Author Topic: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?  (Read 18303 times)

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Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #60 on: March 20, 2025, 09:25:19 AM »
How can he be such a fop in all things...yet somehow be an expert shot?  I don't believe it for many reasons...

And, most top shooters I am aware of like shooting, like love it...and practice often...nowhere is there any evidence he practiced shooting anywhere anytime leading up to the assassination...  Just supposed to have shot a brand new mail-order never sighted-in bolt action rifle cold on assassination day...

Sure, what's not to believe?

 :o
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Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #61 on: March 20, 2025, 11:25:38 AM »


No Idea why they would pull this...can only conclude the various attachments mentions in the leading paragraph need to be sucked under the State cover umbrella so it all can stay secret...





H/T's-CTH

https://wikispooks.com/wiki/David_Carey

32 year CIA vet who looks like he knows where bodies are buried...



H/T's-WRSA@CF

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Offline Syzygy

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #62 on: March 20, 2025, 12:40:20 PM »
How can he be such a fop in all things...yet somehow be an expert shot?  I don't believe it for many reasons...

And, most top shooters I am aware of like shooting, like love it...and practice often...nowhere is there any evidence he practiced shooting anywhere anytime leading up to the assassination...  Just supposed to have shot a brand new mail-order never sighted-in bolt action rifle cold on assassination day...

Sure, what's not to believe?

 :o
Believe what you will,  but he was not an "expert" shot,  but rather an adequate enough shot to qualify fairly highly to Marine Corps standards. 
The Corps believed and put into practice what my Junior ROTC SAI and Rifle Club coach said:  "Good marksmanship is acquired in the classroom,  not on the range."  He was himself a crack shot who actually taught marksmanship principles in the Army and was at one time a range safety officer.
In the Corps,  we packed up our sh!t and moved to the barracks at the range for the 2 weeks of training and qualification.  The first week was nothing but classroom instruction and dry firing in every position.  It was only after that did we send the first round downrange to start the qualification process,  which was the second week's objective. 
Knowing the great emphasis the Corps places on marksmanship,   and still discounting a former Marine's shooting abilities,  just doesn't make a whole lot of sense, in my opinion.   If such is needed to "prop up" and keep alive some long held conspiracy theory,  trust me,  it ain't working.



Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #63 on: March 20, 2025, 01:15:39 PM »
How can he be such a fop in all things...yet somehow be an expert shot?  I don't believe it for many reasons...

And, most top shooters I am aware of like shooting, like love it...and practice often...nowhere is there any evidence he practiced shooting anywhere anytime leading up to the assassination...  Just supposed to have shot a brand new mail-order never sighted-in bolt action rifle cold on assassination day...

Sure, what's not to believe?

 :o
Believe what you will,  but he was not an "expert" shot,  but rather an adequate enough shot to qualify fairly highly to Marine Corps standards. 
The Corps believed and put into practice what my Junior ROTC SAI and Rifle Club coach said:  "Good marksmanship is acquired in the classroom,  not on the range."  He was himself a crack shot who actually taught marksmanship principles in the Army and was at one time a range safety officer.
In the Corps,  we packed up our sh!t and moved to the barracks at the range for the 2 weeks of training and qualification.  The first week was nothing but classroom instruction and dry firing in every position.  It was only after that did we send the first round downrange to start the qualification process,  which was the second week's objective. 
Knowing the great emphasis the Corps places on marksmanship,   and still discounting a former Marine's shooting abilities,  just doesn't make a whole lot of sense, in my opinion.   If such is needed to "prop up" and keep alive some long held conspiracy theory,  trust me,  it ain't working.

So....

A thusly trained Marine as you described...need not prep anything nor practice any scenario...they are good to go right out the gate?
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Online paulh

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #64 on: March 20, 2025, 01:27:46 PM »
I'm 81, boot camp in 62, a little shaky but will never forget half way up and centered left to right. Works every time. But oooooh those kneel positions

Offline Syzygy

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #65 on: March 20, 2025, 02:29:53 PM »
How can he be such a fop in all things...yet somehow be an expert shot?  I don't believe it for many reasons...

And, most top shooters I am aware of like shooting, like love it...and practice often...nowhere is there any evidence he practiced shooting anywhere anytime leading up to the assassination...  Just supposed to have shot a brand new mail-order never sighted-in bolt action rifle cold on assassination day...

Sure, what's not to believe?

