Author Topic: Highly processed foods cause metabolic diseases; consume US healthcare budget  (Read 1626 times)

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Online patentlymn

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He is normally too long winded but he talks fast here.
Metabolic disease is eating up most of the US healthcare budget and it is not curable with drugs but with food.
In short, the cause is highly processed foods, not carbs vs low carbs or fats.

Up to 10 min he gives a fast summary of how many people are obese and healthy vs normal weight and having the same metabolic disease as the obese.
Some normal weight people have fatty liver disease!
So fat is not the cause of metabolic disease at least not all the time.
These 8 problems are not druggable but are foodable
10 min he goes into cellular mechanisms.
15 min insulin resistance/sensitivity is much more important than obesity
16 min replacing kids' sugar with starch fixed metabolic disease
18 min how sugar harms cells
22 min end of mechanisms
23 min ultra processed food percent predicts obesity!. People eating more ultra processed foods eat more and get more cancer. High fat or high carb does not matter. It is processed food that matters!!! Processed is high sugar low fiber. Unprocessed is low sugar high fiber.
25:30 The hateful eight diseases that aren't diseases and which don't have any medicines except diet. Nice chart summary.

26 min. US sugar consumption since 1820 vs percent US health care spending.
27 min. In 1960 processed food introduced and health care spending shot up.
28 min. Commentary by others.

I linked to 23 min plot
https://youtu.be/o-QO33hfadY?t=1396
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Offline Weisshaupt

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He is normally too long winded but he talks fast here.
Metabolic disease is eating up most of the US healthcare budget and it is not curable with drugs but with food.
In short, the cause is highly processed foods, not carbs vs low carbs or fats.

Low Carb diet was the only one that worked for me,  but now my body learned the keto trick, it needs no food at all.
If I do have a lot of carbs now, by body sees them as needless and pretty much ignores and rejects them
But when I was having carbs they tended to be complex carbs - not processed.

With prices what they are you are better off buying the basics and skipping the processed grain foods anyway .. except maybe bread.
Fresh veggies, meat, eggs, cheese...


Offline Libertas

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He is normally too long winded but he talks fast here.
Metabolic disease is eating up most of the US healthcare budget and it is not curable with drugs but with food.
In short, the cause is highly processed foods, not carbs vs low carbs or fats.

Low Carb diet was the only one that worked for me,  but now my body learned the keto trick, it needs no food at all.
If I do have a lot of carbs now, by body sees them as needless and pretty much ignores and rejects them
But when I was having carbs they tended to be complex carbs - not processed.

With prices what they are you are better off buying the basics and skipping the processed grain foods anyway .. except maybe bread.
Fresh veggies, meat, eggs, cheese...

It's a conspiracy I tell ya...sugar tastes good, many fibers do not...not fair!

OK, pointless bleating over.  I admit, I take a short-cut or two for expediency...I'm naughty and I admit it.

Query re: bread - are you advocating it is OK to buy store bought or OK to make from scratch with processed flour?
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Online Pandora

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Processed flour notwithstanding (and you can get unbleached and unbromated flour), in plain homemade bread you get flour, yeast, little salt, water.  Period.

Check the label on the store-bought bread for a lot of stuff you don't need.
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Online patentlymn

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« Last Edit: November 01, 2021, 06:10:09 PM by patentlymn »
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Online Pandora

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Is olive oil considered a seed oil?
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Offline Libertas

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The olive is a fruit but like al fruits they have seeds inside them...so olive oil could be considered a seed oil...but I think a distinction can be made based upon fruit vs vegetable.  It's the veggie variety - corn oil, canola etc that are more prevalent.

Funny, Cambridge clowns classify fresh F&V as Group 1 lightly processed...  ::)

Just logistics is not processing the food...   ::bus::
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Online patentlymn

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Is olive oil considered a seed oil?

I do not know. The seed oils are mostly poly unsaturated fatty acids (PUFA) and olive oil is mostly mono unsaturated and is said to be healthier. Coconut oil is mostly saturated fat. Some people believe that saturated fat is bad for you but others believe it is good for you. I do not think there is evidence that saturated fat is bad for you.

The fact that PUFAs are made in industrial plants does not bother me. What counts is what is in the product. They may be harmful. I am not sure.

