It's About Liberty: A Conservative Forum
Topics => Science, Technology, & Medicine => Topic started by: patentlymn on August 21, 2024, 03:21:41 PM
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Here are some video links. The first 2 presenters are the best. Since these guys started years ago maybe 50x more videos have jumped on the bandwagon.
He whips through several studies on human populations over time. Obesity and diabetes seem to track seed oils (OM-6) rather than calories sugar, fat, or carbs. US OM-6 went from 2.4 gm/day in 1865 to 11x that 145 years later.
The fact that many such oils are made in large industrial plants does not matter to me. Some presenters mention this.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Ddu7-zTRoBg?feature=share (https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Ddu7-zTRoBg?feature=share)
Dr. Chris Knobbe - 'Are Vegetable Oils the primary driver of Obesity, Diabetes and Chronic Disease?'
https://youtu.be/Q2UnOryQiIY (https://youtu.be/Q2UnOryQiIY)
Nina Teicholz - 'Vegetable Oils: The Unknown Story'
This is where she talks about Crisco at 6 min.
https://youtu.be/Q2UnOryQiIY?t=356 (https://youtu.be/Q2UnOryQiIY?t=356)
This guy mostly focuses on sugar
https://youtu.be/jpNU72dny2s (https://youtu.be/jpNU72dny2s)
Prof. Robert Lustig - 'Sugar, metabolic syndrome, and cancer'
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I worked for an obesity related company for almost 2 years. I read a lot about that stuff then and noticed stuff since them.
"Obesity is contagious" Huh? WTF?
A couple days ago I mentioned this to my brother. He volunteers at a hospital mostly wheeling or being with patients leaving for cars. I mentioned this to him. He said that when there is a very obese patient in the wheel chair the spouse with them is often even fatter.
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Ever been to Wal Mart or Old Country Buffet?
Good Lord! You know the Grim Reaper is nearby!
Anyway...
About sugar...it is my kryptonite...I like cookies, I like sour candies, hard candies...fricken Zotz go down like popcorn...chocolate...I try to limit myself yet I cannot divorce entirely from it...
I am not devoid of a middle, but I am not at Beluga stage yet...I can do better re:sweets, just saying it ain't easy...and I've managed through meal portion control more than anything to keep cholesterol manageable without drugs (which I do not want!) and my weight stable...
I could probably cut back the beer intake too, but the ending of warm weather kinda does that for me naturally...and I shift to Chianti and liquors...there's just something about warm weather, grilling and a cold brew...
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I never ate much sugar. Then I stopped drinking and swapped the liquor store for the ice cream aisle. Also more carbs from other sources.
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I have thus far lost 90lbs on what would be called “ketovore” diet. It’s a ketogenic diet heavy on meat and its associated fats, fish, dairy, eggs, limited green veggies, and low glycemic fruit. I have completely cut out all added sugars, seed oils, grains, and starchy vegetables. I fry with avacado oil, butter, or tallow, and sautee in olive oil. I drink water exclusively. My doctor has taken me off my Statin, my blood pressure meds, my blood thinner, and my reflux meds. I go in next week to the sleep doc to get assessed and schedule a sleep study to see if I can get rid of the CPAP. I’ve been speed walking a lot, climbing stairs, walking on the treadmill. My resting BP is mid one-teens over low/mid 70s.
On January 8th, I started with a standard low-calorie starvation diet upon which I had lost 60lbs years ago, which all came back. On this diet, I lost 32lbs by early March, and then plateaued, even though I was following the diet exactly. I wanted to know why. So I did a deep-dive on YouTube, and discovered ketosis. Ketosis essentially is switching your body’s primary energy source from glucose to lipids (fats). In ketosis, your body burns fat for energy. Rather than listening to “influencers” I gravitated toward doctors, metabolic scientists, endocrinologists, cardiologists, etc. I haven’t kept track, but I would estimate that between listening to lectures by doctors and audio-books by doctors, I’ve consumed upwards of 300 hours on the subject. I became obsessed with knowing the metabolic functions of the body in relation to the macronutrients.
Some takeaways… Obesity is not a disease, it’s a symptom of a disease - the disease being metabolic dysfunction. It’s a hormonal response to abusive consumption of highly processed foods, fructose, seed oils, and the overconsumption of carbohydrates. Insulin is the key. Insulin resistance and its twin, hyperinsulinemia are at the core of all metabolic dysfunction, and the symptoms of what they call “metabolic syndrome” are not limited to obesity. Other symptoms are high blood pressure, atherosclerosis (heart disease) Type-2 Diabetes, Stroke, Some auto-immune diseases, chronic systemic inflammation, sexual dysfunction, mitochondrial dysfunction, and even dementia/Alzheimer’s.
Insulin drives energy into the cells - drives glucose into the fat cells to store energy there in a process called lipogenesis. The human bloodstream can only accommodate about a teaspoon of Glucose. It needs to be burned, or stored. After the body’s energy requirements are met, Insulin knocks on the fat-cell door, and says, “here is energy for you to store. Turn it into fat for later.” The natural, normal process would see insulin spike after carb intake, do its job sending glucose into the energy needs of the body, and then store the excess into the fat cells for later use. Then insulin lowers… But in the standard American diet, before that insulin can go back down to its nominal level, another carb snack is consumed, sending the insulin back up to a level even higher than before. Then another carb meal, and again throughout the day. The average person’s insulin levels never see their baseline. They go to bed in a state of elevated insulin.
Here’s the biggest problem. When you go to the doctor at 25, 35, 45, they’ll measure your Glucose and give you a clean bill of health. They see your glucose levels as normal. But that is because your insulin is doing its job, keeping your bloodstream from being overrun with sugar. BUT, what that Glucose measurement does not tell the doctor is that the amount of insulin that it requires for you to keep the sugars in check is much much larger than it was when you were young. That is because of insulin resistance. Over time, when the fat cells get filled to the bursting point, they begin to down-regulate - basically shut off the insulin receptors. They refuse the signal from the insulin telling to cell to store fat, so the insulin requirements keep going up and up. By the time the doctor detects elevated glucose in the blood, you’ve been in a state of insulin resistance for 10, 20, 30 years. THAT’S when the doctor decides to intervene, but by then, you’re already suffering from metabolic syndrome.
The good news is it can ALL be undone. That’s not to say the permanent damage hasn’t been done, but by eliminating carbs/sugars/seed oils/starches, you can repair your insulin resistance, and eliminate the systemic inflammation that leads to all the chronic diseases we associate with “aging”. Type-2 Diabetes can be reversed. There is tons of information out there.
I would recommend two sources off the top of my head… Dr. Benjamin Bikman, author of “Why We Get Sick.” He’s a cellular biologist who has basically dedicated his career to metabolic science. He has a YouTube series called “Metabolic Classroom” that I have found very worthwhile. Also, Dr. Robert Lustig, author of “Metabolical” has many worthwhile lectures on YouTube. As a clinician, he was a pediatric endocrinologist who launched research into obesity because of a type of obesity children were suffering after cancer treatment. His path led him down a hormonal rabbit hole that led him to discover Leptin resistance as a result of insulin resistance. He is hyper anti-fructose.
A few more takeaways… avoid the center of the grocery store. Shop around the edges… produce, meat, dairy. If it comes in a box or bag with a bar code, be suspicious… “high fructose cord syrup, partially hydrogenated soybean oil, soy lecithin, carrageenan, mono- and diglycerides, carboxymethylcellulose, polysorbate” - just a tiny fraction of the bad things that we should never ever consume.
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Nice post above. I have watched Lustig before. It is almost impossible to starve yourself for years. it is hard to keep on your very healthy diet for long for many people . It is not hard to not eat until noon or 2 or 4. The Two links to the seed oil people I posted Knobbe and the woman Nina are good for the papers they cite. The tribe that lived on mostly sweet potatoes shocked me.
I quit drinking but ended up eating more carbs so that is next.I did not eat many carbs when I drank other than the booze late at night. It is hard to avoid seed oils without just giving up processed foods period.I think that whether you eat low carb or high carb the seed oils are bad for you.
I will post some other obesity stuff as I remember it. Some is strange stuff.
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I have thus far lost 90lbs on what would be called “ketovore” diet. It’s a ketogenic diet heavy on meat and its associated fats, fish, dairy, eggs, limited green veggies, and low glycemic fruit. I have completely cut out all added sugars, seed oils, grains, and starchy vegetables. I fry with avacado oil, butter, or tallow, and sautee in olive oil. I drink water exclusively. My doctor has taken me off my Statin, my blood pressure meds, my blood thinner, and my reflux meds. I go in next week to the sleep doc to get assessed and schedule a sleep study to see if I can get rid of the CPAP. I’ve been speed walking a lot, climbing stairs, walking on the treadmill. My resting BP is mid one-teens over low/mid 70s.
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A few more takeaways… avoid the center of the grocery store. Shop around the edges… produce, meat, dairy. If it comes in a box or bag with a bar code, be suspicious… “high fructose cord syrup, partially hydrogenated soybean oil, soy lecithin, carrageenan, mono- and diglycerides, carboxymethylcellulose, polysorbate” - just a tiny fraction of the bad things that we should never ever consume.
Another good book from years past is 2010 Why we get fat—and what to do about it
Gary Taubes. . A little dated but good and cheap used.
