It's About Liberty: A Conservative Forum
Topics => Radical Islam/GWOT => Topic started by: rickl on August 06, 2011, 07:49:08 AM
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The crash is confirmed; the cause is not. The Taliban claim they shot it down.
This is the single deadliest incident for Americans since the war began.
Link (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AS_AFGHANISTAN?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2011-08-06-06-27-19)
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Jeez, I hate hearing of stuff like this. 31.
I know choppers are an integral part of ground deployment, but they seem do damned vulnerable to me.
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They said Obama, single handed, pulled the trigger on Osama.
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The Chinook helicopter is the one that my son works on.
I expect that he will be in Afghanistan early next year.
Quote from the article:
With its steep mountain ranges, providing shelter for militants armed with rocket-propelled grenade launchers, eastern Afghanistan is hazardous terrain for military aircraft. Large, slow-moving air transport carriers like the CH-47 Chinook are particularly vulnerable, often forced to ease their way through sheer valleys where insurgents can achieve more level lines of fire from mountainsides.
The AP gets at least one fact wrong in this paragraph.
The CH47 is the fastest helicopter the Army has. Top speed of well over 200mph. But it is large so I'll give them that.
Since this was a special forces operation the Chinook would have been a MH-47E or an MH47G. Probably the Echo rather than the Golf but either one is very hard to take down because of armor and avionics. Plus they would have had at least one but probably two 50 cal machine guns mounted in the side doors. They can fight back.
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I'm seeing reports that many of the dead are from Seal Team 6. (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_US_AFGHANISTAN_SEALS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2011-08-06-12-07-17)
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Afghanistan is not worth one more drop of American blood. It's time to bring the troops home to deal with the traitors in our own government. Afghanistan can be nuked if necessary.
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Afghanistan is not worth one more drop of American blood. It's time to bring the troops home to deal with the traitors in our own government. Afghanistan can be nuked if necessary.
^^ That!
The ROE are designed to give the enemy the advantage over our people and, now that it's Ramadan, those rules, instituted to protect the holy muslim sensibility, are simply egregious.
ENOUGH!
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President Barama, this is another thing the previous administration [GEORGE BUSH] did; He held Afghanistan in check by disallowing medrassas and Tally Band training and recruitment, kept casualties to a bare minimum (much safer than the streets of Chicago), and didn't disrupt the buggers killing each other.
A bugger wouldn't understand that would he?
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Helicopters are especially vulnerable in that high altitude, mountainous terrain. The air is so thin some of them are running full power just to stay airborne, then you throw in hot air at this time of year and it's even worse.
I agree with the above sentiments about getting out of there and simply containing the place with whatever means are required. I've long advocated we let them turn it into their 7th Century Fantasyland, and even encourage all the 'slims from the rest of the world to relocate to their Mohammadean paradise. Then, just play whack-a-mole from afar as necessary.
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Miss Barnhardt offers a different opinion.
http://www.barnhardt.biz/ (http://www.barnhardt.biz/)
The Execution of SEAL Team Six (Part 1)
Posted by Ann Barnhardt - August 6, AD 2011 4:08 PM MST
You're damn right I said it.
On May 5th I had an email conversation with a retired military man with spook contacts. All were in total agreement that the Bin Laden episode was pure theater. The SEALS were sent into a compound as evidenced by the lost chopper on site. But Osama Bin Laden wasn't in that compound. Osama Bin Laden has been dead for years. Bin Laden had a genetic condition that caused renal failure (this genetic condition is common among deeply inbred Saudi arab muslims). Bin Laden had been on dialysis BEFORE 9/11. Dialysis is difficult enough for people in first world countries who can have it done in outstanding facilities. Bin Laden was having it done either in caves or in homes post 9/11. People in renal failure having dialysis done in fricking caves do NOT live for ten more years. Period. There was no dialysis equipment found in the compound the SEALS raided on May 2. Of course there wasn't. Bin Laden wasn't in that compound because Bin Laden has been dead for years.
This is why the "body" was declared "positively identified" faster than any known DNA testing process in existence - and this DNA testing was carried out not in a lab mind you, but inside Chinook and/or V-22 Osprey helos en route to the USS Carl Vinson. The body was then dumped into the Indian Ocean in a mad dash to ensure that "burial" took place within 24 hours of death in order to "honor" musloid burial traditions. Not a single picture of the so-called "Bin Laden corpse" has ever been released - and never will.
The entire Bin Laden episode was stagecraft. It was pure theater that was designed to give Obama a boost in the polls and give distraction and cover. Distract from what? Cover from what?
April 20, 2011: The release date of Dr. Jerome Corsi's book, "Where's the Birth Certificate" is announced as May 17, and pre-sales begin on Amazon.com. Corsi's work is known to be extremely thorough and meticulous. Within hours, Corsi's book is #1 on Amazon.com - fully 28 days before its release. The Obama regime is panicked.
April 27, 2011: In order to diffuse and undercut the Corsi book, the Obama regime releases a PDF image purported to be a scan of his original long-form Hawaiian birth certificate. Within hours, thousands of graphic designers, many of whom are self-professed Obama voters and supporters, isolate and demonstrate with dozens of objective proof sets that the PDF released by the Obama regime is not just a forgery, but an astoundingly incompetent and obvious forgery.
April 27 through May 2: The Obama regime is now in a blind panic. Deeming it too risky, instead of commissioning the forged birth certificate from document and photo illustration experts within the CIA or NSA, the Obama regime instead farmed the project off on someone inside the White House with a functional but middling knowledge of photo illustration programs. To the thoroughly inexpert eyes of Barack Obama, Michelle Obama and Valerie Jarrett, the forged certificate file appeared extremely convincing, and was thus released with fanfare. Within hours, they knew that they had not only made a mistake, but a massive mistake that could land them all in prison. The forger was so incompetent that he/she didn’t even flatten the image thus compressing and masking the component layers before posting it. And that was just the tip of the iceberg of glaring flaws and errors. The mainstream press was, so far, completely complicit in the cover-up of the forgery, but Rathergate proved that if the forgery debunking generated any mainstream traction whatsoever, the end could come swiftly. The Obama regime needed a big distraction and they needed it fast. They had been planning on holding the staged Bin Laden capture and killing until 2012 – for the thick of the campaign, and perhaps as an “October Surprise”, but it would have to be moved up to now.
May 2, 2011: The Bin Laden operation occurs. In all likelihood, a low-to-mid level Taliban or insurgent leader is killed.
May 3, 2011: Within hours, Vice President Joe Biden destroys any notions of OPSEC and bellows to the entire world in public remarks at a dinner at the Ritz Carlton that the Bin Laden raid was carried out by “the SEALS”. Within hours Obama regime had gleefully leaked that the raid was carried out by “SEAL Team 6”, also known as DEVGRU. Up until this point in history, all DEVGRU activities and information had been highly classified. Now the term “SEAL Team 6” was blasted across every newspaper in the world, with Disney even moving to trademark the name. The Obama regime wanted the ENTIRE WORLD to know the name “SEAL Team 6”.
May 5, 2011: As I said earlier, I conversed with retired military contact with spook contacts regarding the obvious theatrics of the Bin Laden episode and the need for a cover-up by the Obama regime. The conversation ended with the following exchange:
Ann: I’m on the US Military casualty email list. It would be NO PROBLEM to “hide” casualties. It’s a steady stream out of Afghanistan.
Contact: look for training accidents in the eastern mountains.
May 6, 2011: Obama travels to Ft. Campbell, KY to openly “meet and congratulate” SEAL Team 6 members. This receives huge press coverage, and the press declares the incident “a huge boost [for Obama] going into 2012.” Video citation here:
http://abcnews.go.com/assets/player/walt2.6/flash/SFP_Walt_2_69.swf (http://abcnews.go.com/assets/player/walt2.6/flash/SFP_Walt_2_69.swf)
The Execution of SEAL Team Six (Part 2)
Posted by Ann Barnhardt - August 6, AD 2011 4:07 PM MST
August 6, 2011: A Chinook helo is shot down in Tangi, Wardak Province, Afghanistan. Within hours, before family notifications could possibly have been completed, global press accounts positively confirm that 22 of the 30 Americans killed were not just SEALS, but members of SEAL Team 6. Again, DEVGRU operations have been, up until now, highly classified. Today, the Obama regime made a point of immediately revealing the unit identities of the SPECOPS forces among the dead.