Concern over seed/vegetable oils seems to be recent. Humans did not consume such oils in large quantities until recently. I have no idea how much soybean oil was consumed in the past but the amount has shot up in recent decades.
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Online Pandora

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Soy and soybean oil is in a surprising (to me) amount of food products.  My favorite mayo, Duke's, is made of it, about which I am not happy.  Fortunately, I don't eat a lot of it, but rats! Duke's, sliced tomatoes, S&P on crappy white bread!  Love those.
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Online paulh

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I have to get my Dukes supply on line, still no sugar in it.

Online patentlymn

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Soy and soybean oil is in a surprising (to me) amount of food products.  My favorite mayo, Duke's, is made of it, about which I am not happy.  Fortunately, I don't eat a lot of it, but rats! Duke's, sliced tomatoes, S&P on crappy white bread!  Love those.

I started reading salad dressing labels. Soybean oil in most. I may make my own but I am new to cooking.
Labels I expected to be healthier have soybean oil. Then again, the amount of soybean oil in dressing is not that much. I mean you do not eat that much of it, even if it is the main ingredient.

Some people use Greek yogurt as a base for salad dressings.
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Offline Libertas

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My 2 favorites:

Roka Blue Cheese (also great as a cheeseball ingredient)

Ingredients
Soybean Oil, Water, Vinegar, Blue Cheese (Milk, Cheese Culture, Salt, Enzymes), Sugar, Contains Less than 2% of Salt, Modified Food Starch, Natural Flavor, Xanthan Gum, Phosphoric Acid, Polysorbate 60, Dried Garlic, Dried Onions, Lactic Acid, Artificial Color, Beta Carotene (Color), Potassium Sorbate and Calcium Disodium EDTA (to Protect Flavor).

Cardini's Caesar

Ingredients:
Soybean Oil, Water, White Wine Vinegar, Parmesan Cheese (Part-Skim Milk, Cheese Culture, Salt, Enzymes), Egg Yolk, Distilled Vinegar, Salt, Garlic*, Spice, Lemon Juice Concentrate, Mustard Seed, Natural Flavor, Onion*, Xanthan Gum, Corn Syrup, Potassium Sorbate (Added To Maintain Freshness), Anchovies, Calcium Disodium Edta Added To Protect Flavor, Celery Seed, Tamarind. *Dehydrated
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Online patentlymn

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I know it seems like I obsess on this seed/vegetable oil issue. It is just curiosity. Everyone here has heard of low carb, vegan, carnivore, keto, plant based, etc so I do not post on that. This oil issue is still new to me.  My brother just had an angiogram and needs 2 stents put in so there is that. They had to wait because he has kidney issues and need to manage the contrast media carefully.

Summary: Omega-6 linoleic acid may be very harmful. People eating very high saturated fat or very high complex carbs can be very healthy.

15:37 high pufa oils listed
15:56 US vegetable oil consumption since 1865. 1909 2 gm a day to 2010 80 gm per day which is 720 cal or 32% of US calories. 1900 99% of fats from animals now 86% from vegetable oils. 1980 dietary guidelines.
17:43 world wide vegetable oil consumption 1963-2003 big increase Data is 17 years old.
18:04 comparison of dietary fats. Sat fats in red. OM-6 linoleic acid in blue. omega 3 alphas linoleic acid yellow mega 9 oleic acid. Olive oil has some blue much yellow
19:00 1865 om-6 <1% calories, 1909 om-6 2% calories, 1999 om-6 LA in 7% of calories, 2008 om-6 LA is 11.8% of calories. 12x increase in 145 years.
20:00 sat fat is flat, veg oils increased, heart disease increased.
20:53 maasai eat sat fat no heart disease and lean, milk, meat, and blood. 66% animal fat. 1.7 percent om-6 LA. 33-45 percent sat fat.
23:00 tokelau islands. 54-62 percent cal from coconut, coconut oil is 91-94 % sat fat.  53% of diet is fat, 48% sat fat. 2 % of diet is PUFA. Eat coconut, fish, starchy tubers, and fruit. No obesity, diabetes, heart disease.
24:14om-6 linoleic acid.  Percent LA in adipose tissue in US population 1955 to 2005. 9.1 percent in 1959 to 21.5 percent in 2008. Doubled.
25:34 om-6 in tokelaunans is 3.8% in 1968.
25:51 tukisenta   paupua new guinea sweet potatoes are >90percent of calories, plus some pork or chicken. So almost all starch, carbs. 94.6% carb, 3% protein, 2.4 % fat 0.6% om-6 LA. No heart disease obesity, diabetes, macro nuclear degeneration.

