It's About Liberty: A Conservative Forum
Topics => Economy => Topic started by: IronDioPriest on July 07, 2011, 11:20:29 AM
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From Pew Research, HT: HotAir. (http://hotair.com)
Public Wants Changes in Entitlements, Not Changes in Benefits (http://people-press.org/2011/07/07/public-wants-changes-in-entitlements-not-change-in-benefits/)
...The public’s desire for fundamental change does not mean it supports reductions in the benefits provided by Social Security, Medicare or Medicaid. Relatively few are willing to see benefit cuts as part of the solution, regardless of whether the problem being addressed is the federal budget deficit, state budget shortfalls or the financial viability of the entitlement programs...
<snip>
...On the broad question of whether it is more important to reduce the budget deficit or to maintain current Medicare and Social Security benefits, the public decisively supports maintaining the status quo. Six-in-ten (60%) say it is more important to keep Social Security and Medicare benefits as they are; only about half as many (32%) say it is more important to take steps to reduce the budget deficit...
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::gaah::
Reality doesn't GAS what these people "want". The coming bitchslap is long, long overdue.
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People have an emotional vested interest in believing that these programs can be tweaked and run more efficiently, and that by doing so, they will still get their largesse.
It's a variation of the "NIMBY" phenomenon. Yep, I want it. But not here. = Yep, it's bankrupt. But no cuts.
There is a cognitive disconnect with reality that will make reality all that much more difficult for some to bear.
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There is a cognitive disconnect with reality that will make reality all that much more difficult for some to bear.
Yes, it will. And the most dangerous aspect of that disconnect is the existence of opportunistic politicians who are all too willing to patronize this unrealistic expectation in their pursuit of political power. It's probably the single biggest factor to blame for the mess we are in now. For dozens of election cycles no successful politician dared be the canary in this coal mine; rather than sounding the alarm they took increasingly elaborate measures to preserve the illusion of viability.
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; rather than sounding the alarm they took increasingly elaborate measures to preserve the illusion of viability.
Poll after Poll. Demagouge after Demagouge. This is why I am so pessimistic about a political solution. There has to be a lot more pain before people will get it, and by then its just going to be too late to avert the disaster.. all we may be able to do it mitgate its effects and shorten its duration. Of course that was Hari Seldon's plan and mule F'd that up. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_series)
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; rather than sounding the alarm they took increasingly elaborate measures to preserve the illusion of viability.
Poll after Poll. Demagouge after Demagouge. This is why I am so pessimistic about a political solution. There has to be a lot more pain before people will get it, and by then its just going to be too late to avert the disaster.. all we may be able to do it mitgate its effects and shorten its duration. Of course that was Hari Seldon's plan and mule F'd that up. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_series)
Okay, I might as well lock the thread now. An Asimov "Foundation" reference is the trump-card that renders all further commentary superfluous.
::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool:: ::cool::
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Jeeze, just when I was going to say something pithy....
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Okay, I might as well lock the thread now. An Asimov "Foundation" reference is the trump-card that renders all further commentary superfluous.
Ooops. Didn't know that rule. Didn't mean to kill the thread.
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Okay, I might as well lock the thread now. An Asimov "Foundation" reference is the trump-card that renders all further commentary superfluous.
Ooops. Didn't know that rule. Didn't mean to kill the thread.
It's not a rule and you didn't kill the thread, don't worry. That's IDP's way of expressing his admiration.
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Jeeze, just when I was going to say something pithy....
Pith away anyway, Soup.
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People have an emotional vested interest in believing that these programs can be tweaked and run more efficiently, and that by doing so, they will still get their largesse.
It's a variation of the "NIMBY" phenomenon. Yep, I want it. But not here. = Yep, it's bankrupt. But no cuts.
There is a cognitive disconnect with reality that will make reality all that much more difficult for some to bear.
All true. And too damn bad; as Glock wrote, reality does not comport with their wants or expectations.
I'm pretty sick and tired of people expecting their largesse from the production of others.
