Author Topic: lost generations  (Read 3308 times)

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Offline whimsicalmamapig

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lost generations
« on: September 08, 2013, 11:18:29 AM »
Am I alone in feeling that we have created, through our education systems and entertainment industries, several generations of young people who have little to no understanding of what this country was founded on and what made it great. In dealing with young people I am always amazed at the large amount of misinformation that they possess and how they are almost totally unaware of their ignorance but feel totally informed and correct in all of their views and lifestyles choices?

Not only is there a lack of humility on their part, but they have been inculcated with the idea that they are "special" and their opinions have merit simply because they hold them, not because they are the product of sound research and understanding. These are the new voters and they approach our government unaware of its foundation and principals and rely mostly on the progressive agenda which has been driven into their heads through both the public schools and our university systems.

Many are very unaware of the basics of American history and civics. I am astounded as to how much of our history has been edited from the curriculum, yet we encourage them to vote while they do not have a good grasp on what elections are about. What would it take to "re-adjust" the understanding of these young people as to the realities of the world or is this just an impossible task.
Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
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Re: lost generations
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2013, 11:28:51 AM »
Quote
.... almost totally unaware of their ignorance but feel totally informed and correct  ...

Operative word "feel".

There's the problem.
"Under certain circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer." - Mark Twain

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Offline Glock32

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2013, 11:33:11 AM »
Welcome to the forum.  You are absolutely correct in your observations. There is nothing worse, or more dangerous, than that terrible combination of ignorance and arrogance. They're dumber than any previous generation, while simultaneously convinced that they're the most sophisticated.

I hesitate to say dumber, because I'm not sure if their cognitive hardware is any worse than previous generations', so maybe it's just ignorance. For sure they've been given some very faulty software by the education system, all by design too.
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Offline whimsicalmamapig

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2013, 12:25:46 PM »
as I observe my own grown children trying to carry on the family business, I am frightened for their future knowing that government will only grow larger and taxes grow greater to feed the every want and believed need of these young people.

They have been denied the information to make rational choices, and I am afraid that this was a purposeful attempt to keep them docile and willing supporters of whatever legislation the left proffers to them.

They don't seem to understand that we are guaranteed the right to the pursuit of happiness, not the right to be happy. They totally believe that their government has the right and the ability to fulfill their every want and need with a never ending flow of resources coming from the federal government without any understanding where this wealth comes from.

my fear is that we have waited too long to fight against the progressive movement to change the American culture.
Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Offline IronDioPriest

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2013, 12:51:49 PM »
...They don't seem to understand that we are guaranteed the right to the pursuit of happiness, not the right to be happy. They totally believe that their government has the right and the ability to fulfill their every want and need with a never ending flow of resources...

The concept of happiness itself has been perverted; equated to "stuff". Easy credit and consumerist mentality have addicted people generations removed from an actual relationship between lack of responsibility and consequences, to the idea that the American Dream means living like Lords and Ladies whether it is earned or not.

Yank the world out from under them by destroying the economy, crashing the house of cards, and voilĂ , you have millions of babies suckling at the gubmint teat.

Welcome to the forum.
"A strict observance of the written laws is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self-preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to written law, would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the end to the means."

- Thomas Jefferson

Offline Glock32

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2013, 12:59:02 PM »
my fear is that we have waited too long to fight against the progressive movement to change the American culture.

I think we have definitely waited too long, and now socioeconomic collapse is the only hope. We could have countered the march of the Left decades ago, but the refrain of the Republican Party has always been some variation of "this isn't the hill to die on", so they just acquiesce to the Left on this issue and that issue. It has a cumulative effect, because all these individually minor issues end up changing the entire culture. More importantly, it trains and conditions Republicans and their supporters into taking on the mindset of losers -- and look at the GOP leadership in Washington, that's exactly what they are.
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Offline AmericanPatriot

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2013, 01:30:11 PM »
Welcome, whimsicalmamapig and thank you for expressing what many of us have said in one form or another.

I suspect my generation could have been the last who knew what this country was.
I grew up in the 1950s and by the end of the 1960s and early 1970s, the country had started to change.

My generation now holds the reins of power.  And many of them were the flower children, hippies and Viet Nam War protesters.
I'll adnit I was one but eventually came around to some semblance of my senses

Offline whimsicalmamapig

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2013, 02:05:46 PM »
The thought of an economic collapse may be the cathartic incident that could blast apart the socialist grasp of our nation, but if we were to see such an event we could usher in changes coming from other directions that may not create the results  we want.