A short less accurate version of modern theory is that blood glucose is low either because you ate few carbs OR you ate lots but your insulin ramped up to take it down. If you do not eat breakfast your insulin never ramps up until you eat.
Decades ago A GF went on a "grapefruit and egg" diet aka the Mayo diet (not accurate).You can still find it on line. It was very low carb high protein low fat diet. It put you into ketotsis. I went on it with her and had my one and only kidney stone. A warning sign for men is like having your scrotum squeezed to make you feel nauseous.
I tried the Atkins diet years ago and got very constipated. Something to watch out for so have bulk or maybe miralax&metamucil if needed. Maybe something to watch out for on any low fiber diet. I still eat Aldi pitted prunes every day just in case.
"Eating makes you hungry" If you eat breakfast then your insulin spikes (especially if eating carbs) then blood sugar crashes hours later and you feel hungry. If you skip breakfast you may get hunger pangs but not as bad as if you had eaten breakfast. Plus the hunger pangs go away.
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He whips through several studies on human populations over time. Obesity and diabetes seem to track seed oils (OM-6) rather than calories sugar, fat, or carbs. US OM-6 went from 2.4 gm/day in 1865 to 11x that 145 years later.
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Let me give you a bit of advice derived from my own personal experience: it's best not to glom onto the latest "health food " fad that comes down the pike.
When in high school ('67-'71), like most kids my age I had acne--not bad but even one pimple was enough to make the most self-conscience teenager even more self-conscience.
At that time, it was the eating of sweets that was thought to cause acne.
SO,
after learning that carbs broke down into simple sugars when mixed with the saliva in your mouth, not only did I cut out the sweets, but I also cut out the carbs.
Lo and behold, even though I wasn't the least bit overweight, I lost weight considerably. Even my girlfriend at the time remarked at how loosely my clothes were on me.
Fast forward a few years and here comes the Dr. Atkins diet, which stipulated that you eat protein foods only and forsake all sweets and carbs. At that particular time, the bad food "boogeyman," was eggs, not ''seed oils" (the latter is ridiculous on its face).
Dr. Atkins had a chapter in his book entitled, In Defense of the Egg. No defense needed for me--I ate a 3 egg omelet this very morning.
As wise King Solomon said, "there is nothing new under the sun," so when all the rave was about the "Keto" diet, I saw it was nothing more than Atkins' diet redux. Same with the "eat like a carnivore" diet.
You're perfectly free to glom onto the latest "food craze" or "food boogeymen," but having witnessed so many during my short stay on this earth, only to see them shot down or forgotten about, I would suggest you step back, take a deep breath, and just bide your time until all is either disputed or forgotten about, until the next "food craze" or "boogeyman food" comes along and experiences the same fate. Just sayin'.
And just to prove the point, what happened to the high fructose corn syrup "food boogeyman," pray tell? Knowing you, I'm sure you glomed onto that one as well.
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The minimum daily requirement for carbohydrates is literally zero. Veggies and fruit provide carbs - and dairy to a certain extent - but even those carbohydrates are not necessary. The nutrients, fiber, and antioxidants in the veggies and fruit are good, but the carbs in them are not necessary. Any glucose your body might need by avoiding simple carbohydrates will be manufactured in the liver via gluconeogenesis. You don’t need to consume any carbs for carbs sake. And as far as switching your body from sugar-burning to fat-burning, There is clinical evidence from Dr.. Benjamin Bikman that given the choice, the brain actually prefers to fuel on ketones rather than glucose by a ratio of 6-1. Preliminary studies show an improvement in cognitive functions in people with dementia when they are put into ketosis.
I’ve been avoiding all grain, sugar, seed oils, and starches since early March, and have suffered no ill effect, and 100% upside. I’ve learned that it’s not because I’ve lost 90 lbs (although that DOES have some exclusive health benefits), but rather because I’ve fixed my metabolism, fixed my insulin resistance, fixed my leptin resistance, and thereby reduced or eliminated my systemic inflammation. You may recall I had a TIA stroke about 2.5 years ago. My body is so “fixed” that my doctor has taken me off all meds.
The really miraculous thing to me is that I eat to complete satiety every single day. I am NEVER hungry, unless my body perceives a need for nutrition. When you are in a sugar-burning cycle, your leptin (satiety hormone) is masked by hyperinsulinemia, and your dopamine receptors in your brain get addicted to the glucose. Rather than your body getting its satiety signal from your leptin and your hunger signal from your ghrelin (hunger hormone) your dopamine receptors are constantly signaling that you need another hit of glucose. And your dopamine receptors eventually down-regulate, just as if you were on drugs or alcohol - you need more sugar to satisfy the craving. Thus your body NEVER takes its signals for when to eat and when to stop eating from your leptin and ghrelin, and ALWAYS tells you that you need glucose as soon as the prior hit of glucose has been metabolized.
Avoiding all simple carbs takes the dopamine hit out of the picture, and your leptin and ghrelin are finally allowed to work as they’re supposed to. I NEVER say “I’m starving”, and I used to say it all the time. This realization and understanding has been a miracle for me.
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I find your data fascinating IDP. I suspect I am probably a glucose junky, I've been "getting by" with moderating intake and resisting the sweets as much as I can...but I am probably losing on other metrics.
What does a typical daily food menu/schedule look like for you? Does portion size matter? Curious what the routine looks like.
ETA - Also, is there any cultural angle to what you are doing? I suspect most of the world has glucose issues to one extent or another...not sure there is one culture that is healthy in its meals that stands out.
Also...
Talking all glucose right? Not just simple sugar, there is also sucrose, lactose...
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I find your data fascinating IDP. I suspect I am probably a glucose junky, I've been "getting by" with moderating intake and resisting the sweets as much as I can...but I am probably losing on other metrics.
What does a typical daily food menu/schedule look like for you? Does portion size matter? Curious what the routine looks like.
ETA - Also, is there any cultural angle to what you are doing? I suspect most of the world has glucose issues to one extent or another...not sure there is one culture that is healthy in its meals that stands out.
Also...
Talking all glucose right? Not just simple sugar, there is also sucrose, lactose...
A typical day would be a New York strip for breakfast, full fat cottage cheese with fresh blueberries, Pistachios, and a few pieces of celery for lunch, And grilled salmon with a side of asparagus for supper. The next day might be three eggs for breakfast along with a couple pieces of bacon, A couple hamburger patties and kimchi for lunch, and a couple pieces of cauliflower crust pizza with garlic Pesto sauce instead of tomato sauce for supper. When It comes to meat and fat As well as vegetables, portion control is largely irrelevant. In fact, you want to make sure you are getting enough meat and fat, both saturated and mono unsaturated. You want to avoid the poly unsaturated – the seed/vegetable oils. I will also pick a day or two a week to narrow my eating window in a day, otherwise known as intermittent fasting or time restricted eating. A couple days a week I will skip breakfast have my first meal of the day at 1 o’clock, then eat again at 6 o’clock, and then not eat again until breakfast the next day. This gives your body extra time to be without insulin in the blood, which helps overcome insulin resistance. When it comes to nuts, fruit, dairy, etc. portion control does matter because those foods contain some level of carbohydrates. You want to completely avoid fruit juice because it is a concentrated fructose bomb. Your metabolism does not differentiate between the fructose in juice and fructose in Coca-Cola. It is metabolized exactly the same, which is bad. Fruit should always be eaten whole with its associated fiber and antioxidants. And choose low glycemic fruit like berries, and avoid the high fructose bombs like tropical fruits.
As far as sugar types, Sucrose (table sugar) is one molecule of glucose and one molecule of fructose. Metabolically, those two molecules are separated before they are metabolized. Both are metabolized differently; glucose through the normal pathways that provide energy to the cells, and fructose entirely in the liver, which is really horsesh*t for your body. Fructose is mitochondrial poison. It causes fatty liver, mitochondrial dysfunction, and carbohydrate addiction. Too much glucose is bad for all of the above mentioned reasons in my first post of the thread. The key is controlling insulin. Our bodies are simply not designed to eat carbohydrates 6 to 10 times per day, which is basically the standard American diet.
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Also, the demonization of saturated fat and the canonization of “whole grains“ while simultaneously giving sugar a pass, is perhaps the largest medical fraud scandal in the history of western civilization. Saturated fat does NOT cause heart disease, UNLESS We are suffering from metabolic syndrome and its associated systemic inflammation. The cholesterol you eat is not the cholesterol that winds up in your blood. That is 100% CREATED By the liver, one of the primary drivers of lipids in the blood is sugar. Inflammation oxidizes, LDL particles, damaging them, making them smaller and more dense. These small, damaged LDL Particles are able to penetrate the endothelium (inner lining of the arteries) causing atherosclerosis. In the absence of systemic, inflammation, the LDL particles remain “fluffy” and buoyant, And these LDL particles will not penetrate the endothelial cells. So do not fear saturated fat in the long term. Get your metabolic house in order, and saturated fat becomes an energy source and not a threat to your health.
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I find your data fascinating IDP. I suspect I am probably a glucose junky, I've been "getting by" with moderating intake and resisting the sweets as much as I can...but I am probably losing on other metrics.
What does a typical daily food menu/schedule look like for you? Does portion size matter? Curious what the routine looks like.
ETA - Also, is there any cultural angle to what you are doing? I suspect most of the world has glucose issues to one extent or another...not sure there is one culture that is healthy in its meals that stands out.
