It's About Liberty: A Conservative Forum
Topics => TEOTWAWKI => Topic started by: Pandora on November 08, 2012, 11:18:28 AM
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Gunsmith is talking Texas.
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Gunsmith is talking Texas.
My daughter and son-in-law are talking the same thing.
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Gunsmith is talking Texas.
My daughter and son-in-law are talking the same thing.
I have no argument against it (besides the hot and the scorpions/black widows ;) ). I read an article the other day about the "new" Southern Coast as a business-booming proposition. Taken with a grain of salt -- there were no cons in the piece -- it appears they're doing in LA, GA, FLA and TX what's been prohibited on the East and West coasts. There are steel mills, there's a newly thriving port (I forgot which state), oil drilling, frac(k)ing; growth is happening and wealth is being created. Depending on where in TX one goes -- NOT Austin -- one is free to exercise one's liberties without being afraid of the gummint, because the State government looks ready to stand up to DC.
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I'm staying put.
Too old to uproot and start over.
Besides, the part of Pa I'm in is red and Pittsburgh is 50 miles away.
And we have alllll those deer hunters with their guns
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I'm staying put.
Too old to uproot and start over.
Besides, the part of Pa I'm in is red and Pittsburgh is 50 miles away.
And we have alllll those deer hunters with their guns
Sounds like y'all on that farm in The Walking Dead...happy hunting! ::thumbsup::
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These people believe anything they do is right because they are such "good" people.
My daughter and I had a long discussion last night. We know so many people judge things on a niceness standard. It's not nice to not recycle your cans. It's not nice to tell someone who they can "love". It's not nice to expect others to work as hard as you. ETC.
Then we discussed other places to live.
Hmm
When we bought this house I really imagined we'd stay here for good. We have an acre, we're hard to find yet close to stores, etc. BUT we live in an area with a high cost of living and high taxes. It doesn't make sense to keep paying in. Unless it all collapses and where we are will then be ideal.
I've made it clear to my children --none have their own families yet--that if we move we should do it together. It makes more sense to me for our survival and success to stick together. One has said no to Texas. I want to see if there are any indicators that pop up in the days coming that may be clues to the best place for our family.
So for now my husband keeps working. I said I was buying less. I should say less on things to have and more on things that will work for us and assist our survival.
And I spend time searching real estate sites in various states to get a feel for what we might want to seek out.
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Personally I would rather move somewhere colder. The harsh winter has always been a superb selective force on the development of populations. I see winter as still having the capacity to deter the looter class, particularly when Leviathan's social infrastructure crumbles.
I hope the civil war begins sooner rather than later. My fear, as also mentioned in Pandora's earlier post, is that if we have too much time go by, the younger generation will literally have known things no other way.
Hey, it's plenty cold here in the winter, the Zoos (especially Minneapolis) draws a lot of looters, our rich welfare bene's are a big hit. But yeah, once that dies, the feral critters will be spreading out, looting and killing for whatever they can get. The crackstacks will be the first to fall...
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But for now I want nothing to do with politics on the internet
I could never quit the internet
As screwy as this sounds, I've got to find some innocuous use for the internet, and that's not gonna be easy, believe you me.
Thanks, John. The good thing is if I need to communicate with someone, there's always PMs for now, until web sites like this are shut down. At this point, what's beyond conspiracy theory into reality? They still have that guy from the stupid anti-muslim film (responsible for Benghazi) in jail. No one says a word in support of his or anyone's free speech. Then emails will be monitored and UN taxed, with the full weight and support of the Owebama Administration. We will lose the ability to communicate with each other, no matter how hard we'll try. Unless one has something like a ham set, one's communicative ability is at the mercy of a totalitarian government.
Libertas: Thanks for the open invite. But it's not a question of sanity, it's more deep than that (not to sound trite or idiotic). This is against everything the nuns beat into me. I'm lost here so I might as well be lost someplace else. As I said, my health is a bad thing. But the good thing is that now I will quite willingly and quickly leave behind just about everything if I figure out what to do, because staying here sure ain't the answer. I'm figuring to move while the moving's good because rental prices in the mid and southeast red states are about to have an economic boom (read: steep increases). U-Haul and Ryder will both be doing a bang up business. Expect checkpoints once the migration is noticed.
Pan: Yep. Texas or someplace wide enough open to breathe free. For now.
"The last best hope for Humanity." Hah! What rubbish. And saying that stings.
I'm staying put.
Too old to uproot and start over.
Besides, the part of Pa I'm in is red and Pittsburgh is 50 miles away.
And we have alllll those deer hunters with their guns
AP, believe me, I'm old now, too, older than my years thanks to my heart, but I'm not uprooting anything. I will be running frantically toward something yet to be determined.
