It's About Liberty: A Conservative Forum
Topics => Economy => Topic started by: Pandora on December 11, 2011, 09:04:09 AM
-
Though industrial employment has certainly plummeted over the long term, economist Mark Perry notes that the U.S. share of the world’s manufacturing output, as measured in dollars, has remained fairly stable over the last 20 years, at about one-fifth. Indeed, U.S. factories produce twice what they did back in the 1970s, though productivity improvements mean that they do it with fewer employees. Recent export growth has particularly helped companies producing capital equipment, such as John Deere and Caterpillar, and many industrial firms are even hiring more people for their plants, especially in the Midwest, the Southeast, and Texas.
One area in which industry is positively roaring: firms that service the thriving oil and natural-gas industries, from Montana and the Dakotas to Pennsylvania. In Ohio alone, there are already 65,000 wells, with more on the way, says Rhonda Reda, executive director of the Ohio Oil and Gas Energy Education Foundation—while a new finding, the Utica shale formation in eastern Ohio, could hold more than $20 billion worth of natural gas. As a result, Karen Wright’s business—selling compressors for natural-gas wells—has been soaring, leading her to add more than 300 positions over the past two years. “There’s a huge amount of drilling throughout the Midwest,” Wright says. “This is a game changer.”
Wright isn’t alone. Firms throughout the Midwest are moving aggressively to meet the demand for natural-gas-related products. Take the $650 million expansion of the V&M Star steel mill in Youngstown, Ohio, which builds pipes for transporting gas. The expansion will add 350 permanent jobs to the factory after it’s completed next year.
As the natural-gas boom continues, it could have another effect beneficial to industry: keeping energy prices low, which will give American manufacturers a leg up on their global rivals. Companies in the business-friendly midwestern and Plains states will profit the most, while New York and California—though each has ample fossil-fuel resources—will probably be too concerned with potential environmental problems to cash in.
The industrial resurgence comes with a price: a soaring demand for skilled workers. Even as overall manufacturing employment has dropped, employment in high-skill manufacturing professions has soared 37 percent since the early 1980s, according to a New York Federal Reserve study. These jobs can pay handsomely. An experienced machinist at Ariel Corporation earns over $75,000, a very good wage in an area where you can buy a nice single-family house for less than $150,000.
A big reason for the demand is changes on the factory floor. At Ariel, Wright points out, the operator of a modern CNC (computer numerical control) machine, which programs repetitive tasks such as drilling, is running equipment that can cost over $5 million. A new hire in this position must have knowledge of programming, metallurgy, cutting-tool technology, geometry, drafting, and engineering. Today’s factory worker is less Joe Six-Pack and more Renaissance man.
...
“There are very few unskilled jobs any more,” says Wright. “You can’t make it any more just pushing a button. These jobs require thinking and ability to act autonomously. But such people are not very thick on the ground.”
The bolded is a H/T to Lady Virginia's thread on the need for a liberal education (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,3716.0.html) from which one would gain such abilities.
Link (http://www.city-journal.org/2011/21_4_skilled-labor.html)
-
I'm going to Mount Vernon, OH!
Can we change these lyrics?
Beverly Hillbillies Opening (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnXfRstZntE#)
;D
Seriously though, how sad is it that we have idiots going to college now to attend crap like Occupation 101 and other such utterly useless pursuits instead of learning disciplines that can add to our nations productivity and wealth?
This statement - “There are very few unskilled jobs any more,” says Wright. “You can’t make it any more just pushing a button. These jobs require thinking and ability to act autonomously. But such people are not very thick on the ground.” - Should be viewed in the context of a national tragedy, a man-made disaster fostered by progressives and meekly tolerated by parents!
Our children, our future and our nation deserves better.
-
This is a topic that is coming up more (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,3262.0.html) and more (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,3262.msg36014.html#msg36014).
It seems that just as our economy is taking the biggest hit of our lifetime and perhaps its history, a glaring part of the problem is a gaping disparity between the requirements of the job market in the real world, and the fantasies of the educational establishment in the pretend world. Schools are being encouraged and allowed through subsidies to funnel students through curriculum that has no application in the real world; schools are suffering no consequence for failing in their mission; while real employers needing real employees are standing with their arms wide open.