Also...
Talking all glucose right? Not just simple sugar, there is also sucrose, lactose...
A typical day would be a New York strip for breakfast, full fat cottage cheese with fresh blueberries, Pistachios, and a few pieces of celery for lunch, And grilled salmon with a side of asparagus for supper. The next day might be three eggs for breakfast along with a couple pieces of bacon, A couple hamburger patties and kimchi for lunch, and a couple pieces of cauliflower crust pizza with garlic Pesto sauce instead of tomato sauce for supper. When It comes to meat and fat As well as vegetables, portion control is largely irrelevant. In fact, you want to make sure you are getting enough meat and fat, both saturated and mono unsaturated. You want to avoid the poly unsaturated – the seed/vegetable oils. I will also pick a day or two a week to narrow my eating window in a day, otherwise known as intermittent fasting or time restricted eating. A couple days a week I will skip breakfast have my first meal of the day at 1 o’clock, then eat again at 6 o’clock, and then not eat again until breakfast the next day. This gives your body extra time to be without insulin in the blood, which helps overcome insulin resistance. When it comes to nuts, fruit, dairy, etc. portion control does matter because those foods contain some level of carbohydrates. You want to completely avoid fruit juice because it is a concentrated fructose bomb. Your metabolism does not differentiate between the fructose in juice and fructose in Coca-Cola. It is metabolized exactly the same, which is bad. Fruit should always be eaten whole with its associated fiber and antioxidants. And choose low glycemic fruit like berries, and avoid the high fructose bombs like tropical fruits.
As far as sugar types, Sucrose (table sugar) is one molecule of glucose and one molecule of fructose. Metabolically, those two molecules are separated before they are metabolized. Both are metabolized differently; glucose through the normal pathways that provide energy to the cells, and fructose entirely in the liver, which is really horsesh*t for your body. Fructose is mitochondrial poison. It causes fatty liver, mitochondrial dysfunction, and carbohydrate addiction. Too much glucose is bad for all of the above mentioned reasons in my first post of the thread. The key is controlling insulin. Our bodies are simply not designed to eat carbohydrates 6 to 10 times per day, which is basically the standard American diet.
Awesome, thanks. That gives me a picture I can digest. I will have to talk to my brother in law, always been a big boy but some of this sounds like things he is doing, I will have to follow up with him. He's dropped like 60 pounds.
I am not interested in weight loss per se, not opposed to trimming my middle, I think the import takeaway is a health metabolism first and foremost.
I will have to look into this more and read up on your Doc's writings you mentioned.
::thumbsup::
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Also, the demonization of saturated fat and the canonization of “whole grains“ while simultaneously giving sugar a pass, is perhaps the largest medical fraud scandal in the history of western civilization. Saturated fat does NOT cause heart disease, UNLESS We are suffering from metabolic syndrome and its associated systemic inflammation. The cholesterol you eat is not the cholesterol that winds up in your blood. That is 100% CREATED By the liver, one of the primary drivers of lipids in the blood is sugar. Inflammation oxidizes, LDL particles, damaging them, making them smaller and more dense. These small, damaged LDL Particles are able to penetrate the endothelium (inner lining of the arteries) causing atherosclerosis. In the absence of systemic, inflammation, the LDL particles remain “fluffy” and buoyant, And these LDL particles will not penetrate the endothelial cells. So do not fear saturated fat in the long term. Get your metabolic house in order, and saturated fat becomes an energy source and not a threat to your health.
Good point. I never bought into to saturated fat hate nor glommed onto the joy of whole grains...and exposure to the latter likely coming through other avenues in processed foods.
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Yup. Metabolism is key. Fix that, and you fix all of the symptoms that we currently assign their own special “Disease“. Atherosclerosis, Stroke risk, hypertension, Obesity, type 2 diabetes, sexual dysfunction, sleep apnea, and even dementia. All of these can be fixed, simply by fixing the metabolism, and controlling insulin is the primary lever you can pull to make that happen. Also, some other obvious things like exercise, avoiding smoking, reducing stress… there are more factors in play besides hyperinsulinemia, but that is the easiest and most effective lever to pull.
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I had read and kinda forgotten much of the lipid stuff you, IDP, mentioned. The fructose metabolism is still in my mind.
The calorie content of food is measures by burning it in a closed vessel surrounded by water and taking the temperature increase. HFCS is mostly the same as corn syrup or table sugar when measured this way but the human body does not work like that. HFCS mostly just has more fructose and as you said it is processed in the liver.
IMO the seed oil harm is through a different mechanism than sugar or carbs. I read and forgot some theories. maybe mitochondria related.
Seed oils did not come into significant use before around 1900 so maybe the human body did not evolve to process them. Olive oil was consumed but not sure about the quantities.
One example of the seed oil use is cottonseed oil. I recall it was not used much. The industrial need for lubricants exceed the supply from whales. So it was extracted. Then used in soaps. After people figured out how to make it shelf stable they figured out they could sell it as food. Proctor and Gamble sold it in Crisco as a "modern" lard replacement. Later another seed oil replaced it.
Just because cotton seed oil was not much consumed by humans until 1900 does not mean it is bad. Just because you can sell it to humans as food does not mean it is good to eat.
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The minimum daily requirement for carbohydrates is literally zero. Veggies and fruit provide carbs - and dairy to a certain extent - but even those carbohydrates are not necessary. ...
Try telling that to the long (and healthy) lived Adventists in Loma Linda, CA, whose diet is made up of mostly carbs. Or any Adventists anywhere who follow the Adventist health message religiously (pun intended).
Adventists contend that God was the original plant-based diet advocate — He wanted people to eat things that dropped out of trees and sprouted from the Earth.
https://www.businessinsider.com/loma-linda-blue-zone-longevity-secrets-of-seventh-day-adventists-2023-11?op=1 (https://www.businessinsider.com/loma-linda-blue-zone-longevity-secrets-of-seventh-day-adventists-2023-11?op=1)
If you eat only proteins and fats to the exclusion of carbs and sweets, you will lose weight--something I discovered quite by accident while still a teenager and well before Atkins or Keto.
And this was confirmed by scientific studies done at the height of Adkins' popularity.
BUT,
what those studies also revealed was that the practitioners of the diet were developing all the symptoms associated with such a diet (arterial plaque, higher BP, et al.).
The conclusion was that while it may be OK temporarily for weight loss, it is certainly no substitute for a healthy, well balanced diet.
Continue to follow at your own risk.
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I had read and kinda forgotten much of the lipid stuff you, IDP, mentioned. The fructose metabolism is still in my mind.
The calorie content of food is measures by burning it in a closed vessel surrounded by water and taking the temperature increase. HFCS is mostly the same as corn syrup or table sugar when measured this way but the human body does not work like that. HFCS mostly just has more fructose and as you said it is processed in the liver.
IMO the seed oil harm is through a different mechanism than sugar or carbs. I read and forgot some theories. maybe mitochondria related.
Seed oils did not come into significant use before around 1900 so maybe the human body did not evolve to process them. Olive oil was consumed but not sure about the quantities.
One example of the seed oil use is cottonseed oil. I recall it was not used much. The industrial need for lubricants exceed the supply from whales. So it was extracted. Then used in soaps. After people figured out how to make it shelf stable they figured out they could sell it as food. Proctor and Gamble sold it in Crisco as a "modern" lard replacement. Later another seed oil replaced it.
Just because cotton seed oil was not much consumed by humans until 1900 does not mean it is bad. Just because you can sell it to humans as food does not mean it is good to eat.
The danger in seed oils is that it creates oxidative stress, resulting in systemic inflammation, which again, is a contributor to insulin resistance. The lineolic acid (Omega 6) is WAY out of whack with the proper ratio in relation to Omega 3s. We should have a predominance of Omega 3, and a diet heavy in seed oils turns that ratio upside down and inside out. Plus, it’s a HIGHLY processed food. Seeds contain a tiny amount of oil. The extraction process requires heavy chemicals and processing. Important to note that olive oil is not a seed oil, it is a mono-unsaturated fruit oil. It is among the most healthy of fats, HOWEVER, since it has a relative low smoke point (320°) it will begin to turn into a trans fat if heated beyond that point. It’s best for dressings, dips, and lower temp quick sauteeing. Avocado oil is the workhorse for me. Also a mono-unsaturated fruit oil, its smoke point is 500°. It is a great oil for all frying, and its flavor is neutral, unlike olive oil.
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Many of my thoughts on obesity could be filed under "the human body is more complex than people know."
Bariatric bypass surgery removes part of the small intestine. If the part near the duodenum is removed it often reversed type 2 diabetes much faster than could be explained by weight loss.
IMO walking is much better for you than can be explained by any calorie chart showing how many calories are burned.
