It's About Liberty: A Conservative Forum

Topics => TEOTWAWKI => Topic started by: trapeze on May 20, 2013, 02:08:03 AM

Title: Food Storage Photos
Post by: trapeze on May 20, 2013, 02:08:03 AM
I am curious as to what others have done in the way of food storage. And since I am asking for pictures I will put up my own first.

I haven't been working on food storage very long and consequently I don't have a tremendous amount of stuff. I am thinking, though, that by the end of the year I will have my shelves full. Or mostly full. And other than just kind of grouping like stuff together I don't have much in the way of "organization." I think that after the shelves become a bit more full the organization thing will begin to firm up and sort of sort itself out. What can I say? I make this stuff up as I go.

My food storage room is located below grade so it stays cool most of the year. Pretty good for wine storage and it probably helps with the longevity of the food stuffs, too. It is about fourteen feet wide, about twelve feet deep and eight feet high. Not huge but not small, either. I like to think of it as a good start. I have a lot of room at my commercial building and I guess that I will work on that after this room is completed.

So...this is the rear wall, the one I see when I walk into the room:

(http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/7348/img0450vt.jpg)
There are quite a few 2-liter bottles that I need to fill with stuff whether that is beans, macaroni, rice, potato flakes, sugar, water, etc. I will need to pick up some oxygen absorbing things and stuff one into each of the bottles as they fill. I can double stack 5-gallon buckets on the bottom shelf. I used 2x3 treated lumber to keep the bottom shelf off of the floor because every once in a while I will get some ground water seepage. If it happened more often I would jack hammer the floor and put a sump pump in but so far it's merely an annoyance. Need to put some mouse traps and bait down soon...we have four cats guarding against vermin but you can't be too careful.

Next is the wall to my left as I walk into the room:

(http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/815/img0451bb.jpg)
Right now I have some non-food items on it (plus some carpentry tools). The cardboard boxes are some hotel items I acquired: bar soap, shampoo, conditioner and mouthwash. I figured that the small sizes would come in handy at some point for something. There is also a Coleman propane camp stove and a Food Saver vacuum packer there. Bleach. Batteries. Matches. Insect repellant. Butane lighters. Duct tape. I have a list I'm working on.

Looking the other way is this wall:

(http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/992/img0452my.jpg)
This is where I have been stacking most of the food that I have so far collected. I have a nice little wine rack that I salvaged from a liquor store that went out of business and there is also a vintage candy shelf from an old grocery store. A few 2-liter bottles that I have filled with rice, beans and sugar are on the top shelf. The wine rack is about a quarter of the way full...mostly with wine but lately I have been picking up liquor, instead. Several bottles now of high quality liquor (I hate cheap liquor). Sure wish I could store beer long term. Lots of soup. Lots of canned meat. Lots of canned veggies. And lots of room for lots more.

And a bit further to the left (adjacent to the door) is the long term food storage:

(http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/1660/img0449vp.jpg)
I started out the freeze dried stuff by picking up a few cans at a time from Walmart. Recently I have added a couple of cases of the Mountain House stuff. I am trying to budget around $250 or so a month for freeze dried and/or dehydrated food. Above that is propane canisters for use with the Coleman camp stove and some toiletry items.

When these shelves fill up I am going to add another floor to ceiling shelf unit that comes off of one of the walls and goes about four to six feet into the center of the room.

There is also quite a bit of room in the garage for storing non-food preps so there's that, too.