This problem has become widespread enough that it has earned a high profile face: John Ratzenberger (Cliffy from "Cheers"). He fronts an organization called http://www.centerforamerica.org/, and he's been pushing this problem front and center as well anyone.
-
I really should have hat-tipped Kevin Baker at The Smallest Minority (http://smallestminority.blogspot.com/2011/12/its-meme.html) for the above link; here's the first sentence from his post:
First Mike Rowe, then John Ratzenberger, then Jay Leno, now City Journal has an in-depth look at the lack of skilled workers in industry.
John Ratzenberger has been working this point of view for some time, as you write, IDP. Baker links to Mike Rowe, and one of us posted the Leno video here somewhere, and Baker linked to it too.
-
I really should have hat-tipped Kevin Baker at The Smallest Minority (http://smallestminority.blogspot.com/2011/12/its-meme.html) for the above link; here's the first sentence from his post:
First Mike Rowe, then John Ratzenberger, then Jay Leno, now City Journal has an in-depth look at the lack of skilled workers in industry.
John Ratzenberger has been working this point of view for some time, as you write, IDP. Baker links to Mike Rowe, and one of us posted the Leno video here somewhere, and Baker linked to it too.
Yes! Mike Rowe is another one - and I just saw the Jay Leno video within the last week or so - excellent piece of work by him, talking about how he is ready and willing to hire engineers RIGHT NOW to work in his garage designing cars. (Leno is a motorhead).
I think a big lie has been foisted on generations who've been made to believe that they were destined as Americans for something "better" than working with their hands, and that such work was for the "less educated" and provided less opportunities.
I can see the allure of falling for such a lie. You have somebody telling you "You can be ANYTHING you want to be," and you can see examples of that playing out everywhere in the land of opportunity. But there is another half to that promise of opportunity, and that is, "You can be anything you want to be - but whether someone else pays you for it will depend on the realities of the job market and the economy."
We've allowed our educational system to set an agenda based on government subsidies, and almost completely abandon any ties to economic reality.
-
I like this quote from the Kevin Baker link:
The young want everything. They think they an get everything swiftly and painlessly. They are far too confident. They don't know what their problems are, not really. They talk too much. They demand too much. Their ideas have not been tempered by the hard facts of reality. They're idealists, but they don't sense that it's the easiest thing in the world to be an idealist. It doesn't take any brains. This was said by Aristotle 2,300 years ago. Mencken once said that an idealist is someone who, upon observing that a rose smells better than a cabbage, assumes that it will also make better soup.
That is from a 1974 interview - quoting Aristotle. It pretty much encapsulates liberalism, doesn't it? And it follows then that our educational institutions have become institutionalized reinforcement centers for the thoughtless idealism of youth.
-
I really should have hat-tipped Kevin Baker at The Smallest Minority (http://smallestminority.blogspot.com/2011/12/its-meme.html) for the above link; here's the first sentence from his post:
First Mike Rowe, then John Ratzenberger, then Jay Leno, now City Journal has an in-depth look at the lack of skilled workers in industry.
John Ratzenberger has been working this point of view for some time, as you write, IDP. Baker links to Mike Rowe, and one of us posted the Leno video here somewhere, and Baker linked to it too.
Yes! Mike Rowe is another one - and I just saw the Jay Leno video within the last week or so - excellent piece of work by him, talking about how he is ready and willing to hire engineers RIGHT NOW to work in his garage designing cars. (Leno is a motorhead).
I think a big lie has been foisted on generations who've been made to believe that they were destined as Americans for something "better" than working with their hands, and that such work was for the "less educated" and provided less opportunities.
Yes and yes. Within the big "White-collar" lie is a two-part fallacy; one, that, today, working with one's hands always involves back-breaking labor -- it most certainly doesn't -- and, two, that the work is mindless button-pushing, so "our kids" can "do better". "Better" meaning work attire of Dockers as opposed to Carhardt and that makes the issue one of class snobbishness as well.