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One thing I found surprising that seems to be pretty much universally agreed upon among the people who are considered contemporary experts is that a great deal of the science involving metabolism, metabolic endocrinology, and biochemistry in regards to the bodies processing of the macro nutrients Has changed dramatically in the last 5 to 10 years. Dr. knowledge gets “Stuck“ in whatever time they went through medical school, UNLESS they proactively avail themselves of the latest science via continuing education. When it comes to diet and nutrition; lipid health; metabolism, etc., most physicians do not go in that direction with continuing education. They stay with the medical dogma that they are familiar with. Many people who have done their own research as I have are in the position of having to educate their physician. Fortunately, my doctor is a young fella, and while his initial responses to my poor health was all of the standard recommendations, once I demonstrated to him that I had new knowledge and was committed to change, he acknowledged that he was aware of everything I was telling him about what I had discovered, and he is fully on board and supportive. But lots of doctors will freak out when you tell them, for instance, that you are not focused on your LDL cholesterol number, but rather your triglyceride/HDL ratio as a bio marker for lipid health. My doctor did not, For which I am very thankful.
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"blah blah obesity blah circadian rhythms blah blah melatonin blah blah blah"
10 years later I spent a long weekend in the hospital. It seemed like 3rd shift nurses were often whales.
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One thing I found surprising that seems to be pretty much universally agreed upon among the people who are considered contemporary experts is that a great deal of the science involving metabolism, metabolic endocrinology, and biochemistry in regards to the bodies processing of the macro nutrients Has changed dramatically in the last 5 to 10 years. ...
I heard that medical schools still do not teach nutrition or teach it wrong.
Some researcher found the med school (Harvard?) instructions from 1900 in some archives for diabetes.Apparently diabetes was managed with careful attention to diet? The person said that making insulin available destroyed metabolism science.
Also, Germany used to be the center for food and metabolism knowledge and science. It was common knowledge (an old wives tale) that bread makes you fat. Then the center switched to US where the so called science said fat makes you fat. Only calories matter.
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Interestingly, while calories do matter, they only matter in regard to how the body metabolizes the particular macronutrient. As an example, imagine a daily consumption of 3000 calories in beef, avocado oil, broccoli, butter, and cheese. Now imagine that same day, but replace the food with thirteen 16 oz bottles of Mountain Dew. Roughly the same caloric content. But VASTLY different biochemical process in the metabolism. The former would result in weight loss if sustained over time. The latter would result in increasingly obesity over the same period of time.
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235 to 150, here. Low carbs showed immediate results. I never went full ketosis because it didn't feel right for me to give up vegetables and fruit, but I went to the lowest carb versions of such. Oranges instead of bananas. Spinach instead of corn, things like that. So never under 20 grams per day but certainly under 50. And yes, no juice. I stalled out at 200 doing that and eventually just learned to eat less.
Anything by Gary Taubes is good reading.
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235 to 150, here. Low carbs showed immediate results. I never went full ketosis because it didn't feel right for me to give up vegetables and fruit, but I went to the lowest carb versions of such. Oranges instead of bananas. Spinach instead of corn, things like that. So never under 20 grams per day but certainly under 50. And yes, no juice. I stalled out at 200 doing that and eventually just learned to eat less.
Anything by Gary Taubes is good reading.
I began at 272. Definitely the heaviest I’d ever been. Now 182. Feel 20 years younger.
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Can't say I feel younger. I felt younger giving up the cigarettes. Now I can sleep without a recliner and never get heart burn, let alone full on acid reflux which I also got.
I managed to hike myself up here at 215 pounds.
https://www.google.com/maps/@25.1707874,121.5534421,3a,75y,210.16h,86.36t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipPSFU2zb24jw2WMNwXXZrfUP-4t7U_yZh3Y484!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipPSFU2zb24jw2WMNwXXZrfUP-4t7U_yZh3Y484%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi-0-ya296.2801-ro0-fo100!7i6656!8i3328?coh=205409&entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI0MDgyMS4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D (https://www.google.com/maps/@25.1707874,121.5534421,3a,75y,210.16h,86.36t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipPSFU2zb24jw2WMNwXXZrfUP-4t7U_yZh3Y484!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipPSFU2zb24jw2WMNwXXZrfUP-4t7U_yZh3Y484%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi-0-ya296.2801-ro0-fo100!7i6656!8i3328?coh=205409&entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI0MDgyMS4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D)
My diet was better than it ever was. My bloodwork came back great, but I was eating a crap ton of rice while in Taiwan and knowing what I know now, that was the big no no.
My success at preparing spaghetti squash as a substitute for pasta and rice was mixed, at best. That is incredibly hard to prepare, right. But today I see Sam's selling cauliflower rice and if I were doing this today, that would look to be a good option as well as cauliflower pizza crust.
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Not worth watching but this will get some publicity. He talks some about seed oils. Just because something can be made from certain plants does not mean it is good or bad for you.
https://www.reddit.com/r/StopEatingSeedOils/comments/1f0ibkm/kennedy_breaks_down_effects_of_processed_foods/ (https://www.reddit.com/r/StopEatingSeedOils/comments/1f0ibkm/kennedy_breaks_down_effects_of_processed_foods/)
Kennedy breaks down effects of processed foods
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There is something called Brown Adipose Tissue (BAT). It burns calories at a high rate compared to other tissues. Scientists knew that in humans this tissues goes away when kids get older as such baby fat goes away.
One day someone had a scan, maybe a PET scan. It was corrupted and looked weird. There was a protocol room temperature for the scan but it was done at a much lower room temperature. Turns out the cold temps had activated the BAT which was burning calories. Turns out people can have BAT mostly near their neck, collarbones, and upper shoulders?
There was a theory that central heating made people fat. I saw some proposed method for weight loss involving messing with body temp sensors maybe at your wrists and/or neck?
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I'm still exploring this and think I will have a hybrid plan, it might not be a full ketosis effort...we'll see...the weight loss isn't the primary goal, detoxifying and helping my metabolism is, I've levelled off at 235 for about 20+ years now largely through portion control and my bloodwork has always been in-range FWIW, if I lose a little weight, swell I'll take it, but at almost 6'2" I don't think I need to lose a big number, never did agree with the anorexia-pushing BMI numbers of the so-called "experts"...if I get to 200 or a bit less would be fine with me...
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There is something called Brown Adipose Tissue (BAT). It burns calories at a high rate compared to other tissues. Scientists knew that in humans this tissues goes away when kids get older as such baby fat goes away.
One day someone had a scan, maybe a PET scan. It was corrupted and looked weird. There was a protocol room temperature for the scan but it was done at a much lower room temperature. Turns out the cold temps had activated the BAT which was burning calories. Turns out people can have BAT mostly near their neck, collarbones, and upper shoulders?
There was a theory that central heating made people fat. I saw some proposed method for weight loss involving messing with body temp sensors maybe at your wrists and/or neck?
Sounds like an asshole with an agenda more in-line with the WEF/Globalist Cabal! ::mooning::
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There is something called Brown Adipose Tissue (BAT). It burns calories at a high rate compared to other tissues. Scientists knew that in humans this tissues goes away when kids get older as such baby fat goes away.
One day someone had a scan, maybe a PET scan. It was corrupted and looked weird. There was a protocol room temperature for the scan but it was done at a much lower room temperature. Turns out the cold temps had activated the BAT which was burning calories. Turns out people can have BAT mostly near their neck, collarbones, and upper shoulders?
There was a theory that central heating made people fat. I saw some proposed method for weight loss involving messing with body temp sensors maybe at your wrists and/or neck?
Sounds like an asshole with an agenda more in-line with the WEF/Globalist Cabal! ::mooning::
It was an older theory.
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::facepalm:: or an older a$$hole
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Human body is stranger than most believe.
I learned of several devices to treat female incontinence. One worked by stimulating the little toe as i recall. In some women nerves run close together such that stimulating the little toe closes the sphincter around the ureter.
After me, an old GF was married and wanted to have children but her hormones were off. She was treated by an endocrinologist but nothing worked. She had accumulated lots of medical knowledge much due to helping her father who lived to an old age but after 2-3 dozen operations. She guided him through these.
Finally she went to a Chinese herbalist. She was not some new age flake. She did what he said for months When she returned to the endocrinologist her hormones were perfect. She had 3 kids..
I had heard that "sitting is worse than smoking." I had worked in mostly sedentary jobs including software writing. I recall only 1 morbidly obese person. I much later did some document review on site. It was almost like being chained to your chair in terms of being tracked for your work. Several morbidly obese people in the room who had been doing this a long time. I gained a few pounds every month I did this.
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I'm still exploring this and think I will have a hybrid plan, it might not be a full ketosis effort...we'll see...the weight loss isn't the primary goal, detoxifying and helping my metabolism is, I've levelled off at 235 for about 20+ years now largely through portion control and my bloodwork has always been in-range FWIW, if I lose a little weight, swell I'll take it, but at almost 6'2" I don't think I need to lose a big number, never did agree with the anorexia-pushing BMI numbers of the so-called "experts"...if I get to 200 or a bit less would be fine with me...
From what I believe about this stuff.
'1. See if you can hold off eating until noon or maybe later. It is doable without huge effort.
2. Try to reduce processed foods mostly for general health to reduce seed oils. I still eat them.I should not. Pizzas. Frozen beef bean burritos.
3. Saturated fats are good for you. Poly unsaturated fatty acids (PUFA) are bad for you. Olive oil is OK. Fat kills hunger for a long time.
4. Walk every day not to burn calories but because walking is magic.
5. Stuff yourself with green vegetables. Lots of butter helps.
7. Reduce carbs to the extent you can.
8. If you can, take the time make your own salad dressings with healthier oils.
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There is something called Brown Adipose Tissue (BAT). It burns calories at a high rate compared to other tissues. Scientists knew that in humans this tissues goes away when kids get older as such baby fat goes away.