And quite honestly, I don't think 50 miles is enough of a cushion with urban centers. The locusts can spread far and wide very fast. And they won't be coming at you from one direction, but rather a Frankenstorm of Tyranny swirling all around you, rolling in in waves from every direction. If you're a producer, at some point soon, they will bar you from leaving. They need your living carcass to feed their lifestyle, and they will have their lifestyle fed.
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Personally I would rather move somewhere colder. The harsh winter has always been a superb selective force on the development of populations. I see winter as still having the capacity to deter the looter class, particularly when Leviathan's social infrastructure crumbles.
I hope the civil war begins sooner rather than later. My fear, as also mentioned in Pandora's earlier post, is that if we have too much time go by, the younger generation will literally have known things no other way.
Yep, I second the harsh environment thing. Typically the outcasts of a society take to the highlands. As the new farm regs, child labor regs and fuel prices force food production down, that crisis will be used to confiscate the good farmland for a cronie global conglomerate. Of course, maybe they will give you a job! Point is, good, fertile farmland is likely to not stay in your possession long, likewise a warm climate allows the homeless and thieve to survive without shelter, plus its a have for all sorts of insect and disease. Population densities arealso typically higher.
Surviving where Survival is an acquired skill is protection against those without that skill.
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Gunsmith is talking Texas.
My daughter and son-in-law are talking the same thing.
Interestingly, our close friends (our only friends, actually) were just today talking about Texas, too. Gunsmith's been looking on the web at properties w/wo houses.
Ahhh, the thought of packing up *again* -- and after twenty years of accumulation; less than many, I might add -- is exhausting, really. And I have my "procurement" sites and routine down pat here. But ..... nothing that can't be reworked elsewhere.
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I know some talked about moving to a cold state. Let me just say even though we can be butt freezing cold here in Minnesocold. I would not move here!
We just elected a democratic house and senate to go along with a major loony lefty governor. We are now a deep blue state. I am screwed!
I live in the heart of St. Paul and we have no, none, zip, zero, nada elected republicans in office in this socialist city and the @#$*% residents of St. Paul just voted on raising taxes again for the St. Paul Schools. My property taxes are absurd even though the housing market is stagnant the powers to be thought I did not pay enough taxes and the #$%^%@*$ hit me hard.
I am very seriously thinking of moving to South Dakota. I can not bring myself to move to badgerland.....
(http://www.gopherpucklive.com/forum/images/smilies/Goldy_Kills_Bucky2.gif)
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Come on down to Tennessee. If not for memphis, we are probably the reddest ( in more ways than 1) state there is. Plus, we have guns and ammo Lots of it. And country music. ::beertoast::
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Come on down to Tennessee. If not for memphis, we are probably the reddest ( in more ways than 1) state there is. Plus, we have guns and ammo Lots of it. And country music. ::beertoast::
What's your State government look like in terms of Party and the likelihood they'll tell the Feds to go scratch?
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Come on down to Tennessee. If not for memphis, we are probably the reddest ( in more ways than 1) state there is. Plus, we have guns and ammo Lots of it. And country music. ::beertoast::
What's your State government look like in terms of Party and the likelihood they'll tell the Feds to go scratch?
Republicans hold a super majority. 22-11 in the state. Libs can only win elections in Nashville ( davidson county). Forget memphis. It's considered the fifth wheel here. Nice to have a state 120 miles wide and 700 miles long. Easy to isolate.
Plus, my property taxes on a 250K home is 1440.00 year. No state income tax.
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Come on down to Tennessee. If not for memphis, we are probably the reddest ( in more ways than 1) state there is. Plus, we have guns and ammo Lots of it. And country music. ::beertoast::
What's your State government look like in terms of Party and the likelihood they'll tell the Feds to go scratch?
We are looking at various options too. But I have done so much work here in Colorado, and I really don't want to pack up and leave it behind. I chose to bug-out here and I really don't want to be more than a tank of gas from the bug out location. Rural counties are still Conservative and the further out you are the less they are likely to mess with you - even if you live in a deep blue state . Colorado is hardly deep blue. Its just a target rich environment, and since they voted in MaryJane the reaction times of the targets is going to be down. Speaking of a business where you can sell to leftist morons and make money.... Yeah, Pot is destructive but for the most part it only destroys the moron using it... in general pot smokers are mellow, slow and stupid.
If TX or somewhere actually leaves the Union, then maybe its worth the move. But until that happens, I am not sure its worth the effort. TX has the same problem that all the western states do - California Immigrants coming in and voting blue. God damn locusts. Every urban center in the country is polluted. Even Wyoming has Jackson Hole.
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The conservative states of the west are Californicated. The conservative states of the south are Yankeefied. You simply cannot escape the parasites.
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Come on down to Tennessee. If not for memphis, we are probably the reddest ( in more ways than 1) state there is. Plus, we have guns and ammo Lots of it. And country music. ::beertoast::
What's your State government look like in terms of Party and the likelihood they'll tell the Feds to go scratch?