The City Journal piece emphasizes the need for skills and an ability to think on one's feet.
I can see the allure of falling for such a lie. You have somebody telling you "You can be ANYTHING you want to be," and you can see examples of that playing out everywhere in the land of opportunity. But there is another half to that promise of opportunity, and that is, "You can be anything you want to be - but whether someone else pays you for it will depend on the realities of the job market and the economy."
We've allowed our educational system to set an agenda based on government subsidies, and almost completely abandon any ties to economic reality.
Their agenda is comprised of what's good for them, all the purveyors of the big lie, and no one else. "Experts", you know.
-
Today’s factory worker is less Joe Six-Pack and more Renaissance man.
That is a person that will contribute more to the success of the company than someone who's marking time on the floor.
Within the big "White-collar" lie is a two-part fallacy; one, that, today, working with one's hands always involves back-breaking labor -- it most certainly doesn't -- and, two, that the work is mindless button-pushing, so "our kids" can "do better". "Better" meaning work attire of Dockers as opposed to Carhardt and that makes the issue one of class snobbishness as well.
I've seen this in my own extended family.
It is snobbishness. I hate it.
Both my mother and father-in-law define success by a college degree and having an office.
-
The Left has been very successful via handouts (loans, most unpaid) in watering down what a college education means. Back in my parents day their admonishment carried more weight because people by and large still entered degree programs with practical application in the workforce, that all started to errode in the 70's as the hippie generation began their fight-from-within-the-system campaign, and their heirs have carried to the ridiculous extremes we see today. "College educated" has to be qualified today, we need to ask where they went and what they studied to be able to make the determination if their so-called learning means anything. I've advised friends and family, and their kids to explore technical and trade schools, as there are still some fine ones teaching valuable skills in fields that need people. College is not (and quite naturally should not) be for "everyone".
As to IDP's earlier point of all the "hits" we are taking, it is why I fear replacing Obama with a less than desireable GOP candidate, when (not if) the crap hits the fan, are people today wise enough to know who really caused it? I doubt it, the guy left without a chair when the music stops will get all the blame. But we all know who really is causing our decline and demise. If more people realize what is being done to our nation, maybe we could do something to reverse it. Maybe.
-
It occurs to me that today's auto "tech" is a good mix of "manual" labor and computer savvy. With most of the systems computer-controlled, an understanding of how to operate the diagnostics machine and its related functions is necessary. Dockers are still out of the question, though; engines still get dirty, certain parts still require lubricating, and oil-changing is still a potential mess-maker. Nevertheless, today's car repairers have come a long way from the "grease-monkey" days and although an old-fashioned mechanic understands the basics in a way the younger ones do not, any good one is worth his weight in gold.
As an aside, I can remember my Father (and he does it to this day) bitching about the engineers and how difficult their designs made repairing some things, the things that required tearing half the engine apart to get at. No matter how many times it was pointed out that the engineers' job was to fit ten pounds of stuff in a five-pound bag -- and the anti-pollution equipment complicated that 20-fold -- and see that it actually worked, he's still bitter.
-
I share his bitterness. I used to do a lot of my own maintenance on my cars back in the day. I gave up in the late 80's as the engine compartments ceased to be roomy enough to crawl into. I am by no means (now or then) the biggest guy on the planet (6'1" 2##) but I don't have an engine hoist and I don't have small fingers! So, as the compartments got tighter, I started doing less. About all I can do now is an oil change, replace some bulbs...cheap cheesy stuff.
It was all a plot to shift more of peoples money to manufacturers, unions and shops.
And don't get me started on the substandard nature of the parts!
Stuff used to be made to last, no it's only made to last so long!
::gaah::
-
About all I can do now is an oil change, replace some bulbs...cheap cheesy stuff.
Stuff used to be made to last, no it's only made to last so long!
::gaah::
A bulb replacement on my car cost me $2 for the bulb and $22 for labor. My husband couldn't do it because of the way it's put together.
I keep telling my kids about when I was growing up people got things repaired...like toasters and TVs (if they didn't try to fix it themselves).