One day someone had a scan, maybe a PET scan. It was corrupted and looked weird. There was a protocol room temperature for the scan but it was done at a much lower room temperature. Turns out the cold temps had activated the BAT which was burning calories. Turns out people can have BAT mostly near their neck, collarbones, and upper shoulders?
There was a theory that central heating made people fat. I saw some proposed method for weight loss involving messing with body temp sensors maybe at your wrists and/or neck?
The rage right now, particularly among athletes and fitness gurus, is the ice bath plunge. Specifically for that reason. The reason brown adipose tissue is brown is because it is densely packed with mitochondria as compared to regular white adipose tissue that has far less mitochondria. Supposedly cold stimulates mitochondria to begin metabolizing at an astounding rate, and the most effective way to control that cold is with immersion in water. I’ve seen videos of people doing it, and it looks like absolute hell! But to a person, people who do it report an incredible burst of clear mindedness, sustain energy and cognitive function, and improved athletic performance.
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There is something called Brown Adipose Tissue (BAT). It burns calories at a high rate compared to other tissues. Scientists knew that in humans this tissues goes away when kids get older as such baby fat goes away.
One day someone had a scan, maybe a PET scan. It was corrupted and looked weird. There was a protocol room temperature for the scan but it was done at a much lower room temperature. Turns out the cold temps had activated the BAT which was burning calories. Turns out people can have BAT mostly near their neck, collarbones, and upper shoulders?
There was a theory that central heating made people fat. I saw some proposed method for weight loss involving messing with body temp sensors maybe at your wrists and/or neck?
The rage right now, particularly among athletes and fitness gurus, is the ice bath plunge. Specifically for that reason. The reason brown adipose tissue is brown is because it is densely packed with mitochondria as compared to regular white adipose tissue that has far less mitochondria. Supposedly cold stimulates mitochondria to begin metabolizing at an astounding rate, and the most effective way to control that cold is with immersion in water. I’ve seen videos of people doing it, and it looks like absolute hell! But to a person, people who do it report an incredible burst of clear mindedness, sustain energy and cognitive function, and improved athletic performance.
Wow. I had not thought of BAT for 10 years. I did not know it was a thing.
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I'm still exploring this and think I will have a hybrid plan, it might not be a full ketosis effort...we'll see...the weight loss isn't the primary goal, detoxifying and helping my metabolism is, I've levelled off at 235 for about 20+ years now largely through portion control and my bloodwork has always been in-range FWIW, if I lose a little weight, swell I'll take it, but at almost 6'2" I don't think I need to lose a big number, never did agree with the anorexia-pushing BMI numbers of the so-called "experts"...if I get to 200 or a bit less would be fine with me...
From what I believe about this stuff.
'1. See if you can hold off eating until noon or maybe later. It is doable without huge effort.
2. Try to reduce processed foods mostly for general health to reduce seed oils. I still eat them.I should not. Pizzas. Frozen beef bean burritos.
3. Saturated fats are good for you. Poly unsaturated fatty acids (PUFA) are bad for you. Olive oil is OK. Fat kills hunger for a long time.
4. Walk every day not to burn calories but because walking is magic.
5. Stuff yourself with green vegetables. Lots of butter helps.
7. Reduce carbs to the extent you can.
8. If you can, take the time make your own salad dressings with healthier oils.
I can do most of that. The big battle will be avoiding the insidious presence of sugar in just about every damned thing. And, like I said it may be more of a hybrid thing with me...I have to have a decent pizza once in a while, I have to have pasta once in a while...they will have to be special treats.
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There is something called Brown Adipose Tissue (BAT). It burns calories at a high rate compared to other tissues. Scientists knew that in humans this tissues goes away when kids get older as such baby fat goes away.
One day someone had a scan, maybe a PET scan. It was corrupted and looked weird. There was a protocol room temperature for the scan but it was done at a much lower room temperature. Turns out the cold temps had activated the BAT which was burning calories. Turns out people can have BAT mostly near their neck, collarbones, and upper shoulders?
There was a theory that central heating made people fat. I saw some proposed method for weight loss involving messing with body temp sensors maybe at your wrists and/or neck?
The rage right now, particularly among athletes and fitness gurus, is the ice bath plunge. Specifically for that reason. The reason brown adipose tissue is brown is because it is densely packed with mitochondria as compared to regular white adipose tissue that has far less mitochondria. Supposedly cold stimulates mitochondria to begin metabolizing at an astounding rate, and the most effective way to control that cold is with immersion in water. I’ve seen videos of people doing it, and it looks like absolute hell! But to a person, people who do it report an incredible burst of clear mindedness, sustain energy and cognitive function, and improved athletic performance.
Wow. I had not thought of BAT for 10 years. I did not know it was a thing.
And no condemnation of central air. ;D
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I have no idea how pizza ingredients and pasta sauce ingredients vary. Aldi has some healthy foods.
I perspire a lot so a fan on me cools me and I like the noise and feeling.
I have no used AC in MN yet this summer. I do not suffer.
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I found an old topic also on seed oils.
http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,18398.0.html (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,18398.0.html)
I don't go nuts over this seed oil thing but it does seem to track modern ailments better than other dietary trends.
I treated myself to a lemon meringue pie from the freezer section. From Marie Callender. I can see them using soybean oil in the crust instead of lard but this seems like too much. I ate the whole thing over time.
The label says water, sugar, enriched wheat flour, soybean oil and hydrogenated soybean oil, .... So soybean oil at 3rd or 4th place depending on how you count water.
Less than 2 pct egg whites. 32 g sugar per 1/8 pie.
https://www.reddit.com/r/StopEatingSeedOils/comments/1f25ww7/heres_the_butter_theyre_pouring_on_the_theater/ (https://www.reddit.com/r/StopEatingSeedOils/comments/1f25ww7/heres_the_butter_theyre_pouring_on_the_theater/)
The popcorn topping from a theater. No butter.
Soybean oil, then hydrogenated soybean oil.
https://i.redd.it/mqgc7r3v74ld1.jpeg (https://i.redd.it/mqgc7r3v74ld1.jpeg)
(https://i.redd.it/mqgc7r3v74ld1.jpeg)
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GWdWgT3XsAAvYB-?format=jpg&name=small)
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So? These two things are not the same. Anyone who would buy oatmeal with "fruit, nuts, whatever, et al., added," is a fool to begin with--a bunch of overpriced crap. If that is your desire, just buy regular rolled oats, NOT Quaker-a high priced rip-off, and add whatever turns your crank. For me, it's raisins and butter, maybe a little cream, sweetened with honey if I have some, otherwise, white sugar (EGADS, NOT WHITE SUGAR).
INGREDIENTS: WHOLE ROLLED OATS
That's all.
A few years ago, my brother, a life long health food junkie, was into "steel cut" oats--a popular "health food" trend at the time. I asked him to explain the health advantage of steel cut oats over regular rolled oats. He couldn't and I doubt anyone can--just another gimmick from the so-called health food gurus of the day.
And don't anyone here try explaining the difference--oats is oats no matter how processed.
As Samuel Johnson once said, “Oats. A grain, which in England is generally given to horses, but in Scotland supports the people.”
Apropos that he should say that since he was a well fed arrogant horse's ass.
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Good Memories, my primary school years were in the 50's, breakfast was oatmeal, and not soupy oatmeal. Add butter, a little extra salt (as I remember, s small amount of salt was added to the boiling water) and Sugar. lol. Did that through most of High School too. I remember my first meal in the Navy was at the chow hall at Camp Barry(sp), Sept 5, 1965. They rushed us through, I grabbed a Cup of black coffee, and a bowl of Oatmeal.
Oh! I remember, we did not get Quaker Oats, Dad used to buy a bag, brown paper, several pounds worth. (had six kids to feed, lol)
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Oat based cereal (oatmeal, granola) is the only cereal I can eat for breakfast and keep going till lunch. Any high sugar content grain cereal and I'm kaput by 10 o'clock.
I really like granola and always have, but since it's gotten so expensive, I make my own.
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(https://media.gab.com/cdn-cgi/image/width=568,quality=100,fit=scale-down/system/media_attachments/files/165/743/457/original/c1a26d35fc987b3b.png)H/T-WRSA@GAB
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I eat seed oils and crappy foods. I just ate a frozen pizza. Still I am trying to eat better.
I came across a couple links.
In short, some guy did an experiment with a low carb high fat diet. People on the vegetable oil version felt sick. People on the sat animal fat or even olive oil versions felt fine.
https://www.reddit.com/r/StopEatingSeedOils/comments/1fiaz84/dr_steve_phinney_tried_a_ketogenic_diet_of_seed/ (https://www.reddit.com/r/StopEatingSeedOils/comments/1fiaz84/dr_steve_phinney_tried_a_ketogenic_diet_of_seed/)
(https://preview.redd.it/dr-steve-phinney-tried-a-ketogenic-diet-of-seed-oils-versus-v0-gc0dzfujk7pd1.png?auto=webp&s=dfd83a8192a59f9aec5123130d42d5e164719068)
Here is a chart showing the fats. From left to right. Poly unsaturated Fatty acids (seed oils) , mono unsat fatty acids (olive oil), sat fatty acids (coconut or animal fats).