I've heard it bandied about lately that folks didn't put up much of a fuss, at the time, about the introduction of SS and then Medicare and I'm not sure that's correct. In any case, they ought to have known TANSTAAFL - ever; eventually the piper needs to be paid.
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Okay, I might as well lock the thread now. An Asimov "Foundation" reference is the trump-card that renders all further commentary superfluous.
Ooops. Didn't know that rule. Didn't mean to kill the thread.
Sorry Weisshaupt - I was just funnin with IDP.
What I was going to say was that my intention is to support my folks through the remainder of their lives - however long that may be. I won't let the malevolent actions of leftists rob them of the dignity and comfort that they have earned.
Fortunately I am in a position to do so. I recognize that many other are not. Of course if that means that I chew my way through my own retirement, this is a price I am willing to pay.
Once my parents are no longer a concern I will be one of the orneriest, cantankerous, surly MF'rs you're likely to meet. I already know that my retirement isn't going to be "golden"....unless sh!t comes in that color.
It will however be interesting.
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Yeah, you didn't kill anything weisshaupt. I was giving you props for Asimov-cred. I love it when my fave books and films are analogous to the discussion. Love it even more when they make a perfect point.
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The whole thing is inexplicably fouled up. The Republicans, leadership especially, have not tried to explain the Ryan plan and the pollsters, the actual questions of this poll would give light to their analysis (have you ever noticed the first four letters) .
It appears they all prefer the pot to roil.
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Okay, I might as well lock the thread now. An Asimov "Foundation" reference is the trump-card that renders all further commentary superfluous.
Ooops. Didn't know that rule. Didn't mean to kill the thread.
Sorry Weisshaupt - I was just funnin with IDP.
What I was going to say was that my intention is to support my folks through the remainder of their lives - however long that may be. I won't let the malevolent actions of leftists rob them of the dignity and comfort that they have earned.
Fortunately I am in a position to do so. I recognize that many other are not. Of course if that means that I chew my way through my own retirement, this is a price I am willing to pay.
Once my parents are no longer a concern I will be one of the orneriest, cantankerous, surly MF'rs you're likely to meet. I already know that my retirement isn't going to be "golden"....unless sh!t comes in that color.
It will however be interesting.
My siblings and I are in the same boat with ya 'Soup. In our family we take care of our own and we don't go begging to others to take care of ours so we can blow our earnings on frivolity!
I'll be cantankerous ornery and surly with anybody trying to force me into their looters paradise!
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You know, there's some woman out there who partied after her baby died...or something.
Just keepin it real here. ::)
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; rather than sounding the alarm they took increasingly elaborate measures to preserve the illusion of viability.
Poll after Poll. Demagouge after Demagouge. This is why I am so pessimistic about a political solution. There has to be a lot more pain before people will get it, and by then its just going to be too late to avert the disaster.. all we may be able to do it mitgate its effects and shorten its duration. Of course that was Hari Seldon's plan and mule F'd that up. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_series)
It appears, Weisshaupt, that you and Fran Porretto (http://www.eternityroad.info/index.php/weblog/single/national_security_part_4_the_role_of_morale/) are on the same page, but he and Charles Oakwood are on the same wavelength:
The foreshortening of aspirations and the loss of confidence naturally evoke a redirection of citizen energies toward personal security, even at the expense of a weakening of social and national bonds. Thus, the ultimate test of a citizen's allegiance to his nation -- his willingness to act in its defense at cost to himself -- becomes steadily harder to meet. The phenomenon is made more deadly by positive feedback:
"Frustration of my plans to lighten the disaster will convince people that the future holds no promise to them. Already they recall the lives of their grandfathers with envy. They will see that political revolutions and trade stagnations will increase. The feeling will pervade the Galaxy that only what a man can grasp for himself at that moment will be of any account. Ambitious men will not wait, and unscrupulous men will not hang back. By their every action they will hasten the decay of the worlds."
People who believe in their nation and are willing to do what must be done to defend it don't talk in sauve qui peuts.
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sauve qui peuts?
Uhh huh...
So what's better? Sink en masse or swim in small groups?
Am I being asked to be stupid because everyone else is?
::whatgives::