Author Topic: The Battle over East vs West (Russia vs Europe) continues in Ukraine (Read 244986 times)

patentlymn · « **Reply #2620 on:** January 16, 2025, 01:49:17 PM »

People in those countries care mostly about themselves. Ukr shutting off their gas or trying to is sure to piss them off.

There is something spiteful in the faction that took over the govt in Kiev. Sometimes almost satanic. I have seen Ukr churches taken over and turned into raves. What is the point in attacking a nuke plant? What if they succeeded in causing some melt down? That would hurt a lot more than the local plant.
Back at CC flyingcloud almost got a woody when talking about the prevalence of witches in ukr.

Below is a video of an ad for an online gaming place. There must have been a belief it would help the business. I do not know if it was filmed in a real church or just a film set.

https://youtu.be/1h3Qv7jjO8A
Prime time on UkrTV on the eve of Orthodox Christmas, Ukrainians dance as devils Eng subtitles

Libertas · « **Reply #2621 on:** January 16, 2025, 04:14:24 PM »

They should be pissed at their leaders for being such morons...

Libertas · « **Reply #2622 on:** January 17, 2025, 08:51:26 AM »

Hey, if Brit's are dumb enough to go along with this idiots plan to piss billions of pounds away every year for the next 100 years...I, my country...anybody...doesn't have to GAFF!

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/more-trump-proofing-aid-uk-ukraine-leaders-sign-landmark-100-year-agreement

This BS won't stop is from getting the heck out of that sh*tshow!

patentlymn · « **Reply #2623 on:** January 17, 2025, 11:36:54 AM »

Quote from: Libertas on January 16, 2025, 04:14:24 PM

They should be pissed at their leaders for being such morons...

What did their leaders do wrong about the gas?

Also the EU tried to go all SJW on Qatar and threatened to fine them. Qatar said fine. No gas for you if you do.
Azerbaijan stopped gas to EU for some unknown reason maybe technical. Norway earlier had to stop gas for one week due to technical issues.

patentlymn · « **Reply #2624 on:** January 17, 2025, 12:03:05 PM »

https://t.me/putingers_cat/12952

A little strange. Bad translation? Bad parents? I knew of some Ukr parents who sent their kids to a summer camp in Crimea and got in trouble with the Kiev govt. Crimea was the site of the best commie summer camp in USSR. You needed to be a super student or have connections to make it there.

Most of the kids in orphanages had no parents. There was one situation where they had parents and were in a boarding school for special needs children. When the Russians withdrew in a hurry they took them with them. When the Russians earlier moved into some area they asked the director of the orphanage to stay on.. She refused because that would make her a collaborator.

...
Ten-year-old Kira and thirteen-year-old Bogdan, from Kherson, are among the four hundred children who returned, from Russia, to their parents in Ukraine via third countries. In an interview with CNN’s correspondent Nick Patton in April of 2023, Kira repeated, twice, that her time spent in an orphanage in Crimea was “great”. On the other hand, Bogdan claimed that he was "bored" because children were taught "singing Russian songs" and that “Ukrainians and Russians are fraternal peoples who must live in harmony.” In the report, Kira's father, Alexander, and Bogdan's mother, Irina, admitted that they voluntarily sent their children to an orphanage in Crimea because, as single parents, they did not have the means to support them in wartime conditions. After the withdrawal of the Russian army from Kherson, they changed their minds, and, a few months later, Russian authorities returned their children, through a third country, as per procedure.
...
https://t.me/putingers_cat/12956
...

patentlymn · « **Reply #2625 on:** January 18, 2025, 11:35:41 AM »

What a joke. You could not give the Baltics to Russia. They would be a huge money suck. After the USSR many of their residents left. If Russia wanted to do it this place would be a speed bump. IMO they want to feel important.