I yearn for the person who will stand up, unabashedly, and delineate just what the left has and is doing to this nation. As long as we are content to list our gripes and forebodings on a sight like this where it is safe rather than risk the certain smearing from the left, we will not build a force that can turn hearts and minds.

It is not that the youth of our nation are stupid, they are just brainwashed like those hapless dopes in North Korea who truly believe they live in the best nation on earth because they have not been taught anything else. The right needs a steady, long term re-education project that will enlighten the youth as to the true situation here, both economic and social, and draw a strong straight line from this current mess directly back to the beginnings for progressive re-alignment of our culture in our governments and schools.

this will take time and patience but re-education may be the only steady path available.
Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Offline trapeze

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2013, 02:51:30 PM »
The thought of an economic collapse may be the cathartic incident that could blast apart the socialist grasp of our nation, but if we were to see such an event we could usher in changes coming from other directions that may not create the results  we want.

Hmm...well that's just it, though...an economic collapse isn't merely a thought, as if we could decide to have one or not. It either will or will not happen. Right now all indications (and worst of all, math) are that we are actually going to have one. The only question about it seems to be just when that particular shoe will drop.

And yes, when extreme change happens all bets are off as to what will happen. But, forewarned is forearmed and most people are ignoring the warning signs. Those people will be at the mercy of the ones who are prepared for the coming disaster.

Quote
I yearn for the person who will stand up, unabashedly, and delineate just what the left has and is doing to this nation. As long as we are content to list our gripes and forebodings on a sight like this where it is safe rather than risk the certain smearing from the left, we will not build a force that can turn hearts and minds.

I'm not sure where you are going with this. Personally, I have zero desire to build any kind of a force at all. Hearts and minds will be turned when they are ready to be turned and not before.

This site is for much more than listing our gripes and forebodings. It's a place where conservatives can have fellowship with likeminded people and be free from the ridiculous (and empty headed) snarking from the left. I can find that type of interaction just about anywhere and just about anytime. We come here to take a breather from that environment.

I hope that you stick around and learn about what goes on here so that you, too, can enjoy things here.
In a doomsday scenario, hippies will be among the first casualties. So not everything about doomsday will be bad.

Offline whimsicalmamapig

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2013, 03:06:03 PM »
"I'm not sure where you are going with this. Personally, I have zero desire to build any kind of a force at all. Hearts and minds will be turned when they are ready to be turned and not before."

What I was meaning to express is that the progressives had a long term goal to fundamentally alter the compass direction by which we had set our country's development.
If we are to bring it back to that direction, it will not be an overnight change, how many generations have passed through our current public schools indoctrinated to believe what the government says. 
I think we need to start countering these beliefs with wisdom based on our founding principals and illustrate how following those concepts would benefit them in the long run. I don't think many of them have been confronted with an equal but alternative vision. They literally take for granted that everyone thinks their way and readily accepts the precepts they have been schooled in from kindergarten.

We, as conservatives have trained ourselves to "hold our tongues" in public debates or risk being shouted down by uber-aggressive radicals out to promote their agenda. I think the reason Senator Cruz has so great a following is that he gives it right back.

while I am not a Senator Cruz, I think we need to develop an attitude that allows us to confront leftist ideology with well-thought out responses that appeal to the youth, especially in areas of health care and jobs
Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Offline IronDioPriest

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2013, 03:11:18 PM »
...I yearn for the person who will stand up, unabashedly, and delineate just what the left has and is doing to this nation...

Sarah Palin. Rand Paul. Ted Cruz. Rush Limbaugh. Allen West. Andrew Breitbart. Glenn Beck.

In other words, "the person" exists, and IS standing up unabashedly, delineating just what the Left is doing to this nation.

"The person" is not enough. And the reason the person is not enough is because the Democrats, the Republicans, the media, academia, the entierety of pop culture, and the "international community" are aligned squarely against "the person", and will stop at nothing to destroy him/her.

It will be "the people" aligned squarely against the aforementioned forces, or it will be no one at all. One person willing to be smeared and labeled is admirable, but pissing in a hurricane. We have to BE the hurricane. Storms form from chaos.

"A strict observance of the written laws is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self-preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to written law, would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the end to the means."

- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2013, 03:19:09 PM »
as I observe my own grown children trying to carry on the family business, I am frightened for their future knowing that government will only grow larger and taxes grow greater to feed the every want and believed need of these young people.