 :o
Believe what you will,  but he was not an "expert" shot,  but rather an adequate enough shot to qualify fairly highly to Marine Corps standards. 
The Corps believed and put into practice what my Junior ROTC SAI and Rifle Club coach said:  "Good marksmanship is acquired in the classroom,  not on the range."  He was himself a crack shot who actually taught marksmanship principles in the Army and was at one time a range safety officer.
In the Corps,  we packed up our sh!t and moved to the barracks at the range for the 2 weeks of training and qualification.  The first week was nothing but classroom instruction and dry firing in every position.  It was only after that did we send the first round downrange to start the qualification process,  which was the second week's objective. 
Knowing the great emphasis the Corps places on marksmanship,   and still discounting a former Marine's shooting abilities,  just doesn't make a whole lot of sense, in my opinion.   If such is needed to "prop up" and keep alive some long held conspiracy theory,  trust me,  it ain't working.

So....

A thusly trained Marine as you described...need not prep anything nor practice any scenario...they are good to go right out the gate?
Yes.  Once learned,  never forgotten.  I haven't shot a rifle in many years,  but I would bet my bottom dollar I could shoot just as well now as I did then,  even with my failing eyesight.   You may change but the principles of good marksmanship never change.

Offline Syzygy

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #66 on: March 20, 2025, 02:55:23 PM »
I'm 81, boot camp in 62, a little shaky but will never forget half way up and centered left to right. Works every time. But oooooh those kneel positions
You're talking about the front sight blade,  of course--a "good sight picture."  Place the top of the front sight blade at 6 o'clock on the bull,  while centered left to right, top to bottom in the rear peep sight, to complete the "good sight picture."  Hold 'em and squeeze 'em. 
As it is impossible for the human eye to focus on more than one object at a time,  it is the front sight blade that should be in sharp focus,  the rear peep sight and bullseye will be fuzzy.
Yeah,  the kneeling position was painful to get in they way they wanted you to.  Almost had to be a contortionist. My favorite position was everyone else's least favorite--the off hand (standing) position.  That was because of a little trick taught to me by my Jr. ROTC SAI back  in high school.  Worked like a charm.  The off hand position was one we had to shoot in competition in the Rifle Club/Shooting Team he coached.


Online paulh

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #67 on: March 20, 2025, 04:08:37 PM »
Well, the old DI helped by stepping on the ankle

Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #68 on: March 20, 2025, 04:11:28 PM »
The front sight focus makes sense to me, applies to pistol shooting as well which I am much more familiar with, not a rifle expert by any means, but seems you two know what you're talking about so I defer to your judgement.

Plus, I like your stories.  :)
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Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #69 on: March 20, 2025, 04:51:56 PM »
Interesting...

Cue to about the 6:50 mark of the clip in the link...then again around 11:50...then again at 15:20...and again around 19:04...

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2025/03/jfk-reveals-dark-forces-behind-his-assassination-resurrected/

Most Americans would recognize such sentiments as quintessentially American, at this time these beliefs were ubiquitous...after JFK they began to be assaulted...not until Reagan did such notions get a revival, the Left nefariously made distrust of government reason to get up in the morning but when their guys were in power of the Executive and/or Congress and the Courts they were unabashed hypocrites...and now into the second Trump term we know who the DeepState is, what they are doing and that they are doing it for themselves and themselves alone and with the complicity of the Left and the Left-dominated Media...in direct opposition to We the People...

The day JFK was murdered is the day the DeepState and its accomplices began to subvert the nation, there is no other reasonable interpretation a sane person can arrive at if they are honest with themselves.
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Offline Syzygy

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #70 on: March 20, 2025, 07:39:10 PM »
The front sight focus makes sense to me, applies to pistol shooting as well which I am much more familiar with, not a rifle expert by any means, but seems you two know what you're talking about so I defer to your judgement.

Plus, I like your stories.  :)
The difference in rifle shooting as opposed to pistol shooting,  at least according to Marine Corps instruction (and yes I qualified expert in both),  is this:
In shooting a rifle such as the M1 Garand or M14 (not so much the 16) you aim at 6 o'clock on the bull/target.
In pistol shooting it's "point of aim,  point of impact."  In other words,  you aim at center mass of the target,  not at 6 o'clock on the target,  which you probably already do.
The 16 is a whole 'nuther different animal altogether,  both in sighting and in targeting.  The fact that the would be Butler assassin chose a similar weapon (AR-15?),  and got as close as he did  was shocking to me,  but as I understand it,  he was using a scope.