In the past, DEVGRU men and other SPECOPS men have been killed in action, but their missions were so secret and so crucial to OPSEC that their deaths were covered-up by the government and attributed to such things as “training accidents” and the like – and I have no problem with that. These men understand going in to intense units such as DEVGRU that OPSEC is paramount, that they will never be publicly acknowledged for their heroism, and that if they are killed or captured in action, the government will lie about that in order to protect OPSEC and to prevent the enemy from gaining a propaganda and morale coup. Compare that reality with what happened today. The Obama regime distributed this information, and the Obama regime’s lapdog press instantly splashed headlines declaring this as the Taliban’s “REVENGE” for the “death of Bin Laden.” As I write this now, the Drudge Report headline in bright red reads, “REVENGE: SEALS WHO GOT OSAMA KILLED IN AFGHANISTAN.”
I’ll say what everyone else is thinking but is too scared to say. The Obama regime is almost certainly directly complicit in these deaths. The time, location and most especially, the PASSENGERS in the Chinook were passed to the Taliban. Additionally, you can’t take out a Chinook with small arms fire or even standard RPGs such as the Taliban use. The Taliban needed serious weaponry to take this helo down, and that serious weaponry needed to be in exactly the right spot at exactly the right time, ready to fire.
Why would the Obama regime kill Americans? I think the question is, why WOULDN’T the Obama regime kill Americans? The Obama regime is composed of Marxist-Leninist psychopaths. A glancing, superficial survey of 20th century history shows one glaring fact above all others: MARXISTS MURDER PEOPLE WITHOUT COMPUNCTION. Marxists also hate Americans, by definition. Three tacks:
1. The men on board the Chinook may have been the same men who participated or had direct knowledge of the staged Bin Laden raid and were killed to permanently silence them. See my email exchange of May 5 above.
2. These DEVGRU men were killed to send a signal to the surviving DEVGRU men who carried out the Bin Laden raid to keep their mouths shut.
3. Certainly, the release of the unit identity of the dead within hours – before even family notification could have been made (which requires an IN PERSON visit to the family, remember) was an obvious bow to Al Qaeda, the Taliban and the entire muslim world. This event was INSTANTLY propagandized by the Obama media as “revenge” exacted for Bin Laden’s death. And remember, Bin Laden has been dead for many years. The raid of May 2 was pure stagecraft to distract the world from the release of the forged Obama birth certificate.
I am not a conspiracy theorist. I can’t stand Alex Jones or any 9/11 truther. I have turned down dozens of interviews with such types. In fact, I am a huge believer in the Lex Parsimoniae, which is sometimes called “Occam’s Razor”, which states that the simplest explanation is most likely the correct one. I teach this as part of my job, namely that the cattle markets are neither manipulated nor impossible to operate within at a profit. The reality is that the cattle industry participants do not make money because they are functionally incompetent. It is very, very simple. True conspiracies are very rare.
This entire Obama situation is a conspiracy, and I say that without the slightest hesitation. Obama is not a citizen of the United States, he is a puppet front for a cabal of Marxist-Leninsts including Soros, Ayers, Dohrn, Strong, Jarrett and many, many others. These people are enemies of the United States. These people are deeply psychologically damaged, and are capable of ordering people murdered in order to protect themselves and increase their own power. The three dead homosexual black men from Trinity United Church of Christ, Young, Bland and Spencer, all of whom were sexually linked to Barack Obama, were probably the first people specifically murdered by the Obama regime. The hundreds of Mexicans and the two American agents Terry and Zapata were murdered by Operation Fast and Furious in order to advance and increase the power of the Obama regime. These SEALS and the others on board that Chinook today were almost certainly betrayed and murdered by the Obama regime.
Why did the Obama regime immediately reveal the unit identity of the SPECOPS forces involved in the first place, despite the fact that DEVGRU was highly classified? Why was the personnel composition of the Chinook released IMMEDIATELY today after the helo went down – before even family notifications could be made? WHY? Why would you hand your enemy, Al Qaeda and the Taliban, a massive propaganda coup? WHY?
I’ll tell you why. Because the Obama regime IS THE ENEMY. They are Marxist tyrants who hold the lives of Americans not just cheap, but in scathing contempt. They will say anything, they will do anything, and they will murder ANYONE in order to protect themselves and consolidate and increase their power. Please, I beg you, for the love of God and all that is good in this world, read the history of the Soviet Union. Read about Lenin and Stalin and how they murdered people without any hesitation. Read about how Hitler was constantly ordering the murder of his own officers. Read about Communist China. Read about Mao and the millions upon tens of millions of murders he ordered. Read about the killing fields of the Communist Khmer Rouge in Cambodia led by Pol Pot. PLEASE. Marxists MURDER PEOPLE. That is what they do. The Obama regime is MARXIST to the bone. If the Obama regime is not stopped, the 30 Americans murdered today in Afghanistan will be just the beginning. I promise you that.
Here, again, is the clip of Larry Grathwohl, who infiltrated the Weather Underground Marxist terrorist organization in the 1970s. The Weather Underground was founded by Obama’s political godfather, communist mentor (along with Frank Marshall Davis), murderer, and ghostwriter of “Dreams From My Father”, Bill Ayers and his wife Bernardine Dohrn. In this interview, taped in 1980 while Obama was still just an unknown undergrad foreign scholarship student at Occidental College, Grathwohl describes the leadership of the Weather Underground (which is Ayers and Dohrn) discussing what will be done with the “unreformable, diehard capitalists” once they have overthrown the government of the United States. The answer is extermination in camps in the Southwest. The estimated total that would need to be killed? 25 million, which was 10% of the population at the time. Ayers & Dohrn already have overthrown the government of the United States via their puppet protégé, Barack Obama. They have guaranteed that the economy will collapse. The only thing left for them to do is suspend the Constitution and open the camps. I’ll see you there.
Larry Grathwohl on Ayers' plan for American re-education camps and the need to kill millions (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWMIwziGrAQ#)
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I like Anne Barnhardt but there is just way too much conspiracy here. The problem with conspiracies is that, when you actually have one, somebody always squeals. Usually several somebodies. People are like that.
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Yeah, I wonder whether Ann has jumped the shark here. It seems a bridge too far.
On the other hand:
The Obama regime is composed of Marxist-Leninist psychopaths. A glancing, superficial survey of 20th century history shows one glaring fact above all others: MARXISTS MURDER PEOPLE WITHOUT COMPUNCTION.
That is absolutely true, without qualification.
We are rapidly reaching the point where today's tinfoil hat conspiracy is tomorrow's reality. (I almost said "tomorrow's headline" but then I remembered the MSM.)
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On the other hand, I had believed that Osama has been dead for years, and I already knew about his kidney dialysis problem. And they disposed of the body right quickly, didn't they?
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I would never have disclosed that they were members of seal team six.
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Well, there is just too much rolled into this blogpost.
The "OBL was already dead" theory.
The "OBL raid was faked" theory.
And then the "OBL raid to distract and cover for the fake birth certificate" theory to cap it all off.
This is right up there with the "fake moon landing" theory and the myriad JFK assassination theories. When I see someone, anyone within the military...someone with some plausibility/credibility like SEAL members or a spec ops officer...or someone within the admin with some plausibility/credibility come forward then and only then will I give a theory like this serious consideration. Otherwise it's just another retread of the Clinton/Whitewater/Ft. Marcy Park conspiracy theories.
In a real conspiracy someone ALWAYS talks. Ask any of the still living Watergate coverup conspirators. Just about the only one who never talked (until it didn't matter anymore) was Liddy. Ask Richard Armitage about Valerie Plame. I could go on and on. Someone always talks. Someone always comes forward. Someone always tells their spouse. It isn't like the movies where the men in black swoop in and kill people right before they squeal.
Ask yourself, "Outside of the military, who in government is actually smart enough and skilled enough to pull sh*t like this off?" And the answer is "no one." Because they are all a pack of idiots. They prove it daily.
