Author Topic: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine  (Read 90042 times)

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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #820 on: June 06, 2022, 11:37:02 AM »
The dead silence on the de facto partitioning is deafening...
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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #821 on: June 07, 2022, 08:40:50 AM »
Oh, well, about to get louder...people got bored with nobody killing anybody and destroying stuff...so, this should correct that oversight...

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/uk-joins-us-sending-longer-range-rockets-ukraine-despite-putin-warnings

War is back on.
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #822 on: June 07, 2022, 10:58:50 AM »

After the invasion Zelensky submitted a proposal at Istanbul. I do not know the exact language. In short, the west (US and UK and ?) would sign  a security agreement to defend Ukraine against Russian aggression but it would not include Crimea and Donbass(?).

Boris Johnson flew to Kiev and told them that the west would not agree to this if it did not include Donbass and Crimea. I think he was carrying this message from the US. Kiev then withdrew the proposal. Russia concluded Kiev was negotiating in bad faith and that diplomacy was pointless.  After Kiev withdrew the proposal the US agreed to send lots more money.

The effective partition could have been done much earlier without more bloodshed.
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #823 on: June 07, 2022, 11:12:54 AM »
I posted this elsewhere. IMO the US has a blind spot when it comes to peace as a goal. We are like the Thing. It is always clobberin' time. I fail to see the upside of war in Ukraine.

Pretend you are the Biden admin and were presented with these facts, most from open sources. Feb 2022. What would you do?

1. The US controls the purse strings of Ukraine. You know this as former point man on Ukraine.
2. The US has been telling UA privately that they will never join NATO while publicly saying the matter is not settled.
3. Ukraine recently said they wanted nukes at Munich and the US remained silent on the matter. This reportedly upset Russia.
4. Ukraine has massed 60-100K troops on the Donbass border.
5. Ukraine has recently greatly increased shelling the Donbass, typically prelude to an attack.
6. If Ukraine attacks Donbass Russia will likely attack as doing nothing is politically damaging. A Russian pre-emptive attack is less likely.
7. Ukraine and Russia agreed to the Minsk agreements in 2014 and 2015 but Ukraine refuses to implement them or even meet with parties from Donbass.
8. US has armed Kiev and trained 1/3 of forces to NATO standards. Kiev used the 8 years to dig in in the east and move anti Russian forces into Russian friendly areas.

Do you
A. Tell Kiev privately and publicly that they will never join NATO or get nukes and to meet to implement Minsk.

B. Tell them to go for it as we have their back.

It is highly likely the US also had top secret information on the impending attack. Either shared info or spy obtained.

I went to the OSCE site and looked at some single day numbers for "explosions" in the Donetsk and Luhansk regions.
For 2022 Donetsk Luhansk
2/23 345 1075
2/22 332 1149
1/22 14 50
12/22 74 42
11/20 95 51
10/22 70 39
9/22 8 76
8/21 6 60

https://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/reports?page=21
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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #824 on: June 07, 2022, 11:30:51 AM »
I would order off the menu...go off script...as I see no appeal in any of those options listed...and under the JoeFraud occupation government nobody is going to be pleased with any outcome so really nothing had changed...our voiced don't matter...nobody's voices matter...only the DeepState masters and DeepPockets voices matter...

But if you must press...assuming I had 100% control of American policy...I would force a trade...

Take your paltry Russian-speaking territories and do what you will with them...keep the shathole of Syria and as long as no BS spills out of it, whatever, don't care...prop up the failed Venezuelan Marxist state, whatever...in return for disarming Iran of nuclear materials...by force if necessary...

Deal?

Next up, North Korea...
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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #825 on: June 09, 2022, 09:24:11 AM »
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ousted-ukrainian-official-breaks-silence-admits-she-lied-about-mass-rape-russians

Well, much like waiting 48 hours for the truth behind incidents in America to reveal facts vs MarxistMedia BS...this one needed time...

Pretty serious allegations to level at another nation without facts to back it up...I say if the Euro's don't punish her slander...perhaps throwing her to the Russians would be poetic justice? 

ETA -

As far as this goes...

https://www.zerohedge.com/military/ukraine-not-giving-us-info-about-its-military-ops-despite-receiving-billions

Why not keep occupied America in the dark?  Everybody else ignoring/laughing at this dumpsterfire of a government...I would screw them over too every chance I get...their stupidity demands it be done!

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/06/u-s-intelligence-really-screwed/

And that there is the result of corrupt institutions!

Fall of Rome 2.0 is going to make 1.0 look like a smooth orderly transition...
« Last Edit: June 09, 2022, 12:00:07 PM by Libertas »
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #826 on: June 09, 2022, 02:18:23 PM »

Quote
https://www.zerohedge.com/military/ukraine-not-giving-us-info-about-its-military-ops-despite-receiving-billions

I read one interpretation of this.