I found this fan video that includes lots of photos from Lithuania. beautiful.

https://youtu.be/Ili_5h1Gdfc

patentlymn · « **Reply #2626 on:** January 18, 2025, 06:15:11 PM »

Here is a quote from Solzhenitsyn on Russians vs Ukrainians. It is exactly what I figured out also. He blames communism. I think that is because Lenin drew the lines around the Ukraine SSR where he did.

https://youtu.be/papLz674ibM?t=450

When I asked ChatGPT to name when the big cities in Ukraine were created above I mostly had no idea for most. The most common answer was something like created by Catherine the Great amongst Cossack villages or dwellings to secure or protect the empire's southeastern region. Some cities like Lviv and Kiev were ancient. It does not seem that the Russians conquered existing cities for the most part as they did exist.

Long ago I read that the villages in the Ukraine area had a language that varied from village to village. Now I understand the agrarian history of the Ukrainian language and the city orientation of the Russian language. People spoke their native language in the villages and spoke Russian if they or their children wanted to get ahead. I heard more than once that you rarely heard Ukrainian spoken in Kiev.

patentlymn · « **Reply #2627 on:** January 19, 2025, 01:56:06 PM »

https://t.me/myLordBebo/56067
Ukraine is renaming things in Crimea!

The Ukrainian Cabinet of Ministers proposes to rename several geographical objects in Crimea whose names contain symbols of Russian imperial policy!

patentlymn · « **Reply #2628 on:** January 19, 2025, 02:00:23 PM »

Someone finally posted a version of this with sound.
https://t.me/myLordBebo/56071
🇺🇦 2014: Ukrainians celebrate by eating a Russian baby cake … the beginnings of today’s war.

patentlymn · « **Reply #2629 on:** January 19, 2025, 08:54:35 PM »

https://t.me/myLordBebo/56257
Oopsie daisy … they can’t blame the Russians on the cables?

Libertas · « **Reply #2630 on:** January 20, 2025, 08:45:59 AM »

Quote from: patentlymn on January 17, 2025, 11:36:54 AM

Quote from: Libertas on January 16, 2025, 04:14:24 PM
They should be pissed at their leaders for being such morons...

What did their leaders do wrong about the gas?

Also the EU tried to go all SJW on Qatar and threatened to fine them. Qatar said fine. No gas for you if you do.
Azerbaijan stopped gas to EU for some unknown reason maybe technical. Norway earlier had to stop gas for one week due to technical issues.

They told their people no sacrifice is too much to support Ukraine in the war against Russia...

Libertas · « **Reply #2631 on:** January 20, 2025, 10:22:30 AM »

This Rus-centric KJorybko idea is childish...

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/merits-demilitarized-trans-dnieper-region-controlled-non-western-peacekeepers

Non-Western peacekeepers?

Just say it already, ponce!

patentlymn · « **Reply #2632 on:** January 20, 2025, 11:27:33 AM »

Return of some Ukr kids to their parents was recently in the news.
I looked into this after the iCC cited Putin or put out a warrant.
In one city the Russians were going to withdraw in a hurry and evacuated an orphanage with them.
Same thing but a boarding school for special needs kids.
10 years of shelling Donetsk city created orphans and some were adopted inside of Russia proper. The Kev faction called them Russians when shelling but called the orphans Ukrainians.
Some parents sent their kids from Ukraine to summer camps in Crimea. When the line of contact changed it became difficult to send the kids back.

Some parents in Donetsk region under Russian control sent some gifted musical students to music school in Russia for a a couple weeks. Kiev said the kids were kidnapped. The kids returned.

The Russians said they would hand the kids over the parents. The parents said this was a major hassle which is true as how to cross the war zones. Same problems for the Russians who said they were not going to throw the children into the wind. Lots of child and organ trafficking. So the UAE acted as middlemen and took care of things.

BTW the ICC relied on a report written by Yale paid for by the US state dept. I read parts of it. real crap. One of the places the kids were sent was the music school and Yale did not know that it had been toured on camera earlier.

Libertas · « **Reply #2633 on:** January 22, 2025, 12:51:38 PM »

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/zelensky-claims-200000-european-soldiers-needed-secure-peace-deal

Ha! Good luck with that!

Hey, y'all got free and fair elections yet?

More importantly...

"Compared to the hopelessness in every aspect of the previous White House chief (President Joe Biden), there is a window of opportunity today, albeit a small one," Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov told an audience at the Institute for US and Canadian Studies in Moscow, a Russian think tank that focuses on US and Canadian affairs.