Offline Syzygy

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #71 on: March 20, 2025, 08:22:47 PM »
Well, the old DI helped by stepping on the ankle
Yeah,  the DI's were some sadistic sombitches, but they did have a wicked sense of humor.  After we had been dry firing for what seemed like endless hours,  with shooting jacket,  sling on our arm, and shooting glove on,  they'd give us a break,  which entailed laying the padded leather shooting glove on the ground beside us,  and letting us "beat" the circulation back into our hand against the shooting glove.  The funny part is they'd call cadence  so that we were all "in sync" with our hand pounding--"left,  left,  left right left." LOL
Another incident I remember while dry firing pre qualification:  Some recruit came up to me and told me to report to the series commander ASAP.  He was a boot luey who was checking out all the recruits who scored over 120 on the GCT,  of which I was one,  for possible qualification to OCS via the enlisted to officer program (much like what got Lt. Calley of Mai Lai fame his commission in the Army).   I not much more locked my heels in front of the Lt.  when one of our assistant DI's standing next to him  piped up and said,  "No, no,  not him.  He's too unmotivated."  He was quite right,  At that point in my 17 year old life,  all I wanted to do was go to 'Nam and kill some GD communists.  But,  "the best laid plans of mice and men..."

Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #72 on: March 21, 2025, 09:15:13 AM »
The front sight focus makes sense to me, applies to pistol shooting as well which I am much more familiar with, not a rifle expert by any means, but seems you two know what you're talking about so I defer to your judgement.

Plus, I like your stories.  :)
The difference in rifle shooting as opposed to pistol shooting,  at least according to Marine Corps instruction (and yes I qualified expert in both),  is this:
In shooting a rifle such as the M1 Garand or M14 (not so much the 16) you aim at 6 o'clock on the bull/target.
In pistol shooting it's "point of aim,  point of impact."  In other words,  you aim at center mass of the target,  not at 6 o'clock on the target,  which you probably already do.
The 16 is a whole 'nuther different animal altogether,  both in sighting and in targeting.  The fact that the would be Butler assassin chose a similar weapon (AR-15?),  and got as close as he did  was shocking to me,  but as I understand it,  he was using a scope.

So on iron sights there is still a fixed "zero" distance, right?  So depending on distance +/- zero distance you have to adjust up or down...then windage affects your horizontal, right?  I need more work with rifles, iron sights and scope.  Think I might need to find me a Marine, think I got some options around here, got some vets with experience in SEALs and Army around here too.
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Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #73 on: March 21, 2025, 12:21:13 PM »
Will have to see if any additional documentation sheds light on this Underhill character...

https://www.independentsentinel.com/john-garrett-underhills-story-of-cia-gun-runners-who-killed-jfk/

..it is curious that somebody so connected to the Agency, familiar to top Pentagon brass would mention the allegations he is quoted as having uttered and then was found dead of a "suicide" with a behind the left ear shot for a right-handed guy.

But as with all things in any case, or especially this case...any information needs triangulation to elevate the possible or probable over the merely speculative...

I reckon this is going to take a while...and is dependent upon full disclosure compliance...
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Offline Syzygy

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #74 on: March 21, 2025, 02:49:20 PM »
The front sight focus makes sense to me, applies to pistol shooting as well which I am much more familiar with, not a rifle expert by any means, but seems you two know what you're talking about so I defer to your judgement.

Plus, I like your stories.  :)
The difference in rifle shooting as opposed to pistol shooting,  at least according to Marine Corps instruction (and yes I qualified expert in both),  is this:
In shooting a rifle such as the M1 Garand or M14 (not so much the 16) you aim at 6 o'clock on the bull/target.
In pistol shooting it's "point of aim,  point of impact."  In other words,  you aim at center mass of the target,  not at 6 o'clock on the target,  which you probably already do.
The 16 is a whole 'nuther different animal altogether,  both in sighting and in targeting.  The fact that the would be Butler assassin chose a similar weapon (AR-15?),  and got as close as he did  was shocking to me,  but as I understand it,  he was using a scope.