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One more thing:
Who in their right mind would conspire to kill any members of the most elite team of trained killers the world has ever known?
Twisting the tail of the tiger is stupid.
Poking the tiger with a sharp stick is suicidal.
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One more thing:
Who in their right mind would conspire to kill any members of the most elite team of trained killers the world has ever known?
Twisting the tail of the tiger is stupid.
Poking the tiger with a sharp stick is suicidal.
People sometimes do stupid things. People who think they are literal gods on earth, and have a right to rule, sometimes do extremely stupid things.
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The thing about Marxists is that they have no morals whatsoever, only the will to power. They use normal peoples' morality as weapons against them.
They succeed because they are so utterly ruthless that they leave normal people standing stunned, like deer in the headlights. Normal people have trouble comprehending why their leaders are deliberately trying to destroy the American economy. Far too many people cling to the notion that Obama is "stupid" and "incompetent". They still can't wrap their minds around the notion that he is purposefully destroying the country with the intention of making them all serfs.
That is a pretty good description of the state of America in the year 2011. The Marxists are running the table, and normal patriotic Americans are just standing around watching them do it. Some of us understand what is going on, but we are few in number. We know what will be necessary to put a stop to it, but nobody wants to fire the first shot.
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One more thing:
Who in their right mind would conspire to kill any members of the most elite team of trained killers the world has ever known?
Twisting the tail of the tiger is stupid.
Poking the tiger with a sharp stick is suicidal.
People sometimes do stupid things. People who think they are literal gods on earth, and have a right to rule, sometimes do extremely stupid things.
Yeah, but when that happens people talk. They ALWAYS talk.
Operation Gun Runner/Fast And Furious comes to mind and people were killed in that one.
I do not buy into any notion that over two dozen US special forces troops could be murdered and no one would say anything about it. This wasn't a team of accountants that was killed. We are talking about a group of men who are trained to think and act independently during missions.
College educated world class killers.
If they had any reason to believe they had been betrayed by anyone in the command chain it would be ugly.
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If they had any reason to believe they had been betrayed by anyone in the command chain it would be ugly.
This is still pretty fresh. I guess we'll see what, if anything, shakes out in the days to come.
Personally, I would welcome a military coup right now. Obama is our Allende, and we need a Pinochet.
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Well, getting back to Anne's theory...
The root of her conspiracy theory is birtherism. That should raise a red flag all by itself.
I have said on more than one occasion that I could give birtherism the benefit of the doubt except for one little inconvenient fact: the newspaper birth announcement. That kills the whole thing.
So...Anne's theory is built upon an extremely bad foundation. And then when you throw in the suicidal notion of betraying/murdering members of the world's most highly trained, elite killers it only gets more implausible and, yes, even ridiculous.
As I said, I like Anne. Her use of strips of bacon as bookmarks in the koran was inspired brilliance and (given the muzzies proclivity toward murder and mayhem) very gutsy.
But this is not logical, reasonable or plausible.
No one would like to see BO get caught doing something criminal more than me but this isn't going to be it.
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Trap, I've always been an agnostic on the subject of Obama's birthplace (and it doesn't even matter at this point), but that birth certificate PDF released by the White House is as fraudulent as the TANG memos from 2004.
I work with Adobe Illustrator, and while I'm no expert by any means, even I know enough to flatten the file before saving it as a PDF. That it wasn't done allows only two possibilities:
1. It was an incredibly incompetent forgery
2. Obama wanted people to discover that it was a forgery
#1 doesn't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling about the abilities and competence of the people running our country and our lives. #2 just leaves me scratching my head. Why?
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My mind tells me Trap is spot-on. But then I ask myself, what is the likelihood that the members of Seal Team 6 who were reported to have taken out bin Laden were all killed in a chopper crash?
There are some very, very curious aspects to this situation, and I frankly doubt that we will ever know if there is more to the truth unless someone comes forward.
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Re: the .pdf file...it doesn't matter to me. I honestly don't need any more proof of his place of birth than the birth announcement in the Hawaii newspaper fifty years ago. That the .pdf file was probably not the real thing is irrelevant to me. The birther nonsense is almost as bad as the truther crap. Using birtherism as the foundation for yet another conspiracy theory is, to me, just plain nuts.
Re: SEAL Team Six...it's too early and there isn't enough reliable information to say anything about this matter. The stuff flying around right now is no more reliable than what was being said in the aftermath of the OBL raid. Let the dust settle and wait to see what comes out. There are all kinds of military blogs that will undoubtedly be a better source of info than the MFM.
I know next to nothing about Navy SEALs. As do most people not directly involved in the program regardless of what they say. I have a friend with a son who is a SEAL. He knows almost nothing about what his son does and where he does it. He doesn't even know what theater of operations he is in let alone what country he is in. And when his son is home on leave he doesn't say anything about the missions he has been on. Zero. Nothing.
That said, common sense leads me to believe that there are significantly more than twenty or thirty men who make up any individual SEAL team. The requirements of troop rotation would be one reason. Also there is the idea that each member (although multi-disciplined) has a specialty and that would mean a large number needed to make up a proper force. Plus the need to have members available to replace those lost to sickness, injury or death. We have no idea at all who the individual members were who were on the OBL raid and we don't know if they were on this helicopter flight. We don't even know if they were Navy SEALs. Really, we don't know*.
Wait for the info to come out. We are not in a good position to discuss the blame for this horrible loss of life at this time.
So, that said, at this time I am much more inclined to chalk it up to the "fog of war" than some all encompassing conspiracy that winds its way all the way up the chain of command to the CIC. BO is a a total puke but I'm not willing to assign him the responsibility for a murder conspiracy of any kind without way more to go on than this nonsense.
*And there is an extremely high likelihood that the New Yorker article (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,2380.0.html) that gave out all kinds of operational details (including, inexplicably, names) about the OBL raid was a total fake.
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That the .pdf file was probably not the real thing is irrelevant to me.
There is nothing "probably" about it. It is completely fake.
*And there is an extremely high likelihood that the New Yorker article (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,2380.0.html) that gave out all kinds of operational details (including, inexplicably, names) about the OBL raid was a total fake.
Barnhardt also has a post about that on her site.
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I profess no expertise in graphic arts so I will take your word for it. That said, there are any number of more plausible explanations for a fake BC than birtherism. The most likely one that I have heard is that his name is not listed on the BC as it is given today.
Personally, I would like to see one or more states require a BC for having a name appear on the ballot. I would also like to see someone leak BO's school transcripts. Especially since someone has seen fit to leak Perry's.
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Yes, I've always been more interested in his school transcripts than his birth certificate.
I've always suspected that they weren't released because they would reveal that his courseload consisted of classes like Marxist Economics, Post-Colonialism, and Racial Grievance Theory.
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Yes, I've always been more interested in his school transcripts than his birth certificate.
I've always suspected that they weren't released because they would reveal that his courseload consisted of classes like Marxist Economics, Post-Colonialism, and Racial Grievance Theory.
I've wondered if he didn't receive grants applied for as an Indonesian citizen.
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He is golfing today.
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Of course he is. Just in the past few days he's presided over the increase of debt to more than 100% of GDP, a first time ever downgrade of our sovereign credit rating, and as the cherry on top he gets to relish in the deaths of our special forces. It's party time in the half-White House
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The birther issue is presently not an issue because -- he's in office. However it will be very important to history illustrating how sloppy we as a nation were in allowing corruption from the literal beginning through ever step of his life to enter into public service. And, if we survive, how to prevent this catastrophe from occurring again.
Frank Davis,
Grandmother - bank officer in charge of federal accounts, ties to State, Hawaii
Grandfarther - close ties to State
Father - a chosen one by the State Department,
Mother in foreign service married to an Indonesian working with Tim Geithner's father in Indonesia
Life in Indonesia,
Traveling under an Indonesian passport.
Travels in Pakistan
College grants as an Indonesian.
College - dope and Marxist studies in a life of privilege,
Bill Ayers and advanced studies
all tangible certification, except his biographical manifesto, cloaked, hidden, and sequestered
The newspaper notice: a newspaper prints those for a fee requiring no certification.