They have been denied the information to make rational choices, and I am afraid that this was a purposeful attempt to keep them docile and willing supporters of whatever legislation the left proffers to them.

They don't seem to understand that we are guaranteed the right to the pursuit of happiness, not the right to be happy. They totally believe that their government has the right and the ability to fulfill their every want and need with a never ending flow of resources coming from the federal government without any understanding where this wealth comes from.

my fear is that we have waited too long to fight against the progressive movement to change the American culture.

You seem to know the score.  Are you worrying about your children because they lean "progressive" or because they have to live in a world of "progressive"?
"Under certain circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer." - Mark Twain

"Let us assume for the moment everything you say about me is true. That just makes your problem bigger, doesn't it?"

Offline whimsicalmamapig

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2013, 03:35:54 PM »
My family and their spouses are squarely conservative because I have passed the family business to them and they understands the fundamentals of economic survival. One spouse even came from a family of "entitlement" style people but has become the strongest conservative among us when she sees her money going to pay for useless government handouts.

I fear for their ability to continue the business if we stay on the economic path we are on. I also have 2 grandchildren and I worry even more for them.
Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2013, 03:50:06 PM »
My family and their spouses are squarely conservative because I have passed the family business to them and they understands the fundamentals of economic survival. One spouse even came from a family of "entitlement" style people but has become the strongest conservative among us when she sees her money going to pay for useless government handouts.

So far, so good ... and good for you.

Quote
I fear for their ability to continue the business if we stay on the economic path we are on. I also have 2 grandchildren and I worry even more for them.

I understand your fear; you have good reason to worry.

The economic path we are on will not continue because it cannot.  By that I mean that either a crash is coming or an increasingly escalating decline.
There Is No Money.  For every dollar the Feds spend, only 54 cents of it comes from revenue; the other 46 cents is borrowed.  That's the deficit; all of that amassed borrowed 46 centses plus interest over the years is the debt, now at 16+ TRILLION dollars.  You do the math.

How clear is this to your family and what are y'all doing to prepare for the suck?
"Under certain circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer." - Mark Twain

"Let us assume for the moment everything you say about me is true. That just makes your problem bigger, doesn't it?"

Offline trapeze

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2013, 04:09:35 PM »
What I was meaning to express is that the progressives had a long term goal to fundamentally alter the compass direction by which we had set our country's development.

And we are there. And that is a problem.

Quote

If we are to bring it back to that direction, it will not be an overnight change, how many generations have passed through our current public schools indoctrinated to believe what the government says. 
I think we need to start countering these beliefs with wisdom based on our founding principals and illustrate how following those concepts would benefit them in the long run. I don't think many of them have been confronted with an equal but alternative vision. They literally take for granted that everyone thinks their way and readily accepts the precepts they have been schooled in from kindergarten.

All true, but they need to have ears to hear and currently they do not. It is my personal belief that, much like the problem drinker or chronic drug abuser, they must hit rock bottom before they look for alternatives to the dogma which they have grown up with. Our country is now hanging by a thread in terms of economic strength and stability. We are close to a tipping point in that area. What happens after that, as you said above, no one knows. But it is, I believe, going to take something rather cataclysmic to turn things around.

Quote
We, as conservatives have trained ourselves to "hold our tongues" in public debates or risk being shouted down by uber-aggressive radicals out to promote their agenda. I think the reason Senator Cruz has so great a following is that he gives it right back.

while I am not a Senator Cruz, I think we need to develop an attitude that allows us to confront leftist ideology with well-thought out responses that appeal to the youth, especially in areas of health care and jobs

I disagree with this. I don't think that real conservatives are trained to hold our tongues. I believe that real conservatives are quite well armed with both the truth and the reasoned arguments to support the truth. Again, I believe it comes down to having ears willing to hear and we aren't there yet. The alcoholic is still getting his fix and although things aren't good for him, they aren't so bad that he is willing to seek help with his problem. He has to hit bottom.
In a doomsday scenario, hippies will be among the first casualties. So not everything about doomsday will be bad.

Offline whimsicalmamapig

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2013, 04:20:50 PM »
if doomsday is upon us you would think that Detroit would be a big sign in the sky for them.  Just how bad does that city need to get before even the most dopey of the liberals cannot maintain their fantasy utopian dream of spreading the wealth?

