-user-account-passwords/


Perhaps somebody needs to clue in Michele Bachmann that, yes, they very much are hoovering content if they're now demanding your freakin' passwords. This government is absolutely out. of. control. We have no representation. No political mechanism for putting restraints on the state. The government is now like the belligerent drunkard who just randomly swings punches wildly in all directions.

I mean damn. We've just had a month of revelations about the massive scale of this police state, and this Congress fails to put any sort of restrictions on it. This government is a malignant cancer.

[Pandora]

To say I don't understand them at all is an understatement.  Clapper et. al. made it clear Congress' data is being hoovered as well, which is partly what kick-started their outrage.  But enough of them voted against the Amash amendment to kill it.

Maybe they've been gotten to already.  If Bachman has, she's a damn good actress, because I heard a piece of her floor speech and the people she was criticizing was US for wanting the NSA restricted.

[Glock32]

If people want to know why we should have statutory term limits, that's why. Politicians who become long term fixtures also accumulate dirt and skeletons in their closets, making them increasingly vulnerable to control. If the place is a revolving door like it should be, it would be harder for a Congress of short timers to be "gotten to".

[Libertas]

We have already documented here the NSA has admitted it is collecting more than the nebulous and innocent-sounding "metadata"...I think Bachmann has some lingering detritus from a time when Conservatives believed in law and order blindly, a time when it was unthinkable that bureaucrats and unelected executive leadership would actively threaten our civil rights and target US, a time when political leaders would not think of crossing the line for fear of arousing public anger.  Being so naive and dismissive of our concerns given all that has come to light is especially disappointing.  Michelle is typically not this deferential to government power and this clueless to the sentiment of the people she represents...I cannot help but think she might have been gotten to...I dunno...I don't get it.  If she has other political intentions we'll have to see how this vote plays out.  I might drop her an email and ask wtf?  I may get an honest response...likely I may just get a wonkish canned statement.

I'd like to think you're right on limits G, worth a shot even though I suspect horsetrading will never be fully expunged.  I'd be for banning lobbyists from running for office until 10 years have passed and banning them from entering any government facility uninvited (invitations at committee not member request) and a ban on any officeholder from being a lobbyist for 10 years following their departure.  I'd also ban all officeholder perks, move to biennial sessions, ban all recess appointments and make Senate confirmations obtain 2/3 support not a simple majority.  All legislative games should end too, bills should be clean and sans riders and amendments not specifically related to the bill.  There needs to be a general clearing of the books as well, removing obsolete laws from the books and streamlining what is left...and agencies should have no power to issue regulations...especially if in violation of legislative intent.

Well that's all a fricken pipedream...it won't stand a snowballs chance in Hell...not until we rebuild from the ashes that is...if anybody survives...

[Glock32]

That's why I'd also like a Constitutional amendment mandating that all laws passed by Congress have automatic sunset provisions. Congress should be spending 90% of its time reviewing existing laws rather than passing new ones.

They're also in session too much. They're just looking for something to screw with, constantly.

[IronDioPriest]

The government secretly wiretaps the Watergate Hotel, and it brings down a presidency.
The government secretly wiretaps the entire nation, and congress sanctions it.

Dangerous times.

[Libertas]

I sent an email to Bachmann, I'll let everyone know what the response is.  I am not expecting much.

I need a palate cleanser, something to break out of my funk...think I'll clean and oil my long guns.

[IronDioPriest]

I sent an email to Bachmann, I'll let everyone know what the response is.  I am not expecting much.

I need a palate cleanser, something to break out of my funk...think I'll clean and oil my long guns.

I think she's a George W. Bush "War on Terra" Republican. To Bachmann, the evil of Islam is worth fighting at all cost, including the cost of privacy, liberty, and constitutional violation. When it comes to Islam and terra, she sees the constitution as shades of grey.

[Glock32]

We have already documented here the NSA has admitted it is collecting more than the nebulous and innocent-sounding "metadata"...I think Bachmann has some lingering detritus from a time when Conservatives believed in law and order blindly

I think this is exactly the case, for her and most of the other conservatives who voted against the bill. It's really a bit of a problem, and it links back into the argument I've made that the Left is a cultural virus that commandeers the institutions of the infected society, repurposing them for itself. The problem is when people can't get past the historical veneration they grant to these institutions. How long must we be ridden roughshod by these formerly-decent institutions before people will accept that they've been taken over by enemy operatives?

[Libertas]

We have already documented here the NSA has admitted it is collecting more than the nebulous and innocent-sounding "metadata"...I think Bachmann has some lingering detritus from a time when Conservatives believed in law and order blindly

I think this is exactly the case, for her and most of the other conservatives who voted against the bill. It's really a bit of a problem, and it links back into the argument I've made that the Left is a cultural virus that commandeers the institutions of the infected society, repurposing them for itself. The problem is when people can't get past the historical veneration they grant to these institutions. How long must we be ridden roughshod by these formerly-decent institutions before people will accept that they've been taken over by enemy operatives?

Not until Order 66 is issued.  Of course that means lots of crying, screaming and dying.  Seems unavoidable though...

[warpmine]

Why is it that  nobody will just come out and say it, the reason we're sitting ducks for the Muslims it is in fact our lax policy of letting them in to begin with. It's just that f**king simple, reverse the nightmare or live in fear under constant tyranny becasue the freaking sh*theads in government plays political correctness on a world stage claiming tolerance for all, even the damned demon worshipers of Mohammad. What really gets me is just how obvious it is to anyone with half a functioning brain.

[Pandora]

It is not PC that the government keeps bringing them in; they're very useful tools.

[IronDioPriest]

It is not PC that the government keeps bringing them in; they're very useful tools.

Political correctness provides both the veneer of justification, and the weapon against their opposition.

[Glock32]

If we may continue with the virus analogy a bit, Leftism is like AIDS in an entire civilization. It destroys the civilization's ability to defend itself, so opportunistic little secondary infections wreak havoc in ways they would never have been able to in a healthy civilization. The Islamofascists are one such.

[Libertas]

A virus can either burn itself out or be killed with the proper compounds.  The former will consume all, the latter is more targeted.  Our Leftists will let everyone die before they admit error.  Just like with everything else it falls to the rest of us to solve.