Her narrative is not implausible, it's overwhelming.
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It's also kind of intriguing that Obama's mother knew Timothy Geithner's parents in Indonesia.
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It's also kind of intriguing that Obama's mother knew Timothy Geithner's parents in Indonesia.
The Jarrett family has old connections to the Dunhams as well.
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Creepy
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Creepy
Yah. That sort of sums up Duh Wun.
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The commenter Wolla Dalbo at Neo-neocon (http://neoneocon.com/2011/08/06/bad-news-helicopter-shot-down-in-afghanistan-seals-on-it/#comment-259105) had this to say:
Ann Barnhardt is a very young, intelligent, tough-minded, and apparently successful commodities broker and a bold, well-armed, defiant, militant, conservative Catholic from Colorado who, some of you might know, put up some videos on Youtube a few weeks ago (http://www.youtube.com/user/AnnBarnhardt?feature=mhum (http://www.youtube.com/user/AnnBarnhardt?feature=mhum))–which have had a half a million views so far–in which she read some of the major hateful passages (it must have been hard to choose between so many possible good candidates) from a Qur’an marked with bacon strips, and then set those pages on fire.
She had also challenged any Muslims who object to come to her doorstep—she gives her address at the end of the video—and she promises them that she will defend herself.
Since then, she has been interviewed on several talk radio shows, has put up several more videos, posted several articles on her website (barnhardt.biz) giving her views about Islam, the Jihad, Muslims, and the Obama Administration, and she is now contributing articles to the “American Thinker.”
I don’t agree with Ann’s take and her analysis on everything but, as regards Muslims I think that Ann is right on target. As well, she despises Obama, and flat out calls him a Marxist and a Muslim who is out to destroy America, and I think that she is pretty much on target there as well. In sum, she wouldn’t put anything past him.
Today, she is writing that she believes that the evidence is stacking up in a way that points to the conclusion that the downing of the helicopter carrying a good number of Seal Team 6 members—the Seal Team that “killed Bin Laden”–was, in fact, an attempt by the Obama administration to try to get rid of witnesses to what she believes was a stage-managed, phony takedown of Bin Laden (whose dead body we have never actually seen a picture of, whose DNA test to confirm his identity was supposedly done in record time in a helicopter under field conditions, and whose body was conveniently dumped in the ocean—all within 24 hours of the commencement of the Op) who she believes has actually been dead for several years. Ann is writing that, between the MSM reportage and the information her contacts within the military and ex-military types are feeding her, the picture being created seems, more and more, to confirm her suspicions.
Things, for instance, like the type of helicopter the Seal Team was in, the targeting of this particular team, and the immediate announcement of the shootdown acknowledging the presence of dozens of Seal Team 6 members on the downed helicopter, when such information is usually very closely held and not reported, and certainly not immediately, or so quickly that it was likely on the air before the next of kin had even had a chance to be notified.
You may recall that this take down of Bin Laden happened at a particularly opportune time for Obama, who was facing some particularly bad problems, and once this story hit, it monopolized the MSM and pushed those problems off center stage. Given all that has taken place so far, I can certainly conceive of Obama being ruthless and Machiavellian enough to have such a coup as a phony “killing of Bin Ladin” ready in the wings to be employed when it would help him out the most.
I am usually not a fan of conspiracy theories, but I might remind people here that just a few short years ago many of us would have considered it “conspiracy theory crap” and impossible that a President of the U.S. would spend as utterly ecklessly as Obama has, or nationalize whole sectors of the economy and emasculate commercial contract and bankruptcy law in the process, would try to stir up so much class warfare while living a Louis XVI lifestyle, would deliberately exacerbate Black-White tensions, would run rough-shod over and disregard the Constitution in so many ways, appoint so many radicals to positions of power, push policies that drive unemployment up and employment down, have managed to put almost 50 million people on the food stamp rolls, have the gall to tell us the other day that “extending jobless benefits past 99 weeks was the surest way to create immediate employment,” have wholesaled so many bare-faced lies, presented as true what many experts have called a phony long form birth certificate, or preside over the first ever downgrade of the credit rating of the United States; all the while blaming everyone else in sight (“Bush did it”) for these deliberate lies and acts and resultant catastrophes except himself, his administration and its policies, and the Democratic Party.
In fact, one could say that everything that comes out of this administration—every policy, every decision, every appointment, every statement and justification—turns out, upon examination, to be in some way or other either a deception and/or a lie.
When the Obama administration first came into office I wrote here of us having to use a totally new and radical “template” when trying to comprehend and gauge Obama, and I must admit that I am wondering just how radical and ruthless the actions that that new template covers just might be.
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Dec. 2010: "U.S. Revises Its Rules for Afghan Night Raids" August, 2011: 22 Seals Die
Dear President Putz, Policies have consequences:
The changes in guidelines for nighttime raids, made in consultation with the White House, are intended to expand protections for civilians and increase coordination with higher-level Afghan government officials—without putting new obstacles in the way of the Special Operations units that carry out the raids, according to officials who have reviewed the new order..... A senior military official in Afghanistan said the changes were mostly administrative and would have no impact on operations. -- - WSJ.com
http://americandigest.org/sidelines/2011/08/#a015307 (http://americandigest.org/sidelines/2011/08/#a015307)
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The newspaper notice: a newspaper prints those for a fee requiring no certification.
Her narrative is not implausible, it's overwhelming.
And so the birther narrative would have one believe that fifty years ago that announcement was placed for the sole purpose of validating the birth location of the future president.
Sure.
I still come back to the basic problem with any and all conspiracies: Someone (usually many) always talks. It's inevitable. It's human nature. It happens every single time.
The bigger and more complex the conspiracy, the harder it is to keep it a secret.
The one that Ann describes is monumental. A leviathan conspiracy that would involve the willing and confidential participation of dozens, if not hundreds, of people at multiple levels of responsibility. I can buy into BO wanting to see special forces killed but I can't see the required others silent and willing involvement in treason and murder. Someone always talks.
So, sorry, but no sale. I will entertain such notions only when there is actual evidence.
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My son, recently out of the army and did a stint in Iraq, seemed comcerned to find out Seal team 6 would even be mentioned, not just championed, for the osama exploits.....I remember his comments on why would they name names, so to speak. He thought it dangerous and made them targets. I may be mistaken, but I don't believe the soldiers who pulled saddam out of his hole were championed....at least not so publically.
Now this.....This may not be a conspiracy, but as far as I can see this is layed at the feet of obama. I do not put ANYTHING past this guy. NOTHING. I can completely believe obama using osamas death, whether faked or not, as political gain.
Maybe the shooting down of this chinook, with its passengers is just a bad coincidence, but with this president, I can't help but think....maybe not.
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I'm neither buying nor selling, however ....
And so the birther narrative would have one believe that fifty years ago that announcement was placed for the sole purpose of validating the birth location of the future president.
.... consider for a moment it has nothing at all to do with "the future president" conspiracy, but more of helping to establish a paper-trail for normal, everyday reasons pertaining only to the value of American citizenship.
And, IIRC, the address given in the announcement was the Dunhams, not Stanley Ann's.
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Oh yeah...I'm also asked to believe that government employees (you know: the best and the brightest, the wizards of smart, the imagineers) are capable of conceiving, carrying out and then successfully covering up this fantastical operation?
Really? (http://michellemalkin.com/2011/08/07/government-logo-fail-of-the-day/)
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And so the birther narrative would have one believe that fifty years ago that announcement was placed for the sole purpose of validating the birth location of the future president.
No, it was placed to assure one's son or grandson would grow up with first and not thirdworld status. One can easily envision grandma' posting the notice because the silly girl doesn't understand.
It's not a monster conspiracy it's a list of several disparate acts that have a cumulative result.
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Okay, well, whatever. Agree to disagree I guess.
I'm still putting my money on us not killing our own special forces. As rickl said earlier, that is a bridge too far for me.
I have no doubt whatsoever that BO cares nothing for our troops. He is, after all, an a$$hole.