(https://preview.redd.it/dr-steve-phinney-tried-a-ketogenic-diet-of-seed-oils-versus-v0-ghmsqidvl7pd1.png?width=320&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=8aceacbd7235c7d9ef2e6754b5a1a16601e5f2f2)
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In short, the guy doing the study above fed himself soybean or corn oil via a feeding tube and felt sick. He did this stuff to put him on a ketogenic diet (very low carbs). He replaced these with olive oil and had no problems.
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I've heard the phrase like crap through a goose...but that dude is sick!
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Summarizes some human and animal studies.DHA, LA, brain size, IQ
US FDA recommends 5-10x the amount of LA than in 1865 when heart attacks were very rare. Infant formula has lots of LA.
LA is stored in the body. People on ancestral diets have 3.8 percent. Now around 20 percent.
Stupid animls have more DHA. Stupid animals have more LA.
https://youtu.be/Kb-VNW_WaVU
The $212 Billion Dollar Food ingredient poisoning your Brain
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Well, hopefully I am accruing positives with my new diet...after 3 weeks I already dropped 20 pounds, haven't weighed myself since that point, give it another couple weeks...dealing with my cravings better than I thought...especially sweets...only thing I have that is sweet is probably yogurt...
So far so good...
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Well, hopefully I am accruing positives with my new diet...after 3 weeks I already dropped 20 pounds, haven't weighed myself since that point, give it another couple weeks...dealing with my cravings better than I thought...especially sweets...only thing I have that is sweet is probably yogurt...
So far so good...
If it is OK to ask what kind of diet?
Some diets like Atkins cause major water weight loss in the beginning.
Also keep an eye on constipation. Things like metamucil and miralax can help. But so can lots of foods like cabbage I think.
Decades ago I went on a low carb high protein, little fat diet with a GF. It made me lose weight but earned me a kidney stone.
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You want to lose weight simple. Walk. I was 180, 1% body fat in my body building days. Then the diagnosis of type ll. Went off the hi carbs and started walking twice a day on the treadmill. Now at 140. Pretty much eat what I want.
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I knew an AF pilot who was borderline diabetic long ago. Then he crossed the line into diabetic. He needed some meds. If he took these meds it treated his diabetes but the AF grounded pilots taking this med. It would have ruined his career. He got himself a high end treadmill and hit it hard. It made his diabetes go away and he got to fly again until he retired.
I only walk 1 1/2 miles per day with dog. IMO even such minor walking is very good for your body way beyond what the calories charts say.
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I do it so I can keep drinking beer ::cool::
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Beer has carbs. Spirits are carb free. ::thumbsup::
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Yeah, it's cooling off so transitioning from low-carb beer (Mich Ultra, ugh...) will be nice...hello single-batch/single-barrel bourbon, rum, and single-malt scotch!
Diet is kinda like IDP's, he's probably better at it...protein - meat, diary (no LA), low carbs, no sugar (this one is hard!) and cutting out processed foods (also not easy, it is nefariously ubiquitous!) and mixing in some veggies and fruit...
So for no constipation issues...just seem unsatisfied after meals...guess I hammered down all the toxic crap for too long to know, right?
As for exercise I get plenty doing outdoor chores that seem like they never end...
With winter that reduced to only plowing/shovelling days...but do plenty of walking (mostly tracking critters!)...
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BTW I am not certain that seed oils are bad for you but I have a huge question mark. I used to get a free subscription to food engineering magazine. It was paid for by ads. The ads made a little queasy.
Cheese analogs. Different spice analogs. Our merangue analog maintains head space twice as long as our competitors. Was it even food?
Once on a start up I saw a coconut cream pie by Hostess in a vending machine late at night. i used to eat the apple and cherry pies. I bought it . I read the label and there was nothing about coconut. I tossed it. I have eaten 10,000 things as bad in the years since.
A grandma used to make a lemon merangue pie using butter if she made it at all. Now it is soybean oil.
If humans did not eat the PUFA much until 100 years ago is the human body supposed to eat this stuff? Heart disease seems to track PUFA use more than anything else.
Videos by Nina Teicholz and Knobbe seem to be the best ones. Primitive people eating almost all carbs or almost all meat/dairy did not have heart disease. Olive oil and coconut seem OK.
I just read the Kraft mac and cheese label, with the cheese powder. Seems OK.
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My nephew uses this app...
https://yuka.io/en/
Just apply common sense to results...not everything will hurt you or right away or without habitual use...
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Interesting. I read that this app does not track seed oils but others may. I wonder how it tracks sat fats.
My gut reaction is that sat fats are fine. Some tribes have lived on lots of sat fats. Eskimos? Some in south pacific lived on almost all carbs from sweet potatoes plus coconuts. No heart disease.
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Interesting. I read that this app does not track seed oils but others may. I wonder how it tracks sat fats.
My gut reaction is that sat fats are fine. Some tribes have lived on lots of sat fats. Eskimos? Some in south pacific lived on almost all carbs from sweet potatoes plus coconuts. No heart disease.
Some tribes (in Borneo) used to ritually eat the brains of their dead and keel over with CJD...no mention of heart disease though...
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In some opinions these re the worst. Canola, Corn, Cottonseed, Soy, Sunflower, Safflower, Grapeseed, and Rice bran.
I dug a little and was told that people in modern day Russia and Ukraine ate sunflower seeds and maybe oils. It is all dose dependent anyway. I wonder if this happened only after industrialization.
To produce one ounce of sunflower oil, you typically need about 2 to 3 ounces of sunflower seeds.
Humans have been producing sunflower oil since the early 19th century. Sunflowers were first cultivated for oil extraction in Russia in the 1830s, and the oil gained popularity in Europe and North America over the following decades. By the late 1800s, it became a widely used cooking oil.
from chatgpt
Here's a brief timeline for when these oils began being produced:
Canola Oil: Developed from rapeseed in Canada in the 1970s, canola oil gained popularity in the 1980s.
Corn Oil: Extracted from corn germ, it became commercially available in the early 1900s, with increasing popularity in the mid-20th century.
Cottonseed Oil: This oil has been produced since the mid-19th century, becoming more common after the Civil War in the United States.
Soybean Oil: Commercial production began in the early 1900s, with significant growth in the 1920s and beyond as soybeans became a staple crop.
Sunflower Oil: As mentioned earlier, it began to be produced in the 1830s in Russia.
Safflower Oil: Production started in the early 20th century, with increased cultivation in the 1960s.
Grapeseed Oil: While grape seeds were historically discarded during winemaking, commercial extraction began in the late 20th century.
Rice Bran Oil: This oil has been used in Asian cooking for centuries, but it gained wider recognition and commercial production in the mid-20th century.
These oils reflect the agricultural practices and technological advancements of their respective times!
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Correlation is not causation but ....
(https://preview.redd.it/anyone-got-that-graph-of-obesity-rates-overlayed-on-v0-7rrg9kbpksud1.png?width=914&format=png&auto=webp&s=6e98cf8a09d4c0e7fb4bd1861fa034d1777757e3)
(https://preview.redd.it/anyone-got-that-graph-of-obesity-rates-overlayed-on-v0-rx520h7ocsud1.jpeg?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e6b3742bea721a4a21760581bd91bd8bb5470ba4)
(https://preview.redd.it/anyone-got-that-graph-of-obesity-rates-overlayed-on-v0-74oogetj5sud1.png?width=1080&format=png&auto=webp&s=edcacb43e658630886f1deb953038720cadb786f)
(https://preview.redd.it/anyone-got-that-graph-of-obesity-rates-overlayed-on-v0-y1yc2i0l5sud1.png?width=1080&format=png&auto=webp&s=f358897ba13059bcc38e46f3da7379ba50b7dc9d)
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Who benefits from BigAg farms, other than BigAg itself?
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I recall TV news was sponsored by Pfizer and Lockheed Martin. No one is going base those buying decisions on such advertising. It is to control the news.
Time for Cargill to sponsor the news?
This seed oil thing makes me wonder. Those graphs or plots alone give me pause.
Some of those lemon pie fillings are made with palm oil (not palm kernel oil) while others are soybean oil. I think palm oil is recent but OK.
Palm oil has been in substantial use for centuries. It originated in West Africa, where it was utilized for cooking and traditional medicine. The commercial cultivation of oil palm (Elaeis guineensis) began in the 19th century, particularly in the 1840s, when it was introduced to Southeast Asia, primarily Malaysia and Indonesia. Since then, palm oil production has rapidly increased, becoming a significant global commodity, especially in the late 20th century and into the 21st century. Today, it's widely used in food products, cosmetics, and industrial applications.
Palm oil is primarily composed of triglycerides, which are esters formed from glycerol and fatty acids. The chemical makeup of palm oil consists of the following fatty acids:
Saturated Fatty Acids (about 50%):
Palmitic acid (C16:0) - approximately 40%
Stearic acid (C18:0) - about 4-5%
Unsaturated Fatty Acids (about 50%):
Oleic acid (C18:1, monounsaturated) - around 40%
Linoleic acid (C18:2, polyunsaturated) - about 10%
Minor Components:
Tocopherols (vitamin E)
Carotenoids (provitamin A)
Phytosterols
The exact composition can vary based on factors such as the variety of oil palm, growing conditions, and processing methods. Overall, palm oil is notable for its high level of saturated fats compared to many other vegetable oils, which contributes to its stability and shelf life.