So on iron sights there is still a fixed "zero" distance, right?  So depending on distance +/- zero distance you have to adjust up or down...then windage affects your horizontal, right?  I need more work with rifles, iron sights and scope.  Think I might need to find me a Marine, think I got some options around here, got some vets with experience in SEALs and Army around here too.
If your piece has adjustable rear sights (windage and elevation),  the first thing you need to do is get the correct zero (called dope in the Marines) for that piece.    The way to do that is set up a target 100 yds away,  set windage and elevation at zero,  and fire three shots at the target trying to get a tight group.  If the group is off target,  adjust the windage and elevation to move it on target,  assuming they adjust the same as the M1 or M14,  i.e., one click of either windage or elevation will move the impact of the bullet 1" for every 100 yds.  Whatever setting you arrive at will be the correct zero for that rifle,  and should be set every time you start to use the rifle.  Adjust according to distance and wind when necessary using the same "formula" (1 click will move impact 1" for every 100 yds).
If your sights adjust differently,  learn what they do to affect the impact and still follow through with this method of getting your rifle's zero setting. 
The AR-15,  if like the 16,  is very different.  I remember getting the zero on our 16,  we shot at at a small head and shoulders target only a short distance away (25' I think it was or maybe 50').  I shot a 3 round group so tight you could cover it with a dime.  Off target,  so the instructor gave me the the correct settings to put me in the black.  Was to shoot 3 more rounds to ensure the correct settings,  but the thing jammed.  So,  the fourth round I ever fired on a 16 jammed the thing.  Never had a whole lot of confidence in the 16 since.
_________
BTW,  did you see this:
Declassified JFK File Confirms CIA Rejected ‘Lone Gunman’ Theory Weeks After JFK Assassination
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2025/03/declassified-jfk-file-confirms-cia-rejected-lone-gunman/

I think the headline is a little misleading.  From what little I read of it,  it sounds like they had their Florida offices looking into possible Cuban connections.

Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #75 on: March 24, 2025, 08:32:57 AM »
The front sight focus makes sense to me, applies to pistol shooting as well which I am much more familiar with, not a rifle expert by any means, but seems you two know what you're talking about so I defer to your judgement.

Plus, I like your stories.  :)
The difference in rifle shooting as opposed to pistol shooting,  at least according to Marine Corps instruction (and yes I qualified expert in both),  is this:
In shooting a rifle such as the M1 Garand or M14 (not so much the 16) you aim at 6 o'clock on the bull/target.
In pistol shooting it's "point of aim,  point of impact."  In other words,  you aim at center mass of the target,  not at 6 o'clock on the target,  which you probably already do.
The 16 is a whole 'nuther different animal altogether,  both in sighting and in targeting.  The fact that the would be Butler assassin chose a similar weapon (AR-15?),  and got as close as he did  was shocking to me,  but as I understand it,  he was using a scope.

So on iron sights there is still a fixed "zero" distance, right?  So depending on distance +/- zero distance you have to adjust up or down...then windage affects your horizontal, right?  I need more work with rifles, iron sights and scope.  Think I might need to find me a Marine, think I got some options around here, got some vets with experience in SEALs and Army around here too.
If your piece has adjustable rear sights (windage and elevation),  the first thing you need to do is get the correct zero (called dope in the Marines) for that piece.    The way to do that is set up a target 100 yds away,  set windage and elevation at zero,  and fire three shots at the target trying to get a tight group.  If the group is off target,  adjust the windage and elevation to move it on target,  assuming they adjust the same as the M1 or M14,  i.e., one click of either windage or elevation will move the impact of the bullet 1" for every 100 yds.  Whatever setting you arrive at will be the correct zero for that rifle,  and should be set every time you start to use the rifle.  Adjust according to distance and wind when necessary using the same "formula" (1 click will move impact 1" for every 100 yds).
If your sights adjust differently,  learn what they do to affect the impact and still follow through with this method of getting your rifle's zero setting. 
The AR-15,  if like the 16,  is very different.  I remember getting the zero on our 16,  we shot at at a small head and shoulders target only a short distance away (25' I think it was or maybe 50').  I shot a 3 round group so tight you could cover it with a dime.  Off target,  so the instructor gave me the the correct settings to put me in the black.  Was to shoot 3 more rounds to ensure the correct settings,  but the thing jammed.  So,  the fourth round I ever fired on a 16 jammed the thing.  Never had a whole lot of confidence in the 16 since.
_________
BTW,  did you see this:
Declassified JFK File Confirms CIA Rejected ‘Lone Gunman’ Theory Weeks After JFK Assassination
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2025/03/declassified-jfk-file-confirms-cia-rejected-lone-gunman/

I think the headline is a little misleading.  From what little I read of it,  it sounds like they had their Florida offices looking into possible Cuban connections.