But I refuse to believe that:
There was a conspiracy to kill SEALs because:
They were involved in a conspiracy to fake the killing of OBL because:
O'Bama needed to distract from the fake BC put out to prevent:
Anyone from paying attention to the Corsi BC book's imminent release because:
BO wasn't really born in Hawaii and is, therefore, not really the legitimate president.
How many others now involved in this conspiracy would have to be killed using this same logic?
And then how many would need to be killed to cover up their killing?
It's like that scene toward the end of Goodfellas when Jimmy Conway started murdering literally everyone involved in the Lufthansa heist. Bodies would be everywhere.
And, yeah, no one would say anything to anyone. Just like with the JFK assassination. And the fake moon landing. And the controlled demolition of the World Trade Center by Dick Cheney and the Jews. And the demolition of the levies in New Orleans by Dick Cheney and the Jews.
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OK, you have the last word.
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trap, did you see the link to the WSJ piece I posted? Nothing conspiratorial; just ROE FUBAR.
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trap, did you see the link to the WSJ piece I posted? Nothing conspiratorial; just ROE FUBAR.
Makes sense to me. ROEs are BS. The enemy doesn't have ROEs. I have posted about that particular bit of politically correct nonsense before where I lamented the end of the concept of "total war."
Total war with a modern fighting force tends to end conflicts very, very quickly with little (if any) loss of troops. At least against cave dwellers without nukes.
As to this shoot down, lacking better information I will go with what appears to be the most likely explanation: a lucky shot with a dumb weapon.
Tragic and totally unnecessary. Turn Afghanistan into a parking lot. Salt their land. Make it an object lesson for the Pakistanis and Iranians.
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That's the place that needs to be left to burn.Just bring them home.
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I'm buying into the info linked from Pandora's post. ROE, specifically the increased coordination with "the Afghan government". It's not hard to imagine some ragheads from the Afghan non-government being brought into the operational loop to appease the kumbaya types at the State Department, and said ragheads promptly informing their coreligionists of the huge opportunity. If they somehow had information that the team on board were SEALs then that would have made it all the more irresistible.
This sort of thing happens in every conflict where the feel-good sentimentalists behind desks in DC make our theater forces pretend that the indigenous units are in any way our peers.
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I'm buying into the info linked from Pandora's post. ROE, specifically the increased coordination with "the Afghan government". It's not hard to imagine some ragheads from the Afghan non-government being brought into the operational loop to appease the kumbaya types at the State Department, and said ragheads promptly informing their coreligionists of the huge opportunity. If they somehow had information that the team on board were SEALs then that would have made it all the more irresistible.
This sort of thing happens in every conflict where the feel-good sentimentalists behind desks in DC make our theater forces pretend that the indigenous units are in any way our peers.
That is my fear too G. It seems more than coincidence or dumb luck that these SOB's got a helo loaded with some of the best we have shot down.
The loss makes me literally sick to my stomach, and my anger toward Obama is at a new high. His actions have been nothing but treasonous. Our ROE's should be to stay several steps ahead of the opposition and to use whatever means necessary to eliminate them from the face of the earth.
I'm just sick and angry!
And now the survivors of the fallen have to bear the burden.
This article just breaks my heart -
http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/08/07/afghanistan.fatality/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/08/07/afghanistan.fatality/index.html)
I just want to hug these people and bring our people home! Obama has lost the war, which was his aim all along, and I don't want to see anymore deaths.
And the military community is going to get kicked in the shorts as the Pentagon budget is about to bear the brunt of what cuts we do get in spending, so we get weaker and weaker by the second.
And losing any number from SEAL Team 6 is bad enough, but this number of losses is staggering.
If there is a Afghani leak, I want them on coals for a long long time before they enter hell!!!
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More contrairianisms:
Confirmed: It was A National Guard Chinook & Crew
Posted by Ann Barnhardt - August 7, AD 2011 6:17 PM MST
From the obituary of Sgt. Patrick Hamburger who served in the Nebraska National Guard as a Chinook Helicopter crewman and crew chief. The family was notified at 5:00pm CDT Saturday afternoon.
Link Here. (http://www.1011now.com/home/headlines/Lincoln_Native_Killed_in_Afghanistan_Helicopter_Crash_127089778.html)
From the article:
Sources from the US military say the giant NATO chopper was called into action as backup. A team conducting a night raid on Taliban fighters was in trouble and the chopper went down as it arrived to help.
Requiescat in pace, Sgt. Hamburger, and all the fallen dead.
Sgt. Hamburger had JUST ARRIVED in Afghanistan a couple of days ago. Why was a green National Guard unit flying backup for DEVGRU SPECOPs? Where was the 160th SOAR backup?
My God.
UPDATE: Additional confirmation that it was a CH-47 transport helo. Copy and paste this URL:
http://blogs.voanews.com/breaking-news/2011/08/07/fighting-at-site-of-us-helicopter-crash-in-central-afghanistan-continues/ (http://blogs.voanews.com/breaking-news/2011/08/07/fighting-at-site-of-us-helicopter-crash-in-central-afghanistan-continues/)
What in the HELL was a CH-47 TRANSPORT helo doing in a DEVGRU combat theater? FILLED WITH 25 SEALS? If the SEALs' MH-47G SPECOPS Chinook that they rode in on was taken out in the Tangi theater, where is the fallen MH-47G helo itself? Shouldn't there also be dead crew members from the 160th SOAR, which is an Army unit? This ain't right, people. I'm telling you. This is NOT RIGHT.
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Spoke to my son about this today. As mentioned earlier, he works on Chinooks.
He tells me that it was a rocket attack and not an RPG. The amount of damage sustained was only possible from a rocket attack. Rocket fired from directly underneath the bird, the only place where it's vulnerable...countermeasures are not functional in such a situation.
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I think your boy is right Trap, the RPG does not have the punch nor accuracy of a rocket, especially in a ground-to-air operation. However, the Taliban do have a history of making them work in that role, but they would have to be close to the target and the target must be level or travelling slower than normal. Most articles state the helo was on approach, so it could have been vulnerable to an RPG attack. The disturbing question is were these scumbags tipped off, or did they bait the area knowing such a force was likely to be sortied and they flew into the trap? If the former I want bodies on racks, if the latter who the hell made the call to send the Op in as described. I would think SpecOp's types wouldn't go in just one direction, they'd come in from a several compass points just to avoid such a trap. We don't have enough of the facts yet to know one way or the other. And I echo CO's concern about the role of the 160th. Anybody with any sense ought to know not to marry up unfamiliar units for an operation and anything SpecOp's does is beyond normal operations, you dance with your regular partners, period, so something seems terribly wrong here. I don't know if the wrong info is getting put out or what. I am also hearing that possibly only 2 of the fallen were from SEAL Team 6, if true the balance would have come from other teams. The info on this is still too fluid. But there is going to be a lot of debriefing and investigations on this one, lets hope the truth doesn't get washed out, the honor of the fallen and their survivors demands nothing less!
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New details (or, more likely, speculation) coming out. (http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/08/taliban-chopper-killer/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+WiredDangerRoom+%28Blog+-+Danger+Room%29)
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The trap was sprung...still don't know if there is a rat back in Kabul!
And I really don't like SEALs rotating through this IRF, they should have their own missions and stick with the 160th!
I wanna know who authorized both deviations!
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The trap was sprung...still don't know if there is a rat back in Kabul!
And I really don't like SEALs rotating through this IRF, they should have their own missions and stick with the 160th!
I wanna know who authorized both deviations!
Cha-ching
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The trap was sprung...still don't know if there is a rat back in Kabul!
And I really don't like SEALs rotating through this IRF, they should have their own missions and stick with the 160th!
I wanna know who authorized both deviations!
Cha-ching
!!And the place is full of rats.And it doesn't take that much to buy them.
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If these opinions are not posted here they will disappear within a few days.
Conspiracy, probably not, corrupt to the gills for sure. We must know who OK'd these radical breaches of protocol. More questions and inconsistencies:
There are No Identifiable Remains
Posted by Ann Barnhardt - August 8, AD 2011 6:54 PM MST
There are NO identifiable remains - none, but yet the government was publicly braying within hours exactly who was on the chopper by unit. In the chaos of a combat theater, how could they be certain exactly who was on that chopper, and how many, if there were NO IDENTIFIABLE REMAINS? How did they know there were no captures? Or KIAs whose bodies were drug away by the Taliban?