-
I still have my first mixer, toaster and iron. From the '70s. All they've needed is new plugs.
(Knockin' on wood now)
-
The lions share of blue collar workers are going to be educated by nationally accredited schools. The current administration declared war on them as soon as they took control because they are mostly "for profit" schools. Most of these schools have a process where a local group of business peers will look over the programs to ensure a graduate meets their needs. Norton Norris did an independent study and found the private schools were three times more efficient with the tax payers money.
Of course the private schools keep getting hammered as "truck driving schools" etc.. by the media. You;ll never hear that one of their grads will pass a national certification test at the same rate as a government ran school.
Pure OJT is almost non existent due to stacks of labor or a number of other laws.
-
I still have my first mixer, toaster and iron. From the '70s. All they've needed is new plugs.
(Knockin' on wood now)
Lucky!
-
...Pure OJT is almost non existent due to stacks of labor or a number of other laws.
And that's a shame, because lost in that is the entire concept of starting at a company young, and through OJT, working your way up through the ranks.
My father quit college after 2 years because I came along, and he needed to work. He got a job in a book-binding division of a burgeoning technology company. While he worked as a book-binder, they trained him in the science lab, intending to promote a good hard-working young man into a better position in a different division. While he was being trained as a tech, a sales position opened, and he applied for it. That began a 45 year career as a salesman, later becoming a sales and marketing executive - the first 2/3 of it with the same company. On the job training and employer loyalty to a good employee were a lay-down trump hand over "education". The idea that my dad wasn't qualified for his job because he lacked college and had only OJT was a non-issue.
Now, that's not to say that as time went on, he didn't have some regrets at having forgone a college education. He went back and took classes in areas that he felt he was lacking compared to young bucks competing for his job. But education was never the reason he was qualified to do his job. Over-emphasis on college and the forgotten value of on-the-job training have harmed America.
-
I still have my first mixer, toaster and iron. From the '70s. All they've needed is new plugs.
(Knockin' on wood now)
Lucky!
I have my moms iron that she got as a wedding present in '43 still works but I don't use it any more. ::danceban::
-
I still have my first mixer, toaster and iron. From the '70s. All they've needed is new plugs.
(Knockin' on wood now)
I don't have anything left over from the 70's. Especially my hair. ::unknowncomic::
I still do most of the repairs on the vehicles we have, but like Libertas, when it comes to close quarters, that's where I take it to someone. The computer controls are fairly easy to work on. Most of the time they tell you by code what the problem is. Usage of a volt/ohm meter and a vacuum pump can help trouble shoot some of the electrical parts.
-
I can do a fair bit of auto repair, but a lot of times have to resort to treating it like a surgeon in a Civil War field hospital, i.e. replacing an entire part as a module because diagnosing it as a subcomponent is impossible without specialized equipment. And the mind boggling arrangement of parts, got to remember the engineers designed it more for the benefit of the robots on the assembly line than us weekend mechanics 10 years and 100,000 miles later :). A perfect case in point, my check engine light has been on for going on 3 years. The cause is always the same, leaking evaporative system. Changing the little $30 charcoal filter that's leaking requires dropping the fuel tank. Screw that.
-
About all I can do now is an oil change, replace some bulbs...cheap cheesy stuff.
Stuff used to be made to last, no it's only made to last so long!
::gaah::
A bulb replacement on my car cost me $2 for the bulb and $22 for labor. My husband couldn't do it because of the way it's put together.
I keep telling my kids about when I was growing up people got things repaired...like toasters and TVs (if they didn't try to fix it themselves).
I remember the day when you could raise the hood , climb in and practically stand next to the engine while you did your own tune up . Well ... maybe not ... but close !
-
About all I can do now is an oil change, replace some bulbs...cheap cheesy stuff.
Stuff used to be made to last, no it's only made to last so long!
::gaah::
A bulb replacement on my car cost me $2 for the bulb and $22 for labor. My husband couldn't do it because of the way it's put together.
I keep telling my kids about when I was growing up people got things repaired...like toasters and TVs (if they didn't try to fix it themselves).