Anyway, that's all I have for now. I would be interested to see what others have going on in this area.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: AlanS on May 20, 2013, 06:20:05 AM
All I can say is you have way more storage than I do. Looks like a good start.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Libertas on May 20, 2013, 06:45:00 AM
No pictures, but our "bunker" has like a gazzillion 5gal pails of everything you can imagine, a ton of those cans like you have stacked adjacent to the door, MREs, and sundry supplies.  The pantry has enough extra dry goods and canned goods to last us quite a while on its own, but the latter has started to be cycled due to shorter lifespan.  Plus we have a myriad of different soaps, vinegar, bleach, amonia, several different water treatment processes and lots of storage containers, medical supplies, TP...I'm sure I'm missing something.  The pantry is relatively well organized, the "bunker" we just try to group in clusters for like items.  We have traps and poison about for pest control, a dehumidifier that keeps the place dry and drains the captured moisture into the ground.  We have gobs of other stuff stored in the garage-charcoal, propane in various sizes, more TP and such.  You use what you have as best you can!  
 ::thumbsup::
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: IronDioPriest on May 20, 2013, 06:58:53 AM
Looks good Trap. We have a similar stock (not nearly so much wine though  ;) ). Ours is not nearly as well organized either. Nothing picture-worthy. It's all crammed onto wire-rack shelving in our unfinished basement in the unfinished bathroom we use as a storage space for all kinds of crap.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: trapeze on May 20, 2013, 08:45:58 AM
No pictures, but our "bunker" has like a gazzillion 5gal pails of everything you can imagine, a ton of those cans like you have stacked adjacent to the door, MREs, and sundry supplies.  The pantry has enough extra dry goods and canned goods to last us quite a while on its own, but the latter has started to be cycled due to shorter lifespan.  Plus we have a myriad of different soaps, vinegar, bleach, amonia, several different water treatment processes and lots of storage containers, medical supplies, TP...I'm sure I'm missing something.  The pantry is relatively well organized, the "bunker" we just try to group in clusters for like items.  We have traps and poison about for pest control, a dehumidifier that keeps the place dry and drains the captured moisture into the ground.  We have gobs of other stuff stored in the garage-charcoal, propane in various sizes, more TP and such.  You use what you have as best you can! 
 ::thumbsup::

Need some pics of that. Sounds very nice.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Weisshaupt on May 20, 2013, 09:56:55 AM
Looks good Trap. We have a similar stock (not nearly so much wine though  ;) ). Ours is not nearly as well organized either. Nothing picture-worthy. It's all crammed onto wire-rack shelving in our unfinished basement in the unfinished bathroom we use as a storage space for all kinds of crap.

Yeah, that is what ours looks like too. Hell the dehydrated I ordered for the new place is still sitting on the pallet it came on.  need to move it underground, but.. There is too much work going on down there for me to move it yet.. couple more weeks.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Libertas on May 20, 2013, 10:52:02 AM
No pictures, but our "bunker" has like a gazzillion 5gal pails of everything you can imagine, a ton of those cans like you have stacked adjacent to the door, MREs, and sundry supplies.  The pantry has enough extra dry goods and canned goods to last us quite a while on its own, but the latter has started to be cycled due to shorter lifespan.  Plus we have a myriad of different soaps, vinegar, bleach, amonia, several different water treatment processes and lots of storage containers, medical supplies, TP...I'm sure I'm missing something.  The pantry is relatively well organized, the "bunker" we just try to group in clusters for like items.  We have traps and poison about for pest control, a dehumidifier that keeps the place dry and drains the captured moisture into the ground.  We have gobs of other stuff stored in the garage-charcoal, propane in various sizes, more TP and such.  You use what you have as best you can!  
 ::thumbsup::

Need some pics of that. Sounds very nice.

Really, it's not.   ::hysterical::

OK, maybe the garage since we got (most) everything on shelves and in bins (where possible) and the pantry (cabinets), the "bunker" (aka crawl space) has what we can stuff in it, pictures would probably only confuse people. We have other crap elsewhere, place resembles a serial hoarders dwelling in many respects.  I'll see what I can come up with for pics.  I better not tell my mother though, she's more paranoid than I am (if that's possible!).
 ;D
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Pandora on May 20, 2013, 10:54:28 AM
Speaking of paranoid ....

trap, check your PMs.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Weisshaupt on May 20, 2013, 10:56:56 AM
Speaking of paranoid ....

trap, check your PMs.

Hey, I am paranoid!  Do I get a PM?
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Pandora on May 20, 2013, 10:58:09 AM
Speaking of paranoid ....

trap, check your PMs.

Hey, I am paranoid!  Do I get a PM?

Yes, you get a PM.   ;D

Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: John Florida on May 20, 2013, 11:40:56 AM
If it's below grade I would suggest a dehumidifier be put in place just as a safe guard. I use commercial shelving that I got out of a parts store that went out and owed me money. My stores go up and down so I don't have a lot on hand at this time but it's time to get back to stocking up.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Weisshaupt on May 20, 2013, 12:38:14 PM
If it's below grade I would suggest a dehumidifier be put in place just as a safe guard. I use commercial shelving that I got out of a parts store that went out and owed me money. My stores go up and down so I don't have a lot on hand at this time but it's time to get back to stocking up.

 What is this Humidity thing of which you speak? I don't think we have it in  Colorado.