I can understand the Obama-phone lady not understanding the situation, but journalists have to have at least some higher education and despite all their efforts, some sane education has to have taken place in their lives. How can they be cheerleading us into Armageddon?
that is what frightens me the most, either a good part of the world is delusional or I am totally on the wrong track.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 04:37:30 PM by whimsicalmamapig »
Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Offline Glock32

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2013, 04:47:32 PM »
Journalists do know the score, the error is in the expectation that they will come around if only they are presented with the right argument. They, like the rest of the current intelligentsia, are actively advancing this state of affairs because they believe we need a strong, centralized state as the mechanism by which ordinary individuals will be divorced from the decision making process. They see themselves as part of an elite that has the divine right (or as close to "divine" as you'll ever get from these aggressive secularists) to be in positions of power over others. All the social and cultural ills are evidence to them that most people are too stupid and incapable to decide for themselves, and that these ills can be redressed by removing the power to decide from the individual and instead concentrating it among some modern day Druid caste. A good example is Thomas Friedman, who frequently laments that our system isn't more like China's. He marvels at the ability of the Chinese state to do whatever it wants, whenever it wants, and to whomever it wants. Rather than consider the human suffering that exists under such a system, he sees gleaming airports and highways and deems it superior to our system that necessarily sometimes encounters gridlock as a result of competing interests. It was the same in the 1930s when American journalists gushed with effusive praise for the Soviet Union and Comrade Stalin's 5 year plans of industrialization.

It's the fatal conceit of journalists, academics, bureaucrats, and other members of what Angelo Codevilla dubbed "the ruling class": they all believe in this radical transformation because they all believe they'll have a seat in the councils of power. The same was true of the Bolsheviks, many of whom promptly ended up in an unmarked grave or a Siberian gulag after the monster that they'd uncaged consumed its own revolutionaries.

As far as putting together a multi-generation pushback through education, I would certainly agree with that course of action. A few generations ago. I'm afraid we have already reached the critical mass required for the nuclear reaction that is about to take place. Speaking for myself, my overall posture and thought process have now shifted away from thinking in terms of correction, and instead to thinking in terms of survival. The opportunity to reclaim the heritage of our constitutional republic through "normal" means is now well and truly behind us, in my opinion. It is my hope that as this house of cards collapses, opportunities will present themselves to reassert classical American republicanism at least in certain regions and localities.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 04:51:49 PM by Glock32 »
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Offline whimsicalmamapig

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2013, 05:03:56 PM »
wow, and I thought my belief that a good "national enema" to cleanse the system was just due to my arteries hardening a insufficient blood to the noggin.  I watch congress and just don't see any means of making a change short of tea party majorities in both houses and either Cruz or Rand for president. even then the masses would riot and it would be over in 2 years.

I speak with many military people "off the record" and they feel that a drastic change is all that is left also.  I would rather go to my grave watching the rebirth of this grand experiment rather than watching its demise.

and don't those "educated elite" understand history, communism failed just as badly as despotism and the many utopian community experiments.  just what are they hoping to achieve that would be any different
Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

Offline LadyVirginia

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Re: lost generations
« Reply #18 on: September 08, 2013, 05:09:50 PM »
I can't see a collapse causing millions of ignorant people to suddenly see the light.  They don't have the experience or education for even a rudimentary suspicion that they and millions of others made a wrong turn.  They're not going to say "Wow, we made a mistake.  We should see what the founding fathers and the other leaders of the western world taught about rights and responsibilities. Let's see what other people have learned from history so we don't reinvent the wheel."   No, they will assume it's because "someone" else didn't "do" something "enough". They will blame others and assume their viewpoint is the answer.  Look at education.  Millions of voters actually believe if they fund education enough that we'll get better schools. People who don't agree with them are the problem.

The turn-around will come if there's a spiritual renewal.  Through a spiritual renewal the individual realizes he is not the center of the universe.
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Re: lost generations
« Reply #19 on: September 08, 2013, 05:10:54 PM »
Quote
and don't those "educated elite" understand history, communism failed just as badly as despotism and the many utopian community experiments.  just what are they hoping to achieve that would be any different.

LOL.  They don't know history.  As far as they're concerned, any failures with totalitarianism can be attributed to "the wrong people" running things.  They, you see, are "the right people", thus it's not the fault of "the system" (except for the free market).

eta:  And I see LV beat me to it.
"Under certain circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer." - Mark Twain

"Let us assume for the moment everything you say about me is true. That just makes your problem bigger, doesn't it?"