I remember the day when you could raise the hood , climb in and practically stand next to the engine while you did your own tune up . Well ... maybe not ... but close !
Damn right! I could replace belts, head gaskets, distributors, alternators, hoses, plugs, thermostats, carburetors, batteries, all that crap...now, you can;t get at anything! I remember being able to see and work through the fricken firewall...and even underneath plugs and filters seemed a hell of a lot easier to get at!
I'm tellin' ya, it was all a leftist conspiracy to make most American's less self reliant!!!
::gaah:: ::cussing:: ::angry::
-
Ah yes. Earlier I was going to mention the need for intentional replacement
of older parts to assure extended function during an emergency. Replacing functional fuel pumps, alternators, etc. with new one's instead of waiting for failure which usually occurs at the most inconvenient times.
My dutiful, beautiful, F150 (100k) - quit running. She was perfect, as always, when I went into the store, when I got back in the cab and turned the key she just spun. And spun.
The mechanic said "no fuel pressure", so a new pump was installed and we were all happy. For two days. As it turns out Ford PAS (passive anti-theft system) when it doesn't recognize the ignition key (an intermittent event and switching between two keys would produce more positive but still random results), turns off the fuel pump. You guessed it, it's back at the shop and the mechanic is working out the problem.
Caveat: FoMoCo wanted $50.00 just to check the key and oh yeah, the not running truck had to be there also. After a short conversation with the clerk it became apparent that the test was a "go, no go" or the same "test" I had been performing. By denying them I may have saved $500.00 for them to hunt and peck then repair the problem. My cost may be $500.00 but it will be $500.00 less than the Dealership price.
I'm not complaining about the truck, it has provided excellent and dependable service.
-
About all I can do now is an oil change, replace some bulbs...cheap cheesy stuff.
Stuff used to be made to last, no it's only made to last so long!
::gaah::
A bulb replacement on my car cost me $2 for the bulb and $22 for labor. My husband couldn't do it because of the way it's put together.
I keep telling my kids about when I was growing up people got things repaired...like toasters and TVs (if they didn't try to fix it themselves).
I remember the day when you could raise the hood , climb in and practically stand next to the engine while you did your own tune up . Well ... maybe not ... but close !
I can remember seeing my Dad do just that on big trucks - right in the engine compartment he went.
-
Thus my plan. For my next truck, I'd like to get an older model Ford (early 70') in good condition and drop in a Cummins diesel. Lots of power with great gas mileage. Plus, easy to work on. ::danceban::
-
I wish I would have kept a couple of my older vehicles...
::facepalm::
-
I'm starting to even think about an old VW made into something rugged, sort of like the Kubelwagen the Germans used in North Africa. Not only no electronic crap, no water cooling system either.
-
Popular motor to throw in dune buggy's!
-
Seriously, if the car has some miles on it check to see what's next on the failed part list. 120k miles and the water pump is bad, change the alternator, belt and tensioner while you're at it. Labor is a bit more and you can get a break on it for doing it while everyhting is apart. Economies of scale come into play. Replace with top quality parts to. Use rebuilt parts if the car is temporary otherwise use new parts. Check your battery's condidtion regularly and clean the dirt and grime of the top, make it clean. Clean terminals. Low voltage can overtax electrical parts and cause a myriad of problems all the way to transmission solenoids.
Best advice to check out a forum that emphasizes your make and model and be familiar with the potential breakdowns, fixes. These people know their cars and can help you diagnose or even give the methods of repairs. Happy wrenching.
Oh, btw, rear engine dragsters are easiest to work on!
-
About all I can do now is an oil change, replace some bulbs...cheap cheesy stuff.
Stuff used to be made to last, no it's only made to last so long!
::gaah::
A bulb replacement on my car cost me $2 for the bulb and $22 for labor. My husband couldn't do it because of the way it's put together.
I keep telling my kids about when I was growing up people got things repaired...like toasters and TVs (if they didn't try to fix it themselves).
I remember the day when you could raise the hood , climb in and practically stand next to the engine while you did your own tune up . Well ... maybe not ... but close !
You sure as hell saw the ground under the engine.