Topic: Don't Argue With Idiots, Even If They're Family

[jpatrickham]

October 21, 2011 by Chip Wood

PHOTOS.COM

"Encourage people to vote for the very best candidates they can find next November.I have a very serious question I want to ask you today: What are you doing to win others to our cause, so we can enjoy enough political victories next year to begin turning this country around? I hope you’ll give me some encouraging, even inspirational, answers.

Don’t get me wrong; I know it’s going to take a lot more than one election to undo the consequences of 100 years of growing government and infringement on our liberties. There is no magic wand we can wave and no magic leader we can elect who will suddenly undo all of the disastrous advances the socialists and their allies have made in our lifetime.

No, we’re going to win back our liberties and restore solvency to our government the same way we lost them: step by step, law by law, election by election."

http://www.personalliberty.com/conservative-politics/dont-argue-with-idiots-even-if-theyre-family/?eiid=&rmid=2011_10_21_PLA_[P11381863]&rrid=306899022

[Glock32]

No, we’re going to win back our liberties and restore solvency to our government the same way we lost them: step by step, law by law, election by election.

I hear this sentiment a lot, and I understand why people like to espouse it. I do have to wonder though, how many people actually believe it? Who is going to see to this across multiple generations? When this country has become majority non-white and the Founders and their ideas are just part and parcel of "dead white oppressors"?

I don't see it happening.

[LadyVirginia]

No, we’re going to win back our liberties and restore solvency to our government the same way we lost them: step by step, law by law, election by election.

I hear this sentiment a lot, and I understand why people like to espouse it. I do have to wonder though, how many people actually believe it? Who is going to see to this across multiple generations? When this country has become majority non-white and the Founders and their ideas are just part and parcel of "dead white oppressors"?

I don't see it happening.

I have to say that many, many days I feel the same as Glock.  I don't see that many people caring. They can't.  They don't have the ability to see it or understand it.  It's the frog in the boiling water.  It wasn't boiling when he was dropped in the water. And until their dying day will argue with you about how nice the water is.

On another thread we talked about the schools trying to control what kids eat.  There will be parents who don't question that at all and in fact will dutifully try to implement what "the kids are learning at school" in their own homes.

[charlesoakwood]

As long as the are invested with the ideals of our founding fathers it matters not what color they are.

[LadyVirginia]

As long as the are invested with the ideals of our founding fathers it matters not what color they are.

 

[Glock32]

But they're not. They're interested in Aztlan, in recolonizing what was "stolen". They have a raison d'etre that is predicated on being consciously NOT invested in the Founding Fathers or America's history.

[charlesoakwood]

But they're not. They're interested in Aztlan, in recolonizing what was "stolen". They have a raison d'etre that is predicated on being consciously NOT invested in the Founding Fathers or America's history.

No, the Aztlans are recolonizing and the Aztlans are a miniscule minority.  
To set apart the good men and women who work, toil, fight, and die Red White and Blue
who are not white is a very biased approach to being American.

[Pandora]

As long as the are invested with the ideals of our founding fathers it matters not what color they are.

It's not just "color".  People of other races come with culture attached, and its ideals, myths and heroes.  In the past, these people were willing to exchange that for immersion in our culture and history and ideals, when coming to America meant becoming American.  Today, after hearing so much derision of "old dead White men" -- that would be our founding fathers -- they are being encouraged to find nothing in common with them and nothing redeeming in "their" values and ideals.

Many White people underestimate the value people of other races place on their ethnicity, their "tribe", but tolerate the notion that each of the other be permitted representation by one of "their own"; Mexicans elect from their own tribe, Blacks from theirs.  As this is seen as right and proper, what makes anybody believe America will still be America with a majority Mexican population -- or any other -- whose fealty is first to tribe, and extremely unlikely to relate to the leavings of the aforementioned old, dead, White men, is beyond me.

[charlesoakwood]

To reduce thoughts or statements of who is or who is not American, to "white" or "not white",
is a very limiting perspective.

 

[Pandora]

To reduce thoughts or statements of who is or who is not American, to "white" or "not white",
is a very limiting perspective.

 

Perhaps.  If that was what all I wrote.  I also pointed to culture, which attaches to races of other countries, and eliding over that is refusing to look at the obvious.  It might be eye opening to conduct a conversation of this type with them and see if one comes away with the same "limiting perspective".

[LadyVirginia]

The story told on my grandmother's side of the family is that when they immigrated (over 200 years ago) they changed their names to English spellings because they so admired what the English had accomplished in America and wanted to be a part of it.  For sure for decades after they still married within their own ethnic group and religion but they considered themselves American first.

[Libertas]

Screw race, creed and all that rot!  New arrivals until recent decades assimilated with us, they didn't force us to adopt to their hodgepodge whateverthehell they brought over!  The proglodytes in media, academia and politics infected everything with their pc/multi-culti/diversity BS!  Until they and their poisonous ideology is destroyed hoping people of any flavor have a snowballs chance in hell of understanding our Founding is moot.