(Yes, under the right conditions it could happen, but here you almost have to work to create them)

Early settlers here put dugouts into the side of a hill and called it food storage. Most of us have humidifiers on our central air system to add water to the air.. which gets brutally dry as it circulates through the burner, and wood left out in a field, uncoated and untreated,  will take  10-20 years to fully rot if it isn't lying in a stream bed. It won't hurt to have a dehumidifier  of course,
but there are probably higher priority goods. unless unusual amounts of water vapor are actually being observed in the basement.


 
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Libertas on May 20, 2013, 02:03:49 PM
I like PMs!   ::whoohoo::
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: trapeze on May 20, 2013, 02:43:47 PM
No, humidity is not a problem where I live. It is as Weisshaupt says...lack of humidification is the usual issue.

I had an opportunity to go to the Walmart today which, I have often said is a very long drive from where I live, and I picked up another half a dozen of their #10 cans of freeze dried stuff. I am getting close to the limit of what Walmart can provide (they only have three entrees) and I think that I will need to start shopping exclusively online. The Mountain House products have a much bigger selection than Walmart does in pretty much every category.

Walmart does sell large five-gallon buckets of wheat berries that are supposed to be good for 30 years. I picked up one of those, too.

And onto the shelves they go.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Pandora on May 20, 2013, 03:54:45 PM
Well, it looks to me like a job well done as to the organization and carpentry.  I wish I had an empty space that size to fill because my stuff is in a couple places as well.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Weisshaupt on May 20, 2013, 04:14:40 PM
No, humidity is not a problem where I live. It is as Weisshaupt says...lack of humidification is the usual issue.

I had an opportunity to go to the Walmart today which, I have often said is a very long drive from where I live, and I picked up another half a dozen of their #10 cans of freeze dried stuff. I am getting close to the limit of what Walmart can provide (they only have three entrees) and I think that I will need to start shopping exclusively online. The Mountain House products have a much bigger selection than Walmart does in pretty much every category.

Walmart does sell large five-gallon buckets of wheat berries that are supposed to be good for 30 years. I picked up one of those, too.

And onto the shelves they go.

Shelves. I wish I had shelves.  It is beautifully done..

If and when I get round to properly storing this stuff again, I think I would like to get the automatically rotating racks.. (http://www.thrivelife.com/food-rotation-systems)
No, it isn't that big of a deal to simply put the new stuff in the back, and we have been doing that.. but this is just easier..
[urk=http://www.costco.com/Shelf-Reliance-Harvest-Food-Rotation-System.product.11233458.html]Costco also sells them.. [/url]


(http://www.thrivelife.com/skin/frontend/default/shelfreliance/images/skinImages/theHarvestLarge.jpg)

 Of course here is an idea for the DYI person who has the space.. and can't get to the back easy (http://foodstorageandbeyond.com/2010/07/feature-frugal-friday-homemade-rotating-can-racks/) which could be easily adpatedinto what you already have built there...


(http://foodstorageandbeyond.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/homemade-rotating-can-rack.jpg)





Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Alphabet Soup on May 20, 2013, 05:10:15 PM
My house came with a couple cabinets similar to the lower one except the cans don't load from above (auto-rotate) and they are oriented 90 degrees to the ones pictured. At first I thought I would hate it. Now that I've gotten used to it I love it. Each cabinet features 8 tiers x 8 rows, with each row holding 5-6 cans. That's like 25 cases of canned goods in a space slightly larger than a dishwasher.

I picked up one of those stampers where you can change the date and mark the cans as they come into the house. Rotation is easy enough. If you have two rows of canned corn you pull off of one row until it's done, then you refill it and pull off the other row.

I don't have a room that I can dedicate to a pantry so I have several areas with free-standing shelving. It's not terribly organized but it gets the job done.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Pandora on May 20, 2013, 05:40:21 PM
(http://foodstorageandbeyond.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/homemade-rotating-can-rack.jpg)

How hard would it be to build a cabinet like that one, but instead of stationary shelves, put in low-profile drawers on pull-out hardware?  Not hard, I'd think, and perhaps not that expensive either.  The drawer can be pulled forward, new stuff loaded in the rear and none of it would be hard to get at.

(http://www.shelvesthatslide.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/standard.gif)

Sort of like that ^^ .  The whole drawer assembly is expensive, but the hardware alone is not.

http://kitchenshelves.com/hardware.htm (http://kitchenshelves.com/hardware.htm)
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: trapeze on June 08, 2013, 10:45:15 AM
It's June so I bought another case of Mountain House freeze dried stuff. This time it was meat. I ordered it late at night and I honestly don't remember exactly what I got. Maybe it was diced chicken or beef or ground beef. Something like that. I guess I will know in a few days when it shows up.