Reuters citation here. (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/08/us-afghanistan-usa-remains-idUSTRE7776BH20110808)
Contradiction.
Posted by Ann Barnhardt - August 8, AD 2011 6:17 PM MST
Which is it? Were they inbound and crashed, or outbound and caught as they were departing?
It can't be both.
Copy and paste these URLs into your address bar.
Version 1: Inbound
http://investmentwatchblog.com/us-helicopter-crashed-in-taliban-trap-afghan-official/ (http://investmentwatchblog.com/us-helicopter-crashed-in-taliban-trap-afghan-official/)
Version 2: Outbound
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/08/taliban-chopper-killer/ (http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/08/taliban-chopper-killer/)
Goodness. I can't imagine why I'm skeptical. Direct contradiction is usually so . . . consoling.
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CO there are so many meadow muffins out there you can't believe any of it till later in the game. This is a lot like who's on first than an accurate report from any of them.
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I understand, but whatever the results they will show a massive FUBAR, I think.
The media wants to pass it off as another accident and it's not. Information will disappear from Google etc and like the Predsdent's other unrelated FUBAR's such as the economy, the rule of law, the information should be collected and then sorted.
If it was good enough for A.Weiner it's darn well good enough for Team 6.
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The honor of these men and the loved ones they left behind deserve nothing but the truth of this entire affair. I hope we get there, but I fear some of the troubling questions we've raised are going to get sanitized.
This ABC link I put in the has pics of some of the fallen, I flicked through each one and my thoughts and prayers are with their family and friends back home.
http://www.wjla.com/pictures/2011/08/photos-of-the-fallen-30-americans-shot-down-in-afghanistan-/robert-reeves-6219-451.html (http://www.wjla.com/pictures/2011/08/photos-of-the-fallen-30-americans-shot-down-in-afghanistan-/robert-reeves-6219-451.html)
I also put a tribute under the Departed thread -
http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,2414.new.html#new (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,2414.new.html#new)
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Breaking news: Taliban fighters who shot down helicopter get waxed by F-16 strike. (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44088691/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/#.TkKX3WaATAZ)
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Breaking news: Taliban fighters who shot down helicopter get waxed by F-16 strike. (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44088691/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/#.TkKX3WaATAZ)
Hmmm.... ::thinking:: Now ALL the witnesses are silenced!
::stirpot:: ::pokeineye:: ::slapfight:: ::unknowncomic:: ::exitstageleft::
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SEAL TEAM 6 - INVESTIGATE THE WHITE HOUSE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fega1aM-ax8#ws)
The Daily Caller (http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/29/thedc-interview-tea-party-leader-tom-trento-on-his-attack-on-allen-west-and-the-budget-battle/)
The Hill newspaper reports that Tom Trento, who heads up a grassroots foreign policy group called United West and serves in a leadership role in a number of other Tea Party-related groups, has affixed the label “Tea Party defector” to several Tea Party-connected members of Congress who have come out in support of the Boehner debt plan (without a provision for a balanced budget amendment), including Florida Rep. Allen West.
The Daily Caller caught up with Trento to discuss his attack on West and his position on the debt ceiling debate. Link (http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/29/thedc-interview-tea-party-leader-tom-trento-on-his-attack-on-allen-west-and-the-budget-battle/)
The United West (http://theunitedwest.org/)
Uniting the West to Defeat Shariah Islam
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I'm with Levin on this. They should be using heavy bombers to saturate entire areas. I'm sick of our people having to endure unnecessary risk to appease the hand-wringers in the State Department.
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The man makes some excellent points.
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That's 8.
When we are serious about wiping them all off the face of the earth, then we'll be doing it right.
Anything less is a joke and negates a reason for being there.
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When we are serious about wiping them all off the face of the earth, then we'll be doing it right.
Anything less is a joke and negates a reason for being there.
Indeed. I'm not even opposed to using biological or chemical weapons in area attacks. What's it going to do? Encourage them to reciprocate? As if they aren't trying to do that anyway?
This is not the "putting out fires" that the establishment likes to portray it as. This is a showdown of civilizations, or more accurately a showdown of a civilization against a barbarian horde that wants to drag the world a few millennia into the dark past. This is not something unique to the early 21st Century. Since its inception the demonic devotees of that ideology have waged war against all civilizations, whether our own Western civilization, or the pre-Islamic Persians, the Indians, the Egyptians and Berbers, I mean the list goes on and on. We need to destroy them utterly.
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When we are serious about wiping them all off the face of the earth, then we'll be doing it right.
Anything less is a joke and negates a reason for being there.
Indeed. I'm not even opposed to using biological or chemical weapons in area attacks. What's it going to do? Encourage them to reciprocate? As if they aren't trying to do that anyway?
This is not the "putting out fires" that the establishment likes to portray it as. This is a showdown of civilizations, or more accurately a showdown of a civilization against a barbarian horde that wants to drag the world a few millennia into the dark past. This is not something unique to the early 21st Century. Since its inception the demonic devotees of that ideology have waged war against all civilizations, whether our own Western civilization, or the pre-Islamic Persians, the Indians, the Egyptians and Berbers, I mean the list goes on and on. We need to destroy them utterly.
Agreed. And using Takkiya against them, undercutting them at every turn, and taking full advantage of every opportunity to crush them.
People that do not understand the them or us nature of this war fail to realize that we cannot subscribe to their naive assertion that not all Muzzies are bad...because too many bad guys would be let in the gate to kill us and the only way these idiots would realize that is when their head is being hacked off...and by then it's too late, isn't it?
::gaah::
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If the Danny Pearle video didn't penetrate their distorted perception shield nothing will.
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Makes them pretty sick, sorry & sad doesn't it?
And more than useless!
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If the Danny Pearle video didn't penetrate their distorted perception shield nothing will.
That should have been more truth than anybody could stand.But it did nothing.
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Miss Barnhardt doesn't forget.
SEAL Team 6 - UPDATE: Dossier Removed
Posted by Ann Barnhardt - October 13, AD 2011 9:29 PM MST
U.S. Central Command has released its official report on the SEAL Team 6 shoot-down, which resulted in 38 dead, including an entire 15-man DEVGRU Gold Squadron, which is the best of the best of the best in the SEAL community. In addition, another 8 SEALS were also killed. 23 SEALS on one National Guard helo.
Here is the URL for the full document directory.
http://tinyurl.com/6zdtelz (http://tinyurl.com/6zdtelz)
It is probably in excess of 10,000 pages. But, I have already found something very interesting and disturbing.
On page 118 of the first interview transcript, an interviewee identified as JSOTF J3 says:
JSOTF J3: I believe it was two IEDs that they found and no detonations. So the ground force commander -- let me back up. The ground force commander made a call at 0328 Zulu that he assessed no survivors from the crash. So the battle space owner arrived at 0721 Zulu; they linked up with (redacted) , and they recovered -- the ground force commander, (redacted) , he called back and said they had identified, and removed 38 remains, is what he called back. So they were able to pull them out. And, you know, later on after he came out, we, kind of, got the back brief of how they were able to do that. But there was -- I will let you talk to him about that piece. But he was essentially able to identify 38 remains there.
IO-DEP: Was there a manifest for that aircraft back at the --
JSOTF J3: Yes, sir. And I'm sure you know by now the manifest was accurate with the exception of the (redacted) personnel that were on. So the (redacted) personnel, they were the incorrect -- all seven names were incorrect. And I cannot talk to the back story of why, but --
View it in context here on page 118. (http://www2.centcom.mil/sites/foia/rr/CENTCOM%20Regulation%20CCR%2025210/Wardak%20CH-47%20Investigation/r_EX%2001.pdf) [PDF doc.]
The "seven" that is referenced and redacted is, almost certainly, the Afghani contingent. There were 7 Afghanis on the helo. And this soldier testifies that ALL SEVEN NAMES of the presumed Afghanis on the flight manifest were incorrect. Wow. That is ominous, and certainly warrants further investigation. (Hello? Journalists?) I have worried all along that there could have been a suicide bomber, but an erroneous flight manifest of Afghanis also points to the possibility of some compromise of OPSEC.