[Pandora]

The story told on my grandmother's side of the family is that when they immigrated (over 200 years ago) they changed their names to English spellings because they so admired what the English had accomplished in America and wanted to be a part of it.  For sure for decades after they still married within their own ethnic group and religion but they considered themselves American first.

Same here, LV, although admiration for the English wasn't the prime motivator, it was the desire to BE American, so much so that while my father's mother spoken broken and heavily accented English, none of his eleven siblings learned Italian.  (And don't misunderstand, I'm not advocating that either.)

How many are doing that today, though, Americanizing their names?  How many consider themselves American first, instead of Hyphenated-American?

Many of us are carrying around in our heads images of the way it used to be; it's not like that now and it won't be again unless a concerted effort is made in that direction and we put a boot on the necks of those who are elated at the idea that Whites will be a minority group in this country before too long.  And there are a great many White folks in that group. 

The sociologists have made great inroads instilling the "fact" that people are just interchangeable pieces and that none have immutable natures, none that can't be "engineered" out of them anyway.

They're wrong.

[charlesoakwood]

Screw race, creed and all that rot!  New arrivals until recent decades assimilated with us, they didn't force us to adopt to their hodgepodge whateverthehell they brought over!  The proglodytes in media, academia and politics infected everything with their pc/multi-culti/diversity BS!  Until they and their poisonous ideology is destroyed hoping people of any flavor have a snowballs chance in hell of understanding our Founding is moot.

Right, and Pan right, BUT you should not define "they" as anybody who is not white.  That says white only, that excludes Alan West, Herman Cain.  What tribe do they belong to?  They belong to the American tribe.
There is a better way to identify the enemies of America than by color.  Using the color logic that tacitly implies
Storm Front as American values or at the least more American than, other than white.

[Pandora]

Screw race, creed and all that rot!  New arrivals until recent decades assimilated with us, they didn't force us to adopt to their hodgepodge whateverthehell they brought over!  The proglodytes in media, academia and politics infected everything with their pc/multi-culti/diversity BS!  Until they and their poisonous ideology is destroyed hoping people of any flavor have a snowballs chance in hell of understanding our Founding is moot.

Right, and Pan right, BUT you should not define "they" as anybody who is not white.  That says white only, that excludes Alan West, Herman Cain.  What tribe do they belong to?  They belong to the American tribe.
There is a better way to identify the enemies of America than by color.  Using the color logic that tacitly implies
Storm Front as American values or at the least more American than, other than white.

That's not what I did at all.  I'm trying to explain why immigrants of other races are not now inculcating the values and ideals of, nor relating to because of race and culture, the Founding Fathers.

I wrote the word culture more than once and you've continued to ignore it.  "Storm Front"?  Really?

AND, not to put too fine a point on it, go talk to immigrants of other races and see who they define as White and how they classify themselves.

[LadyVirginia]

AND, not to put too fine a point on it, go talk to immigrants of other races and see who they define as White and how they classify themselves.

We have Indian acquaintences, as in from India, who call themselves white. 

How many are doing that today, though, Americanizing their names?  How many consider themselves American first, instead of Hyphenated-American?

It seems we have the exact opposite.  Americans naming their kids anything as long as it sounds "ethnic".

It makes us smile when we look over our family tree---I'm sure others find this too---many kids were named after G Washingtion, B Franklin, T Jefferson, etc

[Libertas]

Coulda left it at American tribe...

[Pandora]

Coulda left it at American tribe...

Coulda.  Probably shoulda.

It annoys folks every time I bring this up, which is regretful.  It needs saying. 

[Glock32]

But they're not. They're interested in Aztlan, in recolonizing what was "stolen". They have a raison d'etre that is predicated on being consciously NOT invested in the Founding Fathers or America's history.

No, the Aztlans are recolonizing and the Aztlans are a miniscule minority. 
To set apart the good men and women who work, toil, fight, and die Red White and Blue
who are not white is a very biased approach to being American.

I consider it an informed bias based on empirical observation. And it's just that, a bias. It can be readily disproved by individuals. But that does not mean populations don't have a center of gravity, a middle of the bell curve that is more useful at predicting the near future. If you think we can import Mexico's population and be left with anything resembling the USA you are free to that opinion. It is not one I share.

One of the local Hispanic radio stations is called "La Raza" and there are bumper stickers for it everywhere. I doubt that the sentiment of the Aztlan people is just a tiny minority -- or is the radio station and its listeners unaware of the group calling itself La Raza? If they wanted to assimilate into the greater American experience they would be making obvious efforts to that end. Instead what I see are foreign outposts eagerly anticipating the passing of a decrepit civilization still tentatively clinging to its Dead Old White Guy founders. There are parts of this city that resemble Tijuana. I am to believe that this, the fastest growing segment of the population, is the vessel that will carry forth the American traditions and history?

[LadyVirginia]

I am to believe that this, the fastest growing segment of the population, is the vessel that will carry forth the American traditions and history?

Their own history and traditions don't support that conclusion.