27 min. What mattered? Om-6 PUFA!
29 min. How the on-6 biochemistry works and harms. Mitochondrial dysfunction. Insulin resistance.
33:45 isocaloric diets rats 3 groups. only om-6 varied. beef tallow om-6 4.4%, olive oil 7.7%, safflower oil 36.6%. All on high fat diet of 59% calories. 3 weeks.
34:19  results in body fat om-6 LA percent. Beef fat 10.3%, olive oil 15.2%, safflower oil 54.5%.
35:00 weight gain, olive oil gained 9.6% more than beef (14.8 human) and safflower oil 15.6% more than beef (24 pounds human). All same calories in diet. BUT they messed up in that they added linseed oil.
Beef fat  only was not studied, as linseed oil added to all.
36:30 rat heart failure study. high pufa 20% sunflower oil, vs normal lab chow. In 4 weeks, oil group had 32% decrease in heart output.
37:15 isocaloric diet. 40% fat. Chow vs. 4% soy oil vs 19% soy oil. 32 weeks, 7.5 months. Body weights show 31 g, 4% soy 39 g, 19% soy 49 g. 1.2% LA, 2.2 LA, and 10.0% LA in diet in the three groups. No sugar.
Mice on 19% soy oil weighed 55% more than mice on chow. Human equivalent 190 pounds vs 294 pound man, in 7.5 months. Same calories.
39 min. Soy oil diet rapidly induced diabetes. 
Green plot 25% Fructose,  40 percent fat (36% coconut, 4% soy oil) did NOT cause diabetes.
Soy oil diet induced insulin resistance worse than soy/fructose diet.
40:20 soy oil induced fatty liver disease.
41 min. Soil oil caused cancers. 19 percent soy oil worse than 19 percent soy oil plus 25% fructose.

https://youtu.be/7kGnfXXIKZM?t=937
Dr. Chris Knobbe - 'Diseases of Civilization: Are Seed Oil Excesses the Unifying Mechanism?'
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Offline Libertas

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Oh Lordy...so many obese soy-boyz...

Dumb as a mouse...

 ::laughonfloor::
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Online patentlymn

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Oh Lordy...so many obese soy-boyz...

Dumb as a mouse...

 ::laughonfloor::


In short, 1/3 of US calories are from seed/vegetable oils, mostly in processed foods. Mostly soybean oil. This may be responsible for the metabolic diseases such as heart disease, obesity, insulin resistance, etc.

There has been so much bad diet info from the govt over the past decades people, including myself, are resistant to new recommendations.  I expect push back to the idea that vegetable oils are bad news but there is growing evidence.  The video had evidence from three tribes who ate mostly fat or mostly carbs and they are healthy. They ate little/no seed/vegetable oils. Coconut oil is almost all saturated fat.

Olive oil is less harmful than most due to a low linoleic acid content. Also, if your source of olive oil is from salad dressing then the dose is not that high.
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Offline Libertas

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Oh Lordy...so many obese soy-boyz...

Dumb as a mouse...

 ::laughonfloor::


In short, 1/3 of US calories are from seed/vegetable oils, mostly in processed foods. Mostly soybean oil. This may be responsible for the metabolic diseases such as heart disease, obesity, insulin resistance, etc.

There has been so much bad diet info from the govt over the past decades people, including myself, are resistant to new recommendations.  I expect push back to the idea that vegetable oils are bad news but there is growing evidence.  The video had evidence from three tribes who ate mostly fat or mostly carbs and they are healthy. They ate little/no seed/vegetable oils. Coconut oil is almost all saturated fat.

Olive oil is less harmful than most due to a low linoleic acid content. Also, if your source of olive oil is from salad dressing then the dose is not that high.

Try to avoid processed stuff...but some is more obvious than others...a testament to the insidiousness of industry standards people got accustomed to or questioned little...and to points you've made, the conflicting "studies" denigrating everything under the sun which add to the noise...

One has to question if such noise was intentional, more menticide to numb the populace making them more susceptible to mindless compliance to officious dictates...like wearing masks incapable of stopping any virus or self-imprisoning people or believing 6' bubbles are sane...
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Online patentlymn

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Hmm in 2010 the video says 80 gm per day veg oil consumed in US.
Quote
1 Tbsp Soybean Oil. Nutrition Facts. Soybean Oil. Serving Size: tbsp (14g grams). Amount Per Serving. Calories from Fat 122. Calories 104. % Daily Value*.