In May I added a lot of drinking water to the shelves and also several more bottles of wine and high quality hard liquor. I even picked up a large bottle of Maker's Mark bourbon because I figured that I may as well get some before they change the recipe for the worse. I have to wonder if they are leaking rumors about making it more cheaply just to drive sales. Anyway, drinking is important, both water and recreational stuff. Or barter material depending on your point of view.

I have continued to increase the canned goods and dry goods. I picked up a thirty year container (like 5 gallons) of hard wheat at Walmart so I guess at some point I will need to get a grain mill.

I have one can of seeds. A variety of some sort. Supposed to be enough to make a garden for two or three people. I will be adding to that so that I have enough for several people. Also on the list are materials to construct a greenhouse. I have several hundred square feet of heavy, clear polyethylene sheeting and I'm thinking about PVC pipe and fittings necessary to making some kind of a curved structure like a quonset hut.

Overall, though, things are coming along nicely. I think that by the end of this year I will have a minimum of six months of food in storage.

Another thing that I have been looking at is silver. I am thinking that it would be a good idea to have a few thousand dollars of old US silver coins on hand in the dime, nickel and quarter denominations. Perhaps purchase a few hundred dollars worth per month for a year or so. Two or three rolls of dimes per bug-out-bag would be a good thing, I think.

Ammunition and firearms I am in pretty good shape in already but that continues to grow, as well.

Fun, fun, fun.



Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: charlesoakwood on June 22, 2013, 10:06:21 PM

http://www.buzzfeed.com/erinlarosa/excellent-reasons-to-drink-more-whiskey (http://www.buzzfeed.com/erinlarosa/excellent-reasons-to-drink-more-whiskey)

(http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr01/2013/6/18/14/anigif_enhanced-buzz-15394-1371581019-2.gif)

Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: trapeze on June 23, 2013, 03:03:18 AM
Yeah, I read that article this afternoon. Almost stopped at the liquor store on the way home to buy another bottle for storage but I just didn't have the time. Next week, I suppose. At some point I am going to have to develop a taste for liquor, I suppose...can't just let the stuff pile up without enjoying it. I've always been a beer drinker and that stuff doesn't have any shelf life at all. So...wine and liquor are the ticket.

Received my order of Mountain House this week and it was six #10 cans of freeze dried ground beef. I think that June's long term storage purchase is going to be somewhat different, though. I think that instead of freeze dried meat I am going to opt for pre-cooked canned stuff from Survival Cave. (http://www.survivalcave.com/Canned-food-storage-combo-by-Survival-Cave-Food-p/scfcombo.htm) It looks tastier and it is supposed to last for fifteen or thirty years. I am going to budget for about $200 per month for about four to six months worth of purchases.

I am also looking at a solar oven so that I will be able to cook without any fuel at all. We have a staggering number of sunny days here. It's almost like Phoenix in that regard so a solar oven makes a lot of sense. I am looking at this one. (http://www.amazon.com/Global-Sun-OvenĀ®-Worlds-Solar/dp/B002U1U7ZK/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1371974634&sr=8-2&keywords=solar+oven) Food and water storage have to come first, though, so it may be a while before I get one.

Short term food storage is coming along nicely. I am guessing that I probably added about $400 worth of short term food to the storage room in May. Maybe more but certainly not less than that. I am going to have to add some more shelves soon to keep things organized properly. If I can keep up the purchasing pace I think that I will (maybe) have a year's worth of food put away by the end of the year. I hope. I was thinking six month's worth before but now I'm aiming for a longer term.

Sure wish I had more ammo put away, though.

I don't know when things are going to go bad but I'm pretty much convinced now that they will.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Libertas on June 23, 2013, 01:36:45 PM
Liquor will be a good barter item, general anesthesia and disinfectant.  Vodka probably makes the most sense, or a nice clear moonshine.

 ::thumbsup::

We've got some solar ovens stashed away, not sure of the manufacturer, might have to check on that.  Good back up item and barter item too.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: John Florida on June 23, 2013, 04:30:02 PM
  Well I wasn't going to admit to this screw up but I always bring back my favorite brands of canned maters and as ususal I went out and bought 5 cases of maters only to find out that my father had done the same for me so I now have in total about 150 cans in the house and the ones I bought are dated 2015.