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(https://media.gab.com/cdn-cgi/image/width=568,quality=100,fit=scale-down/system/media_attachments/files/167/744/809/original/cc1decc649c68f48.jpeg)H/T-WRSA@GAB
Always been skeptical of Pharma and never like taken anything if I can avoid it...but ever since the Branch Covidian BS I cast a skeptical eye on everything medical related.
Drugs should not be the default answer!
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I recall US ozempic prices are around 8 times those in EU countries.
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Big Pharma needs revenue...and Americans are rich selfish pigs demanding a fix-it-pill and thus ripe for shaking down...
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Sharyl Attkisson's "Follow The Science" arrives tomorrow.(My 59th anniversary gift)(I got her a mini chain saw) If it's like the rest of her books and reporting it should be a great read.
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I recall the FDA food pyramid under LBJ was politically determined.
There is a funny episode of The Good Wife "Whine and Cheese" where two lobbying groups fight over the next food pyramid or some such.
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The ‘Cocktail Therapy’ That Repairs Mitochondria
Chen has developed a comprehensive “cocktail therapy” approach to restore and enhance mitochondrial function. This protocol includes five key components.
1. Optimizing Energy Sources
Start with a low-carb ketogenic diet, with no more than 30 grams (1 ounce) of carbohydrates per day. Switching the fuel supply to mitochondria from glucose to ketones can lower blood sugar and keep it stable. This can also allow the mitochondria function to return to normal gradually, allowing the pancreas, liver, and immune system to return to a healthy state. This is a remedy for the mitochondria that were damaged due to previous long-term high sugar (carbohydrate) diet, staying up late, and other factors.
If the mitochondria of the pancreas and liver are damaged due to these factors, insulin resistance or reduced glucose tolerance will occur and may even lead to diabetes, Chen said. Once we switch from glucose to ketones, we break free from the limitations of glucose metabolism. Mitochondria, now unburdened, can efficiently use ketones for energy. This revitalizes organs like the pancreas and liver, restoring their proper functions.
2. Nutrient Supplementation
The next step is to use certain nutrients to repair and renew the mitochondria. This includes supplementing the mitochondria with the primary important antioxidant, glutathione.
Since this nutrient cannot be taken directly because it will be destroyed by gastric acid, we can take some of its precursors, including N-acetyl cysteine (NAC) and glycine, as supplements. They will synthesize an appropriate amount of glutathione, which will neutralize the free radicals produced by the mitochondria and help them repair themselves, slowly leaving the mitochondria to become healthy again.
3. Grounding and Environmental Factors
Another approach involves restoring mitochondrial membrane potential through grounding, either by direct earth contact or exposure to the Schumann Resonances. This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth can help normalize cell membrane potential, preserving up to 20 percent of mitochondrial production capacity.
Mitochondria typically expend 20 percent of their energy each night restoring normal cell membrane potential. External grounding and pulsed electromagnetic field therapy (PEMF), a noninvasive treatment that uses electromagnetic fields to promote healing and improve various health conditions, can reduce this energy burden on the mitochondria.
This approach, Chen suggests, could not only reverse disease but also help achieve optimal health and vitality.
4. Quality Sleep
Chen emphasized that “mitochondrial cocktail therapy” also needs to go with exercise and good rest.
Equally important is to avoid damage to mitochondria from environmental pollution, food additives, pesticides, and other toxins.
He specifically mentioned that we must maintain a quality sleep routine and ensure an adequate amount of deep sleep every night. Although this may sound like common sense, most people don’t do it.
5. ‘Zone 2’ Exercise
Chen strongly recommends “Zone 2” exercise, which focuses on low-heart rate training. This type of exercise uses aerobic respiration but does not produce lactic acid, so it won’t make you feel tired.
Examples of Zone 2 exercises include ultra-slow jogging, brisk walking, or leisurely biking. You should be able to talk during these activities, but you'll notice that you’re breathing a bit harder. This level of exercise helps improve mitochondrial efficiency, gradually repairing organs.
In contrast, more intense endurance training can increase the number of mitochondria, boosting their overall production capacity.
According to Chen, any form of exercise benefits mitochondrial health, whether it improves efficiency, increases the number of mitochondria, or both. However, Zone 2 exercise is more manageable for most people. It’s less likely to cause injuries and can be done indoors or outdoors, making it a more accessible option.
https://www.zerohedge.com/medical/mitochondrial-imbalance-linked-90-percent-chronic-diseases (https://www.zerohedge.com/medical/mitochondrial-imbalance-linked-90-percent-chronic-diseases)
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Interesting stuff.
I cook in a crock pot some times. Mine does not have a removable part. My son recommended I use an oven bag.
I may try those.
I My preferred meat is often baked chicken thighs or legs. Sometimes pork roast. If the seed oils are a real thing I became aware that the omega 6 oils are higher in chicken and pork than in ruminant animals like cows. However some say that cows fed feed with soy beans and corn (not grass fed) are also higher in omega 6. Who knows......
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I recall a 4:1 ratio is best
from chatGPT
The omega-6 to omega-3 fatty acid ratio in meats can vary depending on factors such as the animal's diet, farming practices, and specific cuts of meat. However, here is a general idea of the omega-6 to omega-3 ratios for the common meats you've asked about:
1. Chicken (conventional)
Omega-6 to Omega-3 ratio: About 15:1 to 20:1
Explanation: Conventional chicken, raised on a grain-based diet, tends to have a high omega-6 content and relatively low omega-3 levels. This ratio can be reduced somewhat if the chicken is pasture-raised or fed a diet rich in omega-3s (e.g., flaxseed or algae), but conventional chicken is still much higher in omega-6 fatty acids.
2. Turkey (conventional)
Omega-6 to Omega-3 ratio: About 10:1 to 15:1
Explanation: Like chicken, conventional turkey raised on grain-based feed tends to have a high omega-6 to omega-3 ratio. The ratio can be improved with pasture-raised or omega-3-enriched diets.
3. Pork
Omega-6 to Omega-3 ratio: About 10:1 to 15:1
Explanation: Conventional pork, particularly from factory-farmed pigs, also has a high omega-6 to omega-3 ratio. The ratio may be improved in pigs raised on a pasture-based or omega-3-enhanced diet, though it still remains higher in omega-6s compared to other meats.
4. Beef (grain-fed)
Omega-6 to Omega-3 ratio: About 5:1 to 10:1
Explanation: Grain-fed beef typically has a higher omega-6 to omega-3 ratio compared to grass-fed beef. The ratio can vary depending on the animal's diet, but grain-fed beef still tends to have more omega-6s compared to omega-3s.
Grass-fed Beef (or pasture-raised animals in general)
Omega-6 to Omega-3 ratio: About 2:1 to 3:1
Explanation: Grass-fed beef and other pasture-raised meats have a much lower omega-6 to omega-3 ratio because the animals are eating a more natural diet rich in omega-3s from grass. This results in a better balance of omega-3 fatty acids in the meat.
Summary:
Conventional meats (chicken, turkey, pork, and grain-fed beef) tend to have high omega-6 to omega-3 ratios (typically 10:1 to 20:1).
Pasture-raised or grass-fed meats tend to have lower omega-6 to omega-3 ratios (about 2:1 to 5:1), which is a healthier balance for reducing inflammation and supporting heart health.
If you're looking to optimize omega-3 intake, focusing on grass-fed beef, pasture-raised poultry, or incorporating fish (especially fatty fish like salmon, mackerel, or sardines) would be a good choice.
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I recall the FDA food pyramid under LBJ was politically determined.
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I don't recall there being a so-called "food pyramid" at that time. Forget what format good eating practices with the 7 main food groups were "displayed"(by the USDA) at the time, but I know for certain it was not in pyramid form:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_pyramid_(nutrition)
As for politics involved in the pyramid's development:
In April 1991, the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) halted publication of its Eating Right Pyramid, due to objections raised by meat and dairy lobbying groups concerning the guide’s display of their products.
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This incident was only one of many in which the food industry attempted to alter federal dietary recommendations in their own economic self-interest.
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Several researchers have said that food and agricultural associations exert undue political power on the USDA.
From what I've been reading in this thread, meat and dairy are the good guys now, so maybe they were right to challenge the USDA's depiction of them on the pyramid.
If you want to get an idea about what the USDA recommends for daily intake for each of the food groups, do like I did many years ago and extrapolate from the numbers listed for each on the Nutrition Facts label on whatever product.
E.g., I solved for fat based on the % of daily fat intake one serving of sausage represented, then extrapolated out to total daily fat intake(as a % of overall daily food/caloric intake) as recommended by the USDA, represented by that one serving percentage.
As best as I remember, it worked out to near 30%, much to my surprise. May have changed since then so if I get the chance, I may do it again just to see.
(Those who are math challenged may need assistance for this ::laughonfloor:: J/K)
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You are correct about the pyramid not coming until long after LBJ. I remember some politics during LBJ also.
I recently came across another detail. There are high oleic acid varieties of some seed oils. They have more mono unsaturated fatty acids and fewer poly unsaturated fatty acids.