"Compared to the hopelessness in every aspect of the previous White House chief (President Joe Biden), there is a window of opportunity today, albeit a small one," he added. "It's therefore important to understand with what and whom we will have to deal, how best to build relations with Washington, how best to maximise opportunities and minimise risks."

Putin has repeatedly said that he's ready to negotiate an end to the war in Ukraine, but that Russia's current control of roughly one-fifth of the country would have to be accepted, and that Ukraine must remain neutral, Reuters reports.

Trump Threatens Tariffs
In a Wednesday post to Truth Social, Trump said he's not looking to 'hurt' Russia, but that he's going to do the country "whose Economy is failing, and President Putin, a very big FAVOR," adding "Settle now, and STOP this ridiculous War! IT’S ONLY GOING TO GET WORSE. If we don’t make a “deal,” and soon, I have no other choice but to put high levels of Taxes, Tariffs, and Sanctions on anything being sold by Russia to the United States, and various other participating countries."

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/settle-now-and-stop-ridiculous-war-russia-sees-small-window-deal-ukraine-trump

Git-R-Done!

patentlymn · « **Reply #2634 on:** January 22, 2025, 05:01:22 PM »

Interesting poll. I am sure this varies by region. In Lviv they hate Russians more.
A recently returned Ukrainian kid, returned from Russia to Ukraine thanks to UAE said the time in Crimea was great. But they were bored by singing Russian songs and the teachings that Russians and Ukrainians were fraternal slavs who should live in peace. I think they have been taught differently for decade or two.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/117876

2% of Ukrainians hate Russian citizens and 17% hate Russian speakers 🤬

??Every third Ukrainian has a xenophobic (extremely intolerant) attitude towards Russian citizens and every sixth towards Russian speakers, according to a survey by KIIS (Kiev International Institute).

??The majority (83%) accept Russian speakers in their environment. This statistic has not changed over the past 1.5 years.

??Terrible Nazi attitude towards Ukrainian citizens who are Russian by nationality - 32% have a xenophobic attitude, the remaining 68% allow coexistence with them in one country. At the same time, the latter has decreased by 10% in 1.5 years.

patentlymn · « **Reply #2635 on:** January 22, 2025, 05:15:01 PM »

The total lack of concern for human beings in this war has always bothered me. It is never even mentioned. In the above interview of the returned Ukrainian kid, ask his why it bothered him and what was he taught about Russians?

I know what the Kiev faction soldiers have said about Russians including civilians.

There is a recent video with Russian soldiers inspecting a house where the Kiev soldiers had retreated from the area. In the basement were 4 civilians including a grandmother and their dog. All dead. They did not say how they died. They did not take their clothes off to inspect. The Kiev soldiers often regard people who stay behind as traitors.

If the MSM did their job they could ask Ze what would be done to civilians if RU withdrew from lands they occupy. Kiev has already said what they would do and provide examples of what they have done. The MSM could ask if it matters what the people want. Let him say no to the later. The MSM could ask about the laws passed by Kiev saying what they would do to people.

The US civil war was bloody but neither side salivated over what they would do to school teachers on the other side when they won. Who does that?

Libertas · « **Reply #2636 on:** January 23, 2025, 08:24:35 AM »

Perhaps you are just too...innocent minded...about what happens in human conflicts.

US Civil War - Look up Andersonville (Camp Sumter), Camp Douglas, Lawrence Massacre, Fort Pillow Slaughter, Centralia Massacre...and there are lots more examples...

Check out the French Revolution Reign of Terror...

WWII is replete with wonton savagery on just about every participant on every side...not just German concentration camps and tortures by Menegele et al...some truly barbaric sh*t...

Russia - The "Red Terror", Pogroms in Ukraine, the White Terror retaliations, Concentration camps and executions from the Tambov farmer uprising,...

WWI - The Armenian Genocide and the use of gasses...

The beheadings conducted routinely by radical jihadists...the Hamas attacks most recently, you aware of what atrocities they committed?

I cannot believe somebody can be naive of the history of man's brutality to man...

Who cares about bad attitudes and words when deeds are so much more horrific?