The US govt and MSM have been printing 95% "Russia is losing" narratives. Now they have to face Russia is winning reality.

So it is not their fault. UA has been lying to us.
The US has no military experts to interpret facts on their own. We have have no satellites of anyone who can read a map.

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #827 on: June 09, 2022, 02:58:32 PM »

Quote
https://www.zerohedge.com/military/ukraine-not-giving-us-info-about-its-military-ops-despite-receiving-billions

I read one interpretation of this.

The US govt and MSM have been printing 95% "Russia is losing" narratives. Now they have to face Russia is winning reality.

So it is not their fault. UA has been lying to us.
The US has no military experts to interpret facts on their own. We have have no satellites of anyone who can read a map.

It's not the US govt's fault?  The UA has been LYING?!  Oh noes!  (I'm presuming your last two sentences are /sarc.)

Some of the biggest and worst liars on the planet live in DC and work in the US govt.

The MSM *has* been lying their lying butts off ....... but the alt-right media knew just about from jump who was lying and about what.
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #828 on: June 09, 2022, 04:32:18 PM »

Quote
https://www.zerohedge.com/military/ukraine-not-giving-us-info-about-its-military-ops-despite-receiving-billions

I read one interpretation of this.

The US govt and MSM have been printing 95% "Russia is losing" narratives. Now they have to face Russia is winning reality.

So it is not their fault. UA has been lying to us.
The US has no military experts to interpret facts on their own. We have have no satellites of anyone who can read a map.

It's not the US govt's fault?  The UA has been LYING?!  Oh noes!  (I'm presuming your last two sentences are /sarc.)

Some of the biggest and worst liars on the planet live in DC and work in the US govt.

The MSM *has* been lying their lying butts off ....... but the alt-right media knew just about from jump who was lying and about what.

Yes. Sarcasm.
I remember long ago some Clinton era intelligence guy. He said "Everybody lies. The trick is to lie first."
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Online Pablo de Fleurs

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #829 on: June 09, 2022, 10:30:10 PM »
We attended a presentation by Dr. Tau Braun this evening that indicated that the NEXT #plandemic under gain-of-function manipulation in the Ukrainian bio-labs was to be Polio.

Putin's priorities, thus, work to everyone's benefit.
2 Timothy 1:7
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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #830 on: June 10, 2022, 08:41:47 AM »
We attended a presentation by Dr. Tau Braun this evening that indicated that the NEXT #plandemic under gain-of-function manipulation in the Ukrainian bio-labs was to be Polio.

Putin's priorities, thus, work to everyone's benefit.

Most of us are already vaccinated against polio.  Will that not provide protection?
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Online Pablo de Fleurs

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #831 on: June 10, 2022, 09:10:05 AM »
We attended a presentation by Dr. Tau Braun this evening that indicated that the NEXT #plandemic under gain-of-function manipulation in the Ukrainian bio-labs was to be Polio.

Putin's priorities, thus, work to everyone's benefit.

Most of us are already vaccinated against polio.  Will that not provide protection?

I don't know: "Gain-of-Function Polio", I'd imagine, would be much nastier (who knows how it's being bio-engineered?)

His other point (and, ironically, he was speaking in a Ukrainian church) was that the destruction, dismantling of the bio-labs is something we all, obviously, benefit from.

Other points mentioned: the Vax contains:

  • 4 strains of HIV
  • a strain of rabies
  • malaria, et al
  • bungarotoxin (snake venom)
  • All wrapped in a cystine knot protein, making it harder to destroy (the knot, adding stability & protection to the ingredients)

He also mentioned the coming "War on meat & protein" as well as stating that the ingredients in the "artificial meats" on the horizon will create toxic reactions in the bodies of the vaxxed -- but will not be outwardly visible (symptoms) until they inflict heavy internal damage.

Additionally, he hypothesizes that the baby formula "shortage" is a test -- with additional food shortages to be here soon (no date).

https://www.drtaubraun.com/

https://www.violenceprevention.com/dr-tau-braun


« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 09:17:45 AM by Pablo de Fleurs »
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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #832 on: June 10, 2022, 09:26:09 AM »
Resistance to tyranny is obedience to God.

Looks like resistance is going to be spiking...

Deus Vult
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #833 on: June 10, 2022, 03:23:07 PM »


Russia's in real trouble now. /s

https://t.me/EurasianChoice/15049
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/climate-crisis-will-bring-on-russias-downfall-khlvk6bxq
Climate crisis will bring on Russia’s downfall
The war has exposed another of Putin’s great miscalculations: ignoring a shift from fossil fuels
Roger Boyes
Tuesday June 07 2022, 9.00pm BST, The Times

Russia has made plenty of tactical mistakes in the war against Ukraine but it is one great strategic miscalculation by Vladimir Putin that will be the nation’s undoing. He launched his war at a time when global climate change was already pushing the developed world to bid a long farewell to the fossil fuels that accounted last year for 36 per cent of Russia’s budget.