High oleic acid varieties of seed oils—such as high oleic sunflower oil, high oleic safflower oil, and high oleic canola oil—are specially bred to contain higher amounts of oleic acid, a monounsaturated fatty acid (MUFA). These oils have several key advantages, especially in terms of health, stability, and culinary applications:
1. Improved Heart Health
Monounsaturated Fatty Acids (MUFAs): Oleic acid is a type of MUFA, which has been shown to improve heart health by:
Reducing bad LDL cholesterol while increasing good HDL cholesterol levels.
Decreasing inflammation in the body, which is linked to heart disease.
Lowering the risk of stroke and potentially improving arterial health.
Omega-9 Fatty Acids: Oleic acid is an omega-9 fatty acid, which has been associated with a variety of positive health outcomes, including improved insulin sensitivity and lower rates of metabolic syndrome.
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Summary of Omega-6 to Omega-3 Ratios:
High Oleic Canola Oil: ~ 2:1 to 3:1 (better balance of omega-6 to omega-3)
High Oleic Safflower Oil: ~ 10:1 to 15:1 (still higher in omega-6, but better than conventional safflower oil)
High Oleic Sunflower Oil: ~ 10:1 to 20:1 (higher omega-6, but improved compared to regular sunflower oil)
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Canola oil has the best omega-6 to omega-3 ratio among these three high oleic oils, making it the most favorable option for improving the balance of fats in the diet.
To optimize omega-3 intake, it's still ideal to include foods rich in omega-3s like fatty fish, flaxseed, and chia seeds, as even high oleic oils don't provide significant amounts of omega-3s.
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The ‘Cocktail Therapy’ That Repairs Mitochondria
Chen has developed a comprehensive “cocktail therapy” approach to restore and enhance mitochondrial function. This protocol includes five key components.
...
3. Grounding and Environmental Factors
Another approach involves restoring mitochondrial membrane potential through grounding, either by direct earth contact or exposure to the Schumann Resonances. This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth can help normalize cell membrane potential, preserving up to 20 percent of mitochondrial production capacity.
...
That's all I need to read to determine this guy is a quack.
" ...This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth..."
What about man-made EMF's given off by every damn electrical device we surround ourselves with 24/7, including our cellphones ? Why no mention of them, whether good or bad?
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The ‘Cocktail Therapy’ That Repairs Mitochondria
Chen has developed a comprehensive “cocktail therapy” approach to restore and enhance mitochondrial function. This protocol includes five key components.
...
3. Grounding and Environmental Factors
Another approach involves restoring mitochondrial membrane potential through grounding, either by direct earth contact or exposure to the Schumann Resonances. This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth can help normalize cell membrane potential, preserving up to 20 percent of mitochondrial production capacity.
...
That's all I need to read to determine this guy is a quack.
" ...This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth..."
What about man-made EMF's given off by every damn electrical device we surround ourselves with 24/7, including our cellphones ? Why no mention of them, whether good or bad?
That's where the tinfoil hat comes in...
::foilhathelicopter::
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My wife sleeps on a grounded sheet and has a grounded pillow case- i had to run the ground. She's 83, I'm 80 and sleep by myself.
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My wife sleeps on a grounded sheet and has a grounded pillow case- i had to run the ground. She's 83, I'm 80 and sleep by myself.
If you don't mind my asking, how is it possible to ground non-electrically conductive material?
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The ‘Cocktail Therapy’ That Repairs Mitochondria
Chen has developed a comprehensive “cocktail therapy” approach to restore and enhance mitochondrial function. This protocol includes five key components.
...
3. Grounding and Environmental Factors
Another approach involves restoring mitochondrial membrane potential through grounding, either by direct earth contact or exposure to the Schumann Resonances. This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth can help normalize cell membrane potential, preserving up to 20 percent of mitochondrial production capacity.
...
That's all I need to read to determine this guy is a quack.
" ...This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth..."
What about man-made EMF's given off by every damn electrical device we surround ourselves with 24/7, including our cellphones ? Why no mention of them, whether good or bad?
That's where the tinfoil hat comes in...
::foilhathelicopter::
lol
A grounded one I hope.
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My wife sleeps on a grounded sheet and has a grounded pillow case- i had to run the ground. She's 83, I'm 80 and sleep by myself.
If you don't mind my asking, how is it possible to ground non-electrically conductive material?
The sheet & pillow case have embedded conductive material and that's extended to the house ground via a cable. Lightning strike she's cooked.
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I walked the dog and got my 'Schumann resonance ' waves. I take off my tin foil hat to get the best results.
3. Grounding and Environmental Factors
Another approach involves restoring mitochondrial membrane potential through grounding, either by direct earth contact or exposure to the Schumann Resonances. This natural electromagnetic frequency from Earth can help normalize cell membrane potential, preserving up to 20 percent of mitochondrial production capacity.
Schumann Resonances.
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What causes Schumann resonances?
Lightning Strikes: The primary source of Schumann resonances is lightning. When lightning strikes, it produces a broad range of electromagnetic waves, including those in the ELF spectrum. These waves propagate around the Earth, bouncing between the surface and the ionosphere, where they are trapped in a standing wave pattern.
The Earth-Ionosphere Cavity: The Earth’s surface is conductive, and the ionosphere (a layer of charged particles in the atmosphere) is also conductive. The space between them acts as a resonant cavity that supports electromagnetic waves at certain frequencies.
Key Features of Schumann Resonances
Fundamental Frequency: The lowest, or fundamental frequency of Schumann resonances is about 7.83 Hz. This is the most well-known and is often referred to as the "heartbeat" of the Earth.
Harmonics: The Schumann resonances also have harmonics at higher frequencies, such as 14.3 Hz, 20.8 Hz, 27.3 Hz, and so on. These correspond to the first, second, third, and higher harmonics of the fundamental frequency.
Importance of Schumann Resonances
Earth's Electromagnetic Environment: They provide a natural electromagnetic "background noise" that researchers can study to understand the dynamics of the Earth’s electromagnetic field, the ionosphere, and global lightning activity.
Climate and Weather Patterns: Some studies have suggested that Schumann resonances might offer insights into global weather patterns or even climate changes, although this is still an area of active research.
Global Monitoring: Because they are influenced by lightning strikes worldwide, monitoring Schumann resonances is a way to track global lightning activity in real time. This can help meteorologists and scientists in climate studies.
Natural Oscillations: The frequencies of the Schumann resonances are close to the alpha waves of human brain activity (between 7-12 Hz). This has led to some speculative connections between Schumann resonances and the well-being of life on Earth, though these ideas remain largely speculative.
Summary
Schumann resonances are the natural electromagnetic resonances of the Earth-atmosphere system, primarily driven by lightning activity. They occur in the ELF range, with the fundamental frequency around 7.83 Hz. These resonances are important for understanding the Earth’s electromagnetic environment, and they may also have connections to weather patterns and possibly even human biology, though the latter is not conclusively established.
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I'm outside all the time, especially during storms...I must be totally Schumannated...
Though, winter, less lightning...bummer...
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Lightening also produces ozone (O3):
...causes ozone to damage mucous and respiratory tissues in animals, and also tissues in plants, above concentrations of about 0.1 ppm. While this makes ozone a potent respiratory hazard and pollutant near ground level, a higher concentration in the ozone layer (from two to eight ppm) is beneficial, preventing damaging UV light from reaching the Earth's surface.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ozone
Sounds like a supercharged free radical, speaking of which, what ever happened to the free radical theory of aging and carcinogen via cell damage? How far back does that theory, with it's own dietary guidelines, go, i.e., how many other healthy dietary theories have followed? And which one should we be following now--the latest? Probably so, but only until it is superseded by another, supposedly more "scientifically researched" theory, I reckon. ::facepalm::
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the latest
::hysterical::
One always has to go to the source of funding to gain insight into the motivation behind claims either anecdotal or empirical, it's just the latter require sorting through a sh*t-ton of data to find the "ahh ha!" item to prove it out. And sheeple never look beyond the so-called "expert" label...
SSDD...until it isn't ;)
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This guy cites some studies which say seed oils are OK, unless you overheat them especially repeatedly.
https://youtu.be/XJ_uyV-ER_g
Are Seed Oils Toxic and Inflammatory?
This says Russians have good insulin resistance thanks to eating Kasha. Also pickled vegetables.
https://youtu.be/d2CM_KD8Gf4
The #1 Food Russians Eat to Have Such Low Insulin Resistance
Well, I am Russian, and the most traditional ???? (kasha, i.e., "porridge") is made of either buckwheat or semolina, as well as pearl barley, millet/groats and a few other grains. Buckwheat is a seed, not a grain, hence its higher nutritional and organoleptic (taste) value compared to grains.
... As to buckwheat, we cook it in a huge variety of ways, with meats and vegetables, as well as some sweeter versions with dairy and sugar (mostly for kids). You can alao make pancakes and crepes with it, it is really good. But to me, the tastiest way to eat it to cook it as if cooking Asian rice, then adding a bit of butter and salt.
Just make sure you get the roasted kind found at Polish deli's (brown in colour) not the raw sh*t they sell at health food stores.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GdBqPX2WEAALMZD?format=jpg&name=small)
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Not saying it isn't increasing...but the current BMI is full of sh*t...by their metric unless everybody looks concentration camp style malnourished....they're overweight...
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I swung by white castle. Sliders and onion chips. I do not want to know what I just ate. Yummy.
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A guilty pleasure now and then shouldn't be a big deal...
Says the guy struggling through the Thanksgiving to New Years gauntlet of yumminess...