If words bother you have you heard anything uttered by "main stream" toxic leftists the past several years?

You blow my mind, dude...

patentlymn · « **Reply #2637 on:** January 24, 2025, 09:33:46 AM »

This post got long. In short I linked to the start of a Lavrov section quoting Ukrainians. I have been hearing quotes like this direct from Ukrainians for years. The Kiev faction is crazy and self destructive, The US is happy to use them against Russia.

I know about all those. The toxic leftists are too crazy to concern me.
I understand the motivations for most wars and leaving morality side, most motives make sense.
I was fed a YT video and why Pax Romana lasted so long. They left the local languages, religions, and culture alone.
Another YT feed asked why the areas in the former ottoman empire do not speak Turkish. Same reason plus the ruling class spoke a different form of Turkish.

My point is not that the Kiev faction is evil but stupid and crazy. I have never seen a dumber reason for a war. What has this fake ethnic superiority gotten the Kiev faction?

The Germans wanted land to the east but without the inhabitants unless they were slave labor. The imperial Japanese wanted colonies like the west and raw materials.. Throw in some comfort women. I understand both. Romans? Ottomans? Easy to understand.

The Kiev faction wants to restore a Ukraine that never existed and force a language that is rural, agrarian and incomplete and non standard on the populace. Try to find an advanced medical or science or math book in Ukrainian. Good luck.
Spite and hate do not pay the bills. It is just insane.

Tucker interviews Russian FM Lavrov. At the link he provides a couple anecdotes, from 24:45 to 28:30.
https://youtu.be/BuLKzcwHX_4?t=1488

One is a quote about eradicating all Russian influences to two cities. These were not Ukrainian cities conquered by the Russian empire. There have been ethnic Russians there since when the US became a country. Lenin drew lines on a map in the 1920s and named the SSR Ukraine so now the Kiev faction thinks the whole former SSR belongs to one ethnic group. I have tried hard and cannot find a clear distinction between the ethnic Russians and Ukrainians. It seems more like rural folk vs city folk going back hundreds of years in the eastern ukr. Ukraine is a rural language and Russian is a city language. Both have been moving around and making babies together for that long.

Another is quote that the Russians are a species not humans or some such from Ze.

Mykolaiv was established in 1789 by the Russian Empire under the orders of Prince Grigory Potemkin. It was founded as a shipbuilding center and naval base on the southern Bug River (now the Southern Buh River), playing a crucial role in the development of the Russian Black Sea Fleet.

Kharkiv was established in 1654 as a fortress to defend against invasions. It gradually developed into a major trade and cultural center, eventually becoming one of Ukraine's largest cities and an important industrial and educational hub.

So Kiev thinks they are going to kill or deport all these people from these cities?

Libertas · « **Reply #2638 on:** January 24, 2025, 10:01:14 AM »

Whatever, don't care about all that noise...and I don't have to...because there is no way Vlad will sign a deal where he has to give up those Eastern areas...he may have to yield some gains beyond that, his desire for a larger buffer are likely deal breakers...as are any post-invasion dreams of a truly neutral Ukraine...

There is going to have to be compromises on both sides...or the slaughter continues...

patentlymn · « **Reply #2639 on:** January 24, 2025, 12:25:40 PM »

There is no good reason for this war If you look at the earlier proposals and even the spring 2022 Istanbul agreement (initialed but not signed). Kiev could have hung onto most of everything except Crimea (after 2014) depending on the agreement and year. The terms of allowing people to practice their religion, language and culture were givens to the Romans and Ottomans and supposedly required by the UN and EU rules.

I understand that Kiev is mostly an admin center with some industry. The Donbas is very heavy industry including mining and steel making. Steel workers and miners in the US are pretty tough. There were USSR WWII posters saying "Don't mess with the Donbas!" If the inhabitants were driven off as Kiev wants, who is going to do the work? Would DC residents mine coal and make steel?

You said that the Russians were squatters so I looked up several cities. In the east and south the common answer is that the Russian empire established them hundreds of years ago . amongst small villages. Now Kiev wants them to leave bc they drank some weird cool aid. It is crazy. Western Ukr is a mess but with very old cities.