So 80 gm is 6 Tbsp per day. So not that hard to get lots of soybean oil from salad dressing.
Soybean oil is 54% om-6 and olive oil is 9% om-6.
So if om-6 is the culprit then olive oil is 1/6 or 16% as bad as soybean oil.
So cut om-6 from dressing by 1/6 by using olive oil based dressings or some people use greek yogurt based dressings.

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Online patentlymn

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Oh Lordy...so many obese soy-boyz...

Dumb as a mouse...

 ::laughonfloor::


In short, 1/3 of US calories are from seed/vegetable oils, mostly in processed foods. Mostly soybean oil. This may be responsible for the metabolic diseases such as heart disease, obesity, insulin resistance, etc.

There has been so much bad diet info from the govt over the past decades people, including myself, are resistant to new recommendations.  I expect push back to the idea that vegetable oils are bad news but there is growing evidence.  The video had evidence from three tribes who ate mostly fat or mostly carbs and they are healthy. They ate little/no seed/vegetable oils. Coconut oil is almost all saturated fat.

Olive oil is less harmful than most due to a low linoleic acid content. Also, if your source of olive oil is from salad dressing then the dose is not that high.

Try to avoid processed stuff...but some is more obvious than others...a testament to the insidiousness of industry standards people got accustomed to or questioned little...and to points you've made, the conflicting "studies" denigrating everything under the sun which add to the noise...

One has to question if such noise was intentional, more menticide to numb the populace making them more susceptible to mindless compliance to officious dictates...like wearing masks incapable of stopping any virus or self-imprisoning people or believing 6' bubbles are sane...

If you dig into the history of the 'science' much came from ignoring the data that did not fit.  There was a massive study done on people in mental hospital where animal fat was replaced with vegetable oils/fats for half the people. The vegetable oil half died sooner and the study was buried for 17 years because the result was wrong.

A MN guy was responsible for the "sat fat bad" idea for decades. A British scientist wrote a book that sugar kills. He was shunned even though he was correct. Some scientists and doctors rediscovered that sugar is bad and then discovered his old book.

Apparently German scientists had the correct results on diet but their ideas did not transfer to the US. I read that very old medical books taught doctors how to manage diabetes with diet alone. I have no idea how well that worked. It is said that insulin availability killed good diet research as these methods went away.

This shows how 'science' is  really done. Fat was blamed for heart attacks, not sugar, for decades. A scientist blamed sugar in 1972 and his career was ruined.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/apr/07/the-sugar-conspiracy-robert-lustig-john-yudkin
The sugar conspiracy
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Offline Libertas

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Hmm in 2010 the video says 80 gm per day veg oil consumed in US.
Quote
1 Tbsp Soybean Oil. Nutrition Facts. Soybean Oil. Serving Size: tbsp (14g grams). Amount Per Serving. Calories from Fat 122. Calories 104. % Daily Value*.

So 80 gm is 6 Tbsp per day. So not that hard to get lots of soybean oil from salad dressing.
Soybean oil is 54% om-6 and olive oil is 9% om-6.
So if om-6 is the culprit then olive oil is 1/6 or 16% as bad as soybean oil.
So cut om-6 from dressing by 1/6 by using olive oil based dressings or some people use greek yogurt based dressings.


Therefor om-6 is not the culprit.  Something else in soy...
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Online patentlymn

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Hmm in 2010 the video says 80 gm per day veg oil consumed in US.
Quote
1 Tbsp Soybean Oil. Nutrition Facts. Soybean Oil. Serving Size: tbsp (14g grams). Amount Per Serving. Calories from Fat 122. Calories 104. % Daily Value*.

So 80 gm is 6 Tbsp per day. So not that hard to get lots of soybean oil from salad dressing.
Soybean oil is 54% om-6 and olive oil is 9% om-6.
So if om-6 is the culprit then olive oil is 1/6 or 16% as bad as soybean oil.
So cut om-6 from dressing by 1/6 by using olive oil based dressings or some people use greek yogurt based dressings.


Therefor om-6 is not the culprit.  Something else in soy...

The studies cited seem to indicate that om-6 is the culprit or well could be. Sat fat alone is not harmful nor are complex carbs alone, from the tribes studied. One tribe lived mostly on sweet potatoes with a little meat added and had no heart disease.  It was common wisdom that bread makes you fat until 'science' came along and pronounced it an old wives tale.
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