Naturally there is a lot more to read. Given the sheer volume of data, the more eyes on this stuff, the better.
Also be sure to read page 111-112 where the soldier theorizes on why so many men were packed on the one helo. He says the planners felt that one helo in and out was "lower risk", and that the advance warning given to the enemy in a multi-helo insertion put the second helo at increased risk. Given what happened to "EXTORTION 17", I think that the argument in favor of the long-standing combat tactical concept of "dispersion protocol", namely not putting all of your precious eggs in one basket, is now very much back on the table. Even so, I still can not fathom why they were in a National Guard transport helo and not an up-armored, up-teched MH-47G. If it is a risky insertion, and two helos are deemed an inferior tactic, why not use the combat helo that has increased night vision and infrared imaging, and perhaps more importantly, MORE HORSEPOWER for a more rapid approach and departure?
Read up. If you find anything else that you think merits a look, note the file and page number and then notify someone. It could be me, although I'm certainly not the best person for this sort of thing. Again, I would probably send it to someone over at BigPeace.com which is Breitbart's military blog, or another military blog that you think does a good job.
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UPDATE: The entire dossier has been removed by CentCom. The links are now dead. I'm kicking myself for not downloading the PDF files themselves last night.
So they pulled the dossier, that make me feel more secure.
Nothing to see here, move along.
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interesting...
::thinking::
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Good find CO, sure as hell leaves all our worst fears surrounding this fustercluck fully in play.
I am resigned to the fact that learning the full truth about everything that happened and who made the calls may never be known, but every time I think about all the priceless people we lost on that helo I just get blindingly enraged that such a thing could happen.
And "dispersion protocol" should never have been violated! You're in a fricken Taliban/AQ warzone for crying out loud!
A loss of this magnitude demands the maximum level of accountability...and there is no accountability to be had.
This is stunningly demoralizing.
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This is stunningly demoralizing.
More (she's a bulldog isn't she?):
My Points on the SEAL Shootdown Verified
Posted by Ann Barnhardt - October 25, AD 2011 2:07 PM MST
I take no pleasure or satisfaction in having my points regarding the SEAL shootdown confirmed and validated. First, those men are dead. This isn't a TV show or a damn movie. Those men were real, not characters, and they will never be with their loved ones on earth again. Mirth is simply not possible in this situation. Second, the fact that a 34 year old female commodity broker who never so much as took ROTC in high school apparently has a firmer grasp of combat tactics than the majority of the command tier of the United States Military is simultaneously disgusting, nauseating, infuriating and terrifying. I'm telling you, stupid people who have no integrity are running the world. These upper-level military guys will toe the politically-correct bee-ess line and would gladly suck the chrome off of a trailer hitch in order to gain rank and protect that sweet pension. My contempt for such men knows no bounds.
The SEALS were unnecessarily sent into a situation that did not require their elite skills, were put on one craft in breach of dispersion protocol, were inserted into an area in which the enemy had hours of notice and their insertion had NO COVER, and they were in a model of aircraft that had no night vision and was not designed for combat insertion.
Either the U.S. Military is being run by slack-jawed, mouth-breathing mental defectives, or something nefarious was afoot. Or both.
Please read the Washington Times piece HERE (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/oct/24/full-story-of-seal-mission-in-question/).
By the time the CH-47 transport helicopter descended to 150 feet above an unprotected landing zone in Afghanistan around 2 a.m. on Aug. 6, the element of surprise had been lost. Link (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/oct/24/full-story-of-seal-mission-in-question/)
...
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No support.
"He said his 'comfort level is low because they don’t fly like ARSOA. They don’t plan like ARSOA. They don’t land like ARSOA. They will either, you know, kind of, do a runway landing. Or if it’s a different crew that trains different areas, they will do the pinnacle landing.' The investigation discovered that ARSOA helicopters were pulled out of the area last year and moved to the south. 'I still don’t really understand the reasons behind that,' an investigator said."
No ARSOA.
No accountability.
I want high-ranking heads on pikes! The magnitude of this negligence demands it!
::gaah::
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No support.
"He said his 'comfort level is low because they don’t fly like ARSOA. They don’t plan like ARSOA. They don’t land like ARSOA. They will either, you know, kind of, do a runway landing. Or if it’s a different crew that trains different areas, they will do the pinnacle landing.' The investigation discovered that ARSOA helicopters were pulled out of the area last year and moved to the south. 'I still don’t really understand the reasons behind that,' an investigator said."
No ARSOA.
No accountability.
I want high-ranking heads on pikes! The magnitude of this negligence demands it!
::gaah::
Did you forget who'e in power ?
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No support.
"He said his 'comfort level is low because they don’t fly like ARSOA. They don’t plan like ARSOA. They don’t land like ARSOA. They will either, you know, kind of, do a runway landing. Or if it’s a different crew that trains different areas, they will do the pinnacle landing.' The investigation discovered that ARSOA helicopters were pulled out of the area last year and moved to the south. 'I still don’t really understand the reasons behind that,' an investigator said."
No ARSOA.
No accountability.
I want high-ranking heads on pikes! The magnitude of this negligence demands it!
::gaah::
Did you forget who'e in power ?
I forgot nothing.
I just left it to imaginations as to whose heads occupy a pike!
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People in the SpecOps community and their families do not forget and are unyielding in their determination...these peope and their families are typically made up of the most robust patriotic fabric, they are not going to relent until they have full satisfaction...nor should they...so it is only those ignorant, misguided and truly un-American types who will look upon this effort as pointless, the majority of us wish them well and hope they are successful.
::praying::
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/08/families-of-seal-team-6-to-reveal-why-they-think-the-govt-is-as-much-responsible-for-the-death-of-their-sons-as-the-taliban/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/08/families-of-seal-team-6-to-reveal-why-they-think-the-govt-is-as-much-responsible-for-the-death-of-their-sons-as-the-taliban/)
PS- I did not know about the muzzie incubus! ::outrage:: ::overkill::
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PS- I did not know about the muzzie incubus! ::outrage:: ::overkill::
Nor I. I pray for closure for the families and the ones responsible for this fuster cluck fry in hell.
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PS- I did not know about the muzzie incubus! ::outrage:: ::overkill::
Nor I. I pray for closure for the families and the ones responsible for this fuster cluck fry in hell.
Love to arrange the meeting!!! machinegun
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People in the SpecOps community and their families do not forget and are unyielding in their determination...these peope and their families are typically made up of the most robust patriotic fabric, they are not going to relent until they have full satisfaction...nor should they...so it is only those ignorant, misguided and truly un-American types who will look upon this effort as pointless, the majority of us wish them well and hope they are successful.
::praying::
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/08/families-of-seal-team-6-to-reveal-why-they-think-the-govt-is-as-much-responsible-for-the-death-of-their-sons-as-the-taliban/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/05/08/families-of-seal-team-6-to-reveal-why-they-think-the-govt-is-as-much-responsible-for-the-death-of-their-sons-as-the-taliban/)
PS- I did not know about the muzzie incubus! ::outrage:: ::overkill::
Here is the radical cleric’s curse on our fallen SEALs.
Amen. I shelter in Allah from the devil who has been cast with stones.
In the name of Allah the merciful forgiver.
The companions of “THE FIRE”
(The sinners and infidels who are fodder for the hell fire)
ARE NOT EQUAL WITH the companions of heaven.
The companions of heaven (Muslims) are the WINNERS.
Had he sent this Koran to the mountain, you would have seen the mountain prostrated in fear of Allah.
(Mocking the GOD of Moses)
Such examples are what we present to the people, so that they would think.
(repent and convert to Islam)
Blessings are to your God (Allah) the God of glory and what they describe.
And peace be upon the messengers (prophets) and thanks be to Allah the lord of both universes (mankind and Jinn).
For the record – Political correctness killed these heroes – then political correctness allowed them to be insulted at their funeral service.
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2013/05/outrage-obama-administration-allowed-radical-cleric-to-curse-us-navy-seal-heroes-at-funeral-services-video/ (http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2013/05/outrage-obama-administration-allowed-radical-cleric-to-curse-us-navy-seal-heroes-at-funeral-services-video/)
Lots of payback coming down the pike .......