Now sanctions and a complete western rethink about Moscow’s energy leverage over Europe are massively accelerating that process. The inevitable result: Russia, which built its wealth and political power on the back of manipulated gas monopolies and ruthless pipeline politics, is set to become a shrunken power, albeit one that retains a nuclear arsenal.
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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #834 on: June 13, 2022, 08:03:21 AM »
Just putting a flower on a turd...

I'm sure the masses forced into an immobile society where each is equally miserable and living in government buildings will be their dream come true...

 ::laughonfloor::
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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #835 on: June 13, 2022, 09:07:13 AM »
https://www.zerohedge.com/military/russian-forces-seize-center-last-holdout-city-luhansk-province

First rule of Fight Club - Have the ability to fight before fighting...   :o   ::)
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #836 on: June 15, 2022, 06:02:47 PM »
Recently in Ukraine.
Kiev is shelling and sending rockets into civilian areas like Dontesk city center. Some are cluster munitions.
This is the most intense shelling of 8 years. Why? Why not use them on Russian military targets?

The evidence for this is the location of the hits well behind conflict lines, testimony of locals about the lack of military, and the visual confirmation of civilian reporters with video cameras.

Most of the western press refuses to cover this. When they do cover it they say it was Russians shelling the Russian ethnic areas.   There are a large number of such  videos.  Ukraine denies using cluster munitions but the spent rockets are filmed lying on the ground. There is also evidence of EU countries sending their cluster munitions to Ukraine. '

Some German reporter has been reporting from the ground in Donbass for 6 months. The German govt deleted her material, froze her bank account and is prosecuting her.

https://youtu.be/2G5v2Xx7JOk
https://t.me/UkraineHumanRightsAbuses/5781

https://t.me/Reality_Theories/6988

https://youtu.be/olTwZbfzdPk

https://youtu.be/Ub2H8mcvmcM

https://youtu.be/Nl5WWmKgCaQ?t=1

https://t.me/heilukraine1959/1524
« Last Edit: June 15, 2022, 06:11:19 PM by patentlymn »
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Offline Libertas

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #837 on: June 16, 2022, 09:09:57 AM »
World is unsane...everywhere...no film at 11...(it's been running continuously for decades)...

Only one winner...just one...



ETA -

Morons...

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/blog/2022/06/15/first-american-mercenary-contractors-captured-in-ukraine-by-russian-military/

They made their choice...that they chose poorly...not my fracking problem, not your fracking problem...it's their fracking problem...

 ::smallestviolin::
« Last Edit: June 16, 2022, 09:58:59 AM by Libertas »
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #838 on: June 16, 2022, 11:37:22 AM »
Some of the reporting on Ukraine will be shown to very, very wrong. Time will tell. I pay little attention daily 'news' on the battles. Zelensky makes similar "brave leader" speeches regardless of what happens so I ignore him.

Recently Kiev has been shelling civilian centers in Donetsk the heaviest in 8 years while complaining about the need more ammo. The web is filled with reports, photos, videos, and local testimonies. Most of the MSM in the west buries this.

IMO Russia has set up a meat grinder in Severodonetsk and Kiev is feeding untrained newly conscripted troops into it. There are lots of video clips of press gangs in Ukraine chasing fleeing suspects.

https://www.newsweek.com/dont-fooled-what-happened-severodonetsk-putin-losing-war-1715460
Putin Is Losing the War. Don't Be Fooled by What Happened in Severodonetsk
By William M. Arkin On 6/14/22 at 5:00 AM EDT
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Online patentlymn

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Re: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine
« Reply #839 on: June 16, 2022, 01:43:04 PM »
A link with links to supporting the existence of the US backed coup.
If you want good look into the history of the coup this is good.

https://theduran.com/have-europeans-been-profoundly-deceived/
Have Europeans been profoundly deceived?

by Eric Zuesse

Here is set of info I did not know
http://archive.is/7qPpt#selection-2371.458-3289.346
...
4: Now we know what Victoria Nuland was referring to when she said “F–k the EU!” Ashton and Paet are more concerned about the interests of their mega-investors than about the lives of any Ukrainians, but aren’t (as Nuland was) eager for Ukraine’s nazis to run that country and to become the people who would bring Ukraine into the EU. They don’t want that (they had had enough of Hitler, and also of Mussolini). Obama does: he craves Ukraine in NATO; that’s why he’s installing this government. That’s how right-wing our President is. And all of this happened barely two months after Nuland had told a group of extremist right-wingers, with proud satisfaction, that, “We have invested more than five billion dollars to help Ukraine to achieve these and other goals,” which she euphemistically called “democracy” (which Ukraine actually already had, before we took them over and placed nazis and other fascists in charge there, but which democracy Obama didn’t like there; so, he ended it and started his ethnic cleansing to get rid of the voters he didn’t want to be there; he used the local nazis to do precisely that; that’s why he chose them to rule).