 The good part is that I didn't pay over 1.00 a can.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Libertas on June 23, 2013, 05:41:33 PM
Heh. I guess you get to mix up a lot of sauce!
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: John Florida on June 23, 2013, 05:46:09 PM
Heh. I guess you get to mix up a lot of sauce!

 Hell yes!!But they get used in all kinds of soups and stews,pot roasts,short ribs and all kinds of stuff
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Libertas on June 23, 2013, 09:06:50 PM
Heh. I guess you get to mix up a lot of sauce!

 Hell yes!!But they get used in all kinds of soups and stews,pot roasts,short ribs and all kinds of stuff

Nummy!  ::thumbsup::
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: trapeze on June 27, 2013, 11:33:37 AM
I think that I am probably going to turn this thread into my personal prepper blog so the thread title may change soon.

Yesterday I ordered a British Berkefeld (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002RZRJHI/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) water filter. Should have it in a couple of days and then I can strike that off my list. That thing is supposed to be able to filter a gallon per hour via gravity so that is way more than my family needs. Plus it is also supposed to be completely renewable (i.e. no spare parts needed) so there is no foreseeable upper limit on gallons produced. Knowing me (and I do), though, I will probably purchase a spare set of ceramic filter cartridges for it anyway. Just in case.

Still working on water storage, though. If we had more rain here I could work on water collection but it doesn't seem to be worth the effort at this point. In the winter there is a virtually inexhaustible supply of snow in all directions so I am pretty much covered for about five months, maybe six, out of the year. I have a stream that is active for one to two months in the spring (longer when there is rain) that is downhill about a third of a mile off. There is also a lake that is within a mile. Long way to walk for water but it's better than nothing. So, my plan is to build up enough water storage to make it through those times of the year when there is no rain and snow. If I can't get enough stored indoors then I will probably resort to digging a big hole for a cistern in the back yard. I'm not crazy about that idea, though.

I am getting enough food stock into my storeroom now that I think I will have to build more shelves. Maybe this weekend. I need more shelves because as the existing shelves fill it becomes more difficult to organize and take a proper inventory. I haven't been keeping a record of how much I have spent on food stocks but it has to be approaching $1.5K...probably more than that when you figure in the wine and liquor.

Should have enough bottled propane on hand to cook for a year which is okay. Not great but okay. The wood burning stove would become the primary heat source in the winter and it could be used to cook on during those months. That said, I am also looking at fabricating my own solar oven. We have a staggering number of sunny days in south central Colorado and a solar oven should be able to do very well under these conditions. I found a pretty good blog (http://www.williamgbecker.com/MakeSolarOven.html) on how to construct one. I would need to obtain a square of tempered glass and some sort of super reflective material but I should be able to lay my hands on most every other component without too much trouble. I will probably look around on the web for more DIY pages and try and consolidate the best ideas and designs into my own design. The insulation looks to be a bit of a challenge. I know that I could use fiberglass which has the benefits of being cheap and fireproof but I am wondering if there is something else that would work better and increase the efficiency (less heat loss means faster cooking). One thing I will do for certain is start with the bakeware and create the oven around those pieces. Doesn't make sense to me to build the oven first and then try and find stuff that would fit into it. The other design challenge is also size related and that is whether the thing should be portable or semi permanent. Perhaps I should try to make one each way so that a portable one could go on the road in the event of a necessary evacuation.

So...where do I stand with my preparations?

First a rating system. Bad means that I haven't done a thing yet. Fair means that I have started but I am not close to goal. Good means I am close to goal. Excellent means that I am at or past my goal and approaching barter status.

Guns: Fair to good
Ammunition: Fair to good
Short term food: Fair
Mid term food: Fair
Long term food: Fair to good (and I say that only because where I live the food literally walks past the house)
Cooking equipment/supplies: Fair
Water storage: Fair
Water filtration: Excellent
Shelter (includes winter heat): Excellent
Transportation: Fair to good
Communication: Fair
Power generation: Bad
Medical/First Aid: Fair
Library: Fair to good
Tools: Good
Misc. Supplies: Fair to Good
Personal knowledge/skills/abilities: Good (way better than average, anyway...in some areas at or near barter status)

Not a comprehensive list but it's a start and I will probably add stuff to it.

Right now the weakest area is definitely power generation. I have almost none at all. I could use the vehicle batteries to charge personal electronics and that is about it. So I'm thinking that I will probably start out with a cheap and portable solar cell to deal with charging the iPhone and maybe even the MacBook battery. After that I will need to work on a more powerful and long term solar power solution. The trick there would be to invest in something that isn't junk. China is supposed to be dumping a lot of cheap and largely defective solar cells on the market and what with solar companies failing and going out of business it's not likely that I would be able to get a refund if I ended up with a non-functioning cell or cells. Gotta put more thought into that one.

Solar hot water generation is also something I am thinking about. It would work well here for the same reason noted above re the solar oven. The problem then goes back to mass water storage (and probably how to pump it which goes back to power generation). There isn't much point in having the capability to generate hot water (for bathing, anyway) if there is no water or not enough water to run through the system. Gotta think about it some more.

Getting back to the thread title and subject: I will post some more pictures of the food storage area before and after I build new shelves.
Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: Weisshaupt on June 27, 2013, 01:04:46 PM

Still working on water storage, though.


Why not a well? If the State won't permit one, why not move to a nearby  property that already has one? Yes I understand why that might not be desirable.  What is even less desirable  is trekking through he woods with 5 gallon containers in both hands when people might be wanting to shoot you.

A lot of Solar Hot Water DIY  designs are here (http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/WaterHeating/water_heating.htm)

 


 (http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/Cooking/cooking.htmSolar cooking too.[/url)
Long term food: Fair to good (and I say that only because where I live the food literally walks past the house)

It won't for long.  Game will become very scarce. Most places in Colorado cannot provide food for the number of people who live there, and they will deplete the game populations before they die.  Longer, longer term  game might become a more  reliable source. I would look at Rabbits and or Chickens to maintain a source of meat during the time in between . 

After that I will need to work on a more powerful and long term solar power solution. The trick there would be to invest in something that isn't junk. China is supposed to be dumping a lot of cheap and largely defective solar cells on the market and what with solar companies failing and going out of business it's not likely that I would be able to get a refund if I ended up with a non-functioning cell or cells. Gotta put more thought into that one.

So far the Solarworld panels I purchased have been performing wonderfully. They are American made and they qualify for the Tax credit ( if your taxes are high enough, Helicopter Ban  pays for 1/3 of the panel)   For most houses you will need at least 4000 Watts of panel generating capacity, but you can also start smaller and add as you are able.

The Solarworld  270s ( I have 240s)  are less than $400 a piece ( I paid $600)   - so less than $1.50- a watt.   The inverters have gone up..
A 8000 watt Radian inverter  runs around $4300  but a prewired system with breakers, charge controllers etc  etc runs around $8800 -- I like the Radian because its high capacity system that you can build forever on, but its a chunk of change to throw down  and you still have batteries to buy. The older model  smaller systems (3200 watt continuous)    prewired are in that $4300 range.  I have a dual inverter system- for 6400 watts continuous and  cost on that is up $1000 - $7500.   These are all grid-interactive systems - so in normal operation you sell power to the grid, and use it at night, and only run on batteries when no utility power is available. So a "Small" system  consisting of Deep Cycle marine batteries (say 100 AMP hr - for 4.8 kw-hrs of backup ) a 3200 Watt prewired system and a string of 3 panels for  800 watts of generating power ( about 4 kw-hrs a day in Colorado)  would run around $5800 - $6000.

If you do Battery only (magnum) , or grid only (Fronius)  things are slightly cheaper. But PV is just expensive, even with the government paying 1/3 of the cost.




Title: Re: Food Storage Photos
Post by: trapeze on June 27, 2013, 01:26:57 PM
I am pretty sure that I can't do a well due to HOA rules or something. I will have to check into it. But even if I did put one in (not cheap at about $9 a foot just for the hole) it still has to have power to operate it. So the power thing would have to come first.

As far as walking for water goes, I am not all that concerned about it. The population is not too dense here and I could do it under cover of darkness if I had to. A lot of homes here are unoccupied. They are vacation homes, retirement homes, rental properties, time share properties, etc. I think that there may be a dozen homes on my street but only four or five of them are occupied on a regular basis.

There are actually several lakes in the area so it's not like there is competition for using them or a need to pick one. But that gets back to the water storage issue. I think that if I can put away something like 300 to 400 gallons I will be able to survive those times when there is nothing coming out of the sky or lying around on the ground. I mean, there is just no way that I drink a gallon a day so if I calculated three gallons/day for three people we would be able to make it on 300 gallons for three months or so. And that's being pretty generous with the theoretical consumption.

Solar I will get to someday. Water and food come first. When I have enough of both put away then I can get to work on power and other issues.