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Bob lee Swagger
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Bob lee Swagger
Swear to God.
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Still no satisfaction for the families...almost 2 years later...
http://www.wnd.com/2013/07/unanswered-questions-plague-seal-team-6-losses/ (http://www.wnd.com/2013/07/unanswered-questions-plague-seal-team-6-losses/)
...makes me ill...
...may God strike down these evil bastards in this Regime!!!
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Congress finally gets around to looking into this...not sure if any answers will be gotten to resolve the many questionable issues surrounding this event...but it is a chance for families and supporters to demand them.
http://thehill.com/homenews/house/313039-congress-to-probe-lethal-seal-crash (http://thehill.com/homenews/house/313039-congress-to-probe-lethal-seal-crash)
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A year later and neither Congress or anybody else done anything or held anyone accountable!
Totally unforgivable!!!
One guy trying to push it back into view...
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/07/michael-savage-seal-team-six-was-set-up-and-murdered-in-afghanistan-video/ (http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/07/michael-savage-seal-team-six-was-set-up-and-murdered-in-afghanistan-video/)
...heck I didn't even know he was around anymore. He can be a little wacky.
Anyway, anybody with a brain knows they were set up, the template for failure was established as soon as Obama's ROE's expanded Afghani roles in military operations, when dispersion protocols were discarded, when sticking with the SEALs own DEVGRU and 160th SOAR was discarded and rotations through IRF started...marrying up disparate and unfamiliar units and equipment...etc etc...
The Afghani contamination and operating outside normal parameters and using a big slow CH-47 all conspired to achieve the impossible...and those responsible for making those calls should all be swinging...
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Well it's been almost three years and nothing ever came of that effing Congressional investigation...probably because the main finger of guilt pointed right back at that fricken rat-bastard Obama! And these cowering little bed-wetting finger-sucking pussies could never confront that asshole on ANYTHING!
On August 6, 2011, 30 US service members were killed when a CH-47 Chinook helicopter they were being transported in crashed in Wardak province, Afghanistan. It was the deadliest single loss for U.S. forces in the decade-long war in Afghanistan. 17 members of the elite Navy SEALs were killed in the crash.
Circa News had an exclusive interview with retired Air Force officer, Joni Marquez who has recently come forward to give her eyewitness account of one of the most deadly attacks on Navy SEALs in history.
What really happened that night in Afghanistan where 17 Navy SEALs and 14 other U.S. Military personnel including a Military working dog were killed in a Chinook helicopter? The incredibly brave, Joni Marquez gives us a lot more insight to that tragic night.
Via Circa News:
A decorated retired Air Force officer who witnessed one of the most deadly attacks on Navy SEALs in U.S. history is breaking her silence, saying the government covered up evidence detailing that the 2011 downing of a Chinook helicopter gunship that killed 38 fighters in Afghanistan could have been prevented had it not been for restrictions to the military’s rules of engagement that were changed under the Obama administration.
Circa News describes the Mission:
August 6, 2011: Retired Air Force Capt. Joni Marquez and her crew were working the dark morning hours aboard an AC-130 gunship after being summoned to a mission she describes “as almost like a 9-1-1 type of a situation.”
The gunship was ordered to fly close-in air support above Afghanistan’s dangerous Tangi Valley, in Wardak Province, assisting troops with the Army’s 75th Ranger Regiment who were being fired on by eight heavily armed Taliban insurgents.
The Rangers had called in for assault helicopters to engage the enemy hiding among the rocky valley. The air weapons team fired on the Taliban fighters, but not all of the insurgents were killed as originally believed.
Marquez begged for permission to engage several times, yet was denied…
“We had seen two of them (insurgents) moving, crawling away from the area, as to not really make a whole lot of scene,” she recalled.
Monitoring the scene from above, she relayed the scene to the ground force commander. “You have two enemy forces that are still alive,” she said. “Permission to engage.”
They were denied.
Marquez told Circa the ground commander’s decision to not allow her crew to engage the two enemy fighters sealed the fate of those involved in Extortion 17.
The rules of engagement set by the Obama administration were specifically designed to protect Muslims and put our brave men and women serving our country in danger.
A retired Special Operation Combat Vet told TGP reporter Cristina Laila that this crash was the greatest single loss of life ever suffered by the Special Operations community in the 24 year history of the U.S. Special Operations Command. He also said, “it is tactically unsound to put that many Special Operators in one bird (helicopter)”.
Why was this Chinook helicopter hovering for 13 minutes making our men sitting ducks?
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/04/retired-air-force-captain-whistleblower-says-pentagon-covered-real-story-extortion-17-helicopter-crash/ (http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/04/retired-air-force-captain-whistleblower-says-pentagon-covered-real-story-extortion-17-helicopter-crash/)
I believe her, it all tracks with the pieces we've put together since this event!
*It was a set-up from the start, and the Obama Regime is complicit in it! The ROE's kept getting worse under Obama, and the engagement rules prevented these survivors on the ground from being sent directly to Hell! Having Afghani's in your HQ planning ops and having 7 of them on your flight (and whose names were not correct) stinks to high heaven!
*Trap's boy provided reasons against an RPG and for a rocket that appeared then and now to be spot on!
*The 160th was not used for this op, just the IRF, and having this many SpecOp's on one flight grossly violated normal dispersal protocols!
*SEAL Team Six folks back here in the back-channel said "Investigate the White House" from the get-go!
*Family of the fallen then and now blame the government as much if not more than the damned enemy, and for good reason!
I will NEVER forgive Obama and his minions or any of the REMFs and D-MC dirt-sweepers for this! NEVER!!!
For all intents and purposes Obama executed these men!!!
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Well it's been almost three years and nothing ever came of that effing Congressional investigation...probably because the main finger of guilt pointed right back at that fricken rat-bastard Obama! And these cowering little bed-wetting finger-sucking pussies could never confront that asshole on ANYTHING
He's in it up to his candy ass!! This is a direct result of
RULES OF ENGAGEMENT" BUNGHOLE!
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(http://i585.photobucket.com/albums/ss291/libertasinfinitio/Patriots/WTH_zpsa0jcjhi0.jpg)
(http://i585.photobucket.com/albums/ss291/libertasinfinitio/Warnings/tumblr_ny2lygcfbl1r7p8tto1_500_zps0xkqhanw.jpg)
(http://i585.photobucket.com/albums/ss291/libertasinfinitio/Misc/afterlife%20traffic_zpsi0otucos.jpg)
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One wonders if US wars lead to terrorism, refugees, debt, and tyranny.
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Failed Congressional oversight only exceeded by Obama-Biden era incompetence and complicity!
https://twitter.com/Annakhait/status/1315391500155523084 (https://twitter.com/Annakhait/status/1315391500155523084)
CIA whistelblower says there are documents video and audio to prove Obama-Biden blackmail and extortion...
https://www.ar15.com/forums/General/BREAKING-New-Benghazi-Info-SEAL-Team-6-Deaths-and-its-connection-to-Obiden-and-Iran/5-2377886/ (https://www.ar15.com/forums/General/BREAKING-New-Benghazi-Info-SEAL-Team-6-Deaths-and-its-connection-to-Obiden-and-Iran/5-2377886/)
I hope President Trump is being briefed...it certainly fills in gaps on the despicable Obama-Iran deal...
https://freedomoutpost.com/extortion-17-is-a-bigger-scandal-and-betrayal-than-benghazi/ (https://freedomoutpost.com/extortion-17-is-a-bigger-scandal-and-betrayal-than-benghazi/)
I said from the start that these deaths and everything surrounding it stunk to high heaven...maybe after all of these years the truth will come out...and maybe the guilty will be made to pay!
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Knowing how thoroughly evil these people are...I find this allegation entirely too likely...and it certainly would lend itself to do something so despicably evil to cover it up...
https://twitter.com/VFL2013/status/1315904213520715778
The bill coming due for these bastards is beyond enormous...
This is going to have me spitting fire until justice has been dealt to every last one of these traitors!!!
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Thanks for reminding me.