Thanks, much of what you outlined resonates with my own memory of sighting in.

As for the CIA link, yeah, I saw that...there is so much curious flows every which way...if the CIA used mobsters and Cubans apparently that link makes it look like they then threw them under the bus to cover their own butt...

Again, we need to triangulate all statements to make a reasonable whole...

All I know for sure is the CIA knew a lot more than what it was willing to let on to and apparently didn't feel it needed to/wanted to warn the Secret Service about threats up to and including Oswald...

So for more than anything it is embarrassment a form of internal xenophobia about all others that makes them look like boobs...

Enough so that simple things like this flourish...

H/T-WRSA@GAB

...and I am not dismissing much of that out of hand...the Warren Commission IMO missed/refused to look at a lot of other evidence and some of the people on the commission (CIA et al) make me snort...nobody benefitted more from JFK's death than LBJ and the DeepState...never bought the official Watergate story, those burglars were sketchy AF and overall seems a nothingburger compared to the onslaught Trump has had to weather...and Ford is Ford and may not be much else beyond that...

I need doc's that have supporting evidence before I rule anything out or build any probable picture...
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Offline patentlymn

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #76 on: March 24, 2025, 12:15:04 PM »
I have no opinion on the JFK killing. I like the guests on judge nap. At 18:30 Larry Johnson brings up possible Mossad involvement. I liked this part. At 22:20 he disputes the loan gun man.

Final Judgement book by Michael Collins Piper.


https://youtu.be/DirnFVI601E?t=1116

https://www.amazon.com/Final-Judgment-Missing-Assassination-Conspiracy/dp/0935036539


In short, JFK tried to prevent Israel from getting the nuke bomb and some CIA guys acted to get the bomb for Israel..

When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown

Offline patentlymn

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #77 on: March 24, 2025, 01:56:50 PM »


https://t.me/intelslava/74025
🇷🇺🇺🇦In the documents published on the Kennedy assassination, American journalist Ben Norton found a host of interesting things:

1. The CIA added poisonous substances to Cuban sugar sent to the USSR

2. The CIA poisoned cows in East Socialist Germany to make the image of the "poor East and prosperous West" clearer, and also added soap to children's milk, blew up railways and carried out sabotage actions in factories.
When the law becomes a ruse, lawlessness becomes legitimate. -unknown

Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #78 on: March 24, 2025, 04:34:40 PM »
I have no opinion on the JFK killing. I like the guests on judge nap. At 18:30 Larry Johnson brings up possible Mossad involvement. I liked this part. At 22:20 he disputes the loan gun man.

Final Judgement book by Michael Collins Piper.


https://youtu.be/DirnFVI601E?t=1116

https://www.amazon.com/Final-Judgment-Missing-Assassination-Conspiracy/dp/0935036539


In short, JFK tried to prevent Israel from getting the nuke bomb and some CIA guys acted to get the bomb for Israel..

Yeah, heard that rumor too, not buying it.  But it appeals to the neo-nazi impulses in certain people and their agendas...

The French helped build their reactor, and their attainment of weapons is believed to have occurred at the back end of the 60's not the front...so more so during Nixon than LBJ...

And I have yet to uncover any documentation regarding JFK and Israel and nukes...

Which is not to say the CIA didn't know about their development...they were (probably wisely) deceptive about their program...so if anything CIA sat on what they were doing and it was compartmentalized knowledge in a small silo...maybe not even shared with high-level politicians until forced to admit something less than the truth...as is their MO...
« Last Edit: March 24, 2025, 04:37:57 PM by Libertas »
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Offline Libertas

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Re: JFK Assassination Files - To release or not to release?
« Reply #79 on: March 24, 2025, 04:38:57 PM »


https://t.me/intelslava/74025
🇷🇺🇺🇦In the documents published on the Kennedy assassination, American journalist Ben Norton found a host of interesting things:

1. The CIA added poisonous substances to Cuban sugar sent to the USSR

2. The CIA poisoned cows in East Socialist Germany to make the image of the "poor East and prosperous West" clearer, and also added soap to children's milk, blew up railways and carried out sabotage actions in factories.

That's just good 'ol Cold War warfare that bothers me not...  But, yes...interesting...
We are now where The Founders were when they faced despotism.