Then, on May 1st of 2014, the IMF’s Christine Lagarde made clear that the IMF would halt the continuation of loans to Ukraine unless the Kiev government either killed or else expelled the independence-seeking residents in the southeastern half of Ukraine. From her standpoint, those people needed to be defeated, conquered, right away, because most of Ukraine’s industry and valuable properties are in the southeast, and the Obama-IMF plan was for the privatization of virtually everything in Ukraine, especially of those valuable properties in the southeast, in order to be able to repay Ukraine’s debts to western investors (after billions from those loans had already long-since been skimmed off by Ukraine’s ruling oligarchs and socked away into secret bank accounts in Switzerland and elsewhere — which is why those Ukrianian debts now were so large — but Christine Lagarde isn’t going after their bank accounts). Also, this fire-sale of those formerly state-owned properties would drive down the prices of them, and thus engender huge future investment-gains for the western aristocrats who would be buying them up.

This would be an operation to shove aside Russia’s oligarchs and the Russian government itself, which were Ukraine’s biggest creditors, to grab everything there, leaving nothing for the Russians — and totally stripping the Ukrainian government’s services (like health care, and road-maintenance) to the Ukrainian people, thus making Ukraine’s public the ultimate victims of the entire operation.

The day after that IMF warning, occurred the Kiev regime’s massacre of independence-supporters inside Odessa’s Trade Unions Building on May 2nd, run by Obama’s Ukrainian agents. This was the event that actually sparked Ukraine’s civil war, because it indicated to the people in the southeast: the Kiev government want to kill us. That civil war has been actually an ethnic-cleansing campaign against the residents in southeastern Ukraine, whom Obama and his hacks call “terrorists” in order to fool their believing suckers in the U.S. and rest of the West. Obama’s forces in Ukraine are not looking to win hearts and minds in the occupied areas, but instead to exterminate some so that the survivors will simply flee to Russia, where they can no longer vote in Ukrainian “elections.” On 13 July 2014, Britain’s Financial Times headlined from Slavyansk, “Bitter Residents of Slavyansk Pick Up Pieces of Shattered City,” and reported a typical resident saying:
“Nobody will tell you the truth now, it is dangerous,” she said. “But someone, someday, will pay for this.”


Pointing to a nearby building that had lost most of its façade, she said a rebel fighter’s wife had died there. “Do you think he shot at his home and killed his wife?” [She was mocking the West’s calling the residents there ‘terrorists,’ when it is actually Obama’s people who are terrorizing them, to flee.]
“About 20 per cent of our city feels liberated by the Ukrainian army. The rest [feel they] are now under occupation,” she added.

What Obama’s forces are doing there isn’t even intended to be any “liberation,” no more than Hitler was intending to “liberate” Belgium, or Poland, or France. It is sheer military domination. However, this time, instead of domination purely for theft and exploitation, it is being done also in order to drive the residents there out. Unlike the IMF and western investors, Obama also has a strictly military objective: to expel and/or kill the people in Ukraine’s southeast who were pro-Russian and who therefore opposed the building of NATO missile bases there, to be aimed against Moscow a mere ten-minute flight away from Russia’s nuclear annihilation. “Nuclear primacy” (replacing”MAD”) is a chief goal of this President, as it had been of his predecessors going back at least as far as Bill Clinton (and actually back to Ronald Reagan’s “Star Wars” program). Ukraine, right next door to Russia, is a key to their goal of, as Obama put it, “Here’s my bottom line: America must always lead on the world stage. If we don’t, no one else will.” Obama alleged: “Russia’s aggression toward former Soviet states unnerves capitals in Europe, while China’s economic rise and military reach worries its neighbors. From Brazil to India, rising middle classes compete with us.” So, he phrases it as stopping “Russia’s aggression.” (Also note that he phrases our “competitors” as being “rising middle classes,” and not as being foreign aristocracies; and he is talking there at West Point, to the military, for whom “competitors” are actually the enemies. He’s telling West Pointers that they’re at war against “rising middle classes,” and not against foreign aristocracies — as they actually are.) Think what would have happened, then, if Khruschev had similarly said that he wanted Soviet nuclear missiles in Cuba in order to stop “American aggression.” We probably wouldn’t even be here to talk about it, because there would probably then have been a nuclear war; but it seems that Khruschev wasn’t as arrogant as is Obama. He was a lot more reasonable than is Obama. Times have certainly changed.
...
« Last Edit: June 16, 2022, 02:10:10 PM by patentlymn »
When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown