Topic: Advice from the Bosnian Teotwawki

[Weisshaupt]

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[Predator Don]

Ok.....I'm not armed enough. I liked the idea of small items to trade, like the lighters. Guns and sanitation, that's the ticket.

[Glock32]

Alcohol too. That is an extremely versatile trade good. Always in demand. It can also double as an antiseptic for field medicine.

[trapeze]

Interesting.

I am somewhat late to the prepper movement but am well along the way now. I have mostly completed my storeroom structure and have been working on filling it several days per week. My storeroom is located below grade and I don't think the temperature ever gets above 70F in the summer. In the winter it is between 55F and 60F so pretty good for storage. Plus, zero sunlight so that's good, too. A few more shelves and then redo the lighting and get a decent lock on the door and I will be there.

A trip to the grocery store for anything at all will usually end up with several items that go into the storeroom. I am putting away grocery store items for what I think of as near term storage...stuff that can be used on a day to day basis and can therefore be rotated continuously to ensure relative freshness. But I am also putting away things which have a very long shelf life such as rice, sugar, honey, etc. in large quantities so that they could be used for survival if needed. Then there are the #10 cans of freeze dried stuff...anytime I go to Walmart I pick up 2 or 3 cans to add to my collection. And since I drink a lot of diet soft drinks in 2-liter bottles I have a fairly good source of free storage containers for things like rice, beans, sugar, potato flakes, macaroni, etc.

Along with the food items are hygiene items such as toothpaste, soap, etc. and then there are various other things like batteries and cans of propane for my camping stove.

I have to admit that I do enjoy storing distilled alcohol products because they never go bad and I look forward to consuming them at some point. I figure that I might as well buy the good stuff so that I can use it myself whenever I feel like it. A couple of years ago I scavenged a small wine rack from a liquor store that was going out of business. It holds about two hundred and fifty bottles and I'm closing in on the one hundred bottle mark...mostly wine but as I said, I'm working harder on distilled stuff now.

I have got to get going on water, too. I have a 50 gallon storage tank (most people do in the form of the water heater) but I am going to eventually have about 500 gallons of drinking water on site. Also have a super water filter on my list. We live in an area where there are streams and lakes plus there is snow on the ground a lot of the year so filtration needs to be part of the strategy.

I have a pretty good collection of firearms and ammunition but I am always looking to add to it whenever it makes sense.

I am pretty convinced that things are going to go south at some point because "unsustainable" does mean something to me. So, yeah, I'm thinking economic collapse of one sort or another is kind of unavoidable. May as well be ready for it.

[Libertas]

Need more antibiotics, when even a scratch can get infected... 

[Weisshaupt]

I have to admit that I do enjoy storing distilled alcohol products because they never go bad and I look forward to consuming them at some point.

Have you considered acquiring/building a Still?  You can legally use one if you get a small fuel  producer license from the Feds.  You have to denature the alcohol for use as fuel of course.

I have got to get going on water, too. I have a 50 gallon storage tank (most people do in the form of the water heater) but I am going to eventually have about 500 gallons of drinking water on site. Also have a super water filter on my list. We live in an area where there are streams and lakes plus there is snow on the ground a lot of the year so filtration needs to be part of the strategy.

Don't you have a well?  Giardia is not something you can afford to mess with come Teotwawki. Yes, you can filter the water. But typically this means collecting it from those original sources..meaning its on your hands, on your shoes, etc.. If you keep the filter away from those places and can bring the water to it, it helps,  but contamination during the backwash to clean the filter, or just from your hands etc touching it it a real concern - especially as the morons around you start deciding that the stream is a wonderful place to dump their sewage. Make dang sure you have lots of disinfectant on hand. -- The stuff you disinfect your still with is probably a good choice.. 

Then there is the actual security problem involved in going to collect the water and walking back without being shot.

Further, with no well, what are you going to do with your own waste?  Dig a latrine? Maybe I am just old and lazy, but I can't deal with that crap when I need to be focused on what the bad guys are doing.  It sounds like you are doing great on the food stores, but having reliable water and power would be next on my list - even it that just means an illegal well  , a solar well pump and a cistern. If you are going to be spending money, it does make sense that you are using it to produce long term solutions - not a stop gap that will provide you and extra month or two.

If this breaks into a civil war, it is going to look like Bosnia. Utilities will be  under attack and unreliable if available at all.
If its an economic collapse only, it won't be as bad, but if you are rural, they are not going to pay to maintain the utilities out there. They will run them till they break and then quit (no federal grant money or enforcement laws to force them to provide you know)  Rural areas will get infrequent food and supply deliveries for the same reason. (this is how Michelle convinced me that an in town place may be prudent- we have a rural place to go to if town becomes untenable, but town is where supplies and some semblance of law and order will be if it exists at all)  Either way, foodstuffs and supplies to resupply with etc will become more expensive and harder to obtain. This is going to last YEARS and YEARS and I think that is the time frame you need to be planning for.

[trapeze]

Unfortunately, resources not being unlimited, I have to work on this a bit at a time. So...food and water storage come first.

Other things will have to come later.

[trapeze]

This is the water filter that I am going to get.

[Weisshaupt]

This is the water filter that I am going to get.

Those are really good filters. Used one when I was younger and hiked and camped a lot...  But its a LOT of pumping. Then I went   You would be better off with something gravity fed- put the bad water in on top- get good water out on the bottom. Minimal labor required. The Berkey Filters are very popular with the Prepper crowd ( no I don't have one- I have a different gravity fed filter for emergency use)  The Berkeys are large enough that you can easily filter for an entire family ( the larger ones can filter enough for a large group of 40) and are in the same price range as the Katadyn.  The Katadyn cost so much largely because its compact and can be easily used backpacking and camping.  However, for the scenario you are looking at - where this will be your primary source of water,  using that Pump will be killer- both from an effort standpoint and the time you sit there exposed and defenseless on a riverbank.. Better to quickly dip a bucket in a hole you have dug in the water source, and tote unclean water back to the filter,and  its easier to maintain sanitary conditions around the filter that way, and you won't be cursing every hard earned drop of clean  water that spills from the bucket on the way back from the water source ( not to mention that a bucket of clean water and the filter you are carrying might be enough to kill you for, a bucket of crap water, not so much)

If the filter comparison is to be believed then from a water output perspective, its pretty easy to see why a lot of preppers go with these.

[charlesoakwood]

The good: no permits required
The bad:   no available surface water
The ugly:  out of budget at this time

A shallow (50') well, with a hand pump.

[Weisshaupt]

The good: no permits required
The bad:   no available surface water
The ugly:  out of budget at this time

A shallow (50') well, with a hand pump.

Hey CO,  I am confused

A) Weren't you getting a house boat?
B) How would you know how deep your well needs to be without drilling it?

In Colorado well depth can change dramatically - At the TEOTWAWKI place, my well is 250' deep, produces 11 Gpm and is  higher in elevation than my neighbors.  His is a quarter mile away, 100' lower in elevation, 900'  deep, and has perforated casing for 500' of that and still only produces 2 gpm.  Even out on the plains you will see +/- 300-400 feet differences in well depths.  A typical well job will run 15-20K and may or may not hit water.

I understand the expense considerations , but its best to at least set yourself up for eventual improvements. This is a hand pump that  can be easily electrified and automated later, and can at least be set up to be plumbed to a house, even if you don't do it right way.

[trapeze]

I liked the Katadyn because it will produce 13,000 gallons of water and can fit in a backpack if mobility is required. That's a lot of water for drinking and food preparation. After I get it I will probably get a gravity fed filter for convenience but my first priority is practicality and the Katadyn Pocket looked to me to be the best of both worlds. Pricey at just under $300 but it will allow me to not have to store so much on site. As I said earlier, I have access to both lakes and streams plus a good part of the year: snow.

[charlesoakwood]

The house (shanty) boat is more of a wish list item.

I have read that 50' is the maximum depth with a common hand pump...
 
Should have followed your link before writing.  That's great, I didn't know it existed.
You just saved me a boat load of money. 

"The Simple Pump must be set at least ten feet above the submersible."

Aww g's, 10', Don't know if I have that much water above my pump. That sure is a lot of water.

[Glock32]

Fluid dynamics is some complex stuff.  I used to be into saltwater/reef aquariums (and would be still, if I had a bottomless bank account) and there's all kinds of things you have to take into account in selecting the right pump. There's flow rate, and then there's "head", i.e. the amount of gravitational force the pump must overcome. I figure that's going to be your main concern in a well pump. I remember with the aquarium pumps, you could get pumps that moved huge volumes of water, but just a couple of feet of vertical "head" would totally bog them down. Then there were pumps with a modest flow rate, but could easily pump water over 20 vertical feet.

One thing I do have leftover from my reef aquarium is a nice reverse osmosis filter with a deionizing chamber, made by SpectraPure. I paid a ridiculous sum for it, back when RO filters were a specialty item. Now you can find them in home improvement stores.

[Libertas]

I think the original link for this got nuked...but I think I found another...

https://powersfirearmstraining.com/resources/Words%20from%20a%20Bosnian%20Survivalist.pdf

[Lady Virginia]

I think the original link for this got nuked...but I think I found another...

https://powersfirearmstraining.com/resources/Words%20from%20a%20Bosnian%20Survivalist.pdf

thanks

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