Republicans hold a super majority. 22-11 in the state. Libs can only win elections in Nashville ( davidson county). Forget memphis. It's considered the fifth wheel here. Nice to have a state 120 miles wide and 700 miles long. Easy to isolate.
Plus, my property taxes on a 250K home is 1440.00 year. No state income tax.
And from what I understand, the Left in TN keeps trying to get an income tax, with a narrower margin against every year. What's the sales tax and on what? Picking your brain here; hope you don't mind.
The conservative states of the west are Californicated. The conservative states of the south are Yankeefied. You simply cannot escape the parasites.
I know, it's happening here in NC as well, with the added bonus of too many Repubs who are RINOs. The only way to beat it is to go reinforce the growing conservative numbers elsewhere. And, if need be .......
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Come on down to Tennessee. If not for memphis, we are probably the reddest ( in more ways than 1) state there is. Plus, we have guns and ammo Lots of it. And country music. ::beertoast::
What's your State government look like in terms of Party and the likelihood they'll tell the Feds to go scratch?
We are looking at various options too. But I have done so much work here in Colorado, and I really don't want to pack up and leave it behind. I chose to bug-out here and I really don't want to be more than a tank of gas from the bug out location. Rural counties are still Conservative and the further out you are the less they are likely to mess with you - even if you live in a deep blue state . Colorado is hardly deep blue. Its just a target rich environment, and since they voted in MaryJane the reaction times of the targets is going to be down. Speaking of a business where you can sell to leftist morons and make money.... Yeah, Pot is destructive but for the most part it only destroys the moron using it... in general pot smokers are mellow, slow and stupid.
If TX or somewhere actually leaves the Union, then maybe its worth the move. But until that happens, I am not sure its worth the effort. TX has the same problem that all the western states do - California Immigrants coming in and voting blue. God damn locusts. Every urban center in the country is polluted. Even Wyoming has Jackson Hole.
Next spring I'm going to spend a lot of time in eastern Washington. I have friends that live there and swear that it is normal (of course you gotta consider what they're comparing it to!). It wouldn't break that "one tank of gas" rule that really makes sense and might offer a temporary respite from the lunacy I see on a daily basis.
Obviously I would need that disability settlement to provide me with the necessary grub-stake!
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Being in a border state like Texas would bother me and wide open spaces I'm not crazy about.
Now I could see Tennessee or similar geography because I know a person can hide in the mountains and not be found. I like Tenn. Not much for country music but hey I guess I could learn to love it.
Or eastern Tenn, southwestern NC, northwestern GA mountain areas--I like that area and it's easy to stay put up on the side of a mountain and it's a good location when traveling is necessary because you can head in any direction easily.
Cheaper property can be found in northern wisconsin but as my daughter said we might as well move to Canada! ha Not crazy about Wisconsin anyway and at this point there's way too many libs there right now.
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Texas' northeast edge borders Oklahoma, and Gunsmith tells me along that border, and that of the eastern part of the state, topography just like NC's can be found. Not real flat, lots of trees.
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Texas' northeast edge borders Oklahoma, and Gunsmith tells me along that border, and that of the eastern part of the state, topography just like NC's can be found. Not real flat, lots of trees.
sounds like one to put on the list
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I know some talked about moving to a cold state. Let me just say even though we can be butt freezing cold here in Minnesocold. I would not move here!
We just elected a democratic house and senate to go along with a major loony lefty governor. We are now a deep blue state. I am screwed!
I live in the heart of St. Paul and we have no, none, zip, zero, nada elected republicans in office in this socialist city and the @#$*% residents of St. Paul just voted on raising taxes again for the St. Paul Schools. My property taxes are absurd even though the housing market is stagnant the powers to be thought I did not pay enough taxes and the #$%^%@*$ hit me hard.
I am very seriously thinking of moving to South Dakota. I can not bring myself to move to badgerland.....
(http://www.gopherpucklive.com/forum/images/smilies/Goldy_Kills_Bucky2.gif)
So far my only BOL is in NW WI...better than Minnesota, but still, not as isolated or as conservative as I would like... What to do? ::saywhat::
(That is a funny graphic though! ;D )
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Being in a border state like Texas would bother me and wide open spaces I'm not crazy about.
Now I could see Tennessee or similar geography because I know a person can hide in the mountains and not be found. I like Tenn. Not much for country music but hey I guess I could learn to love it.
Or eastern Tenn, southwestern NC, northwestern GA mountain areas--I like that area and it's easy to stay put up on the side of a mountain and it's a good location when traveling is necessary because you can head in any direction easily.
Cheaper property can be found in northern wisconsin but as my daughter said we might as well move to Canada! ha Not crazy about Wisconsin anyway and at this point there's way too many libs there right now.
Eastern TN sounds nice, if zombies pour through the Cumberland gap we can open up on 'em!
Don't know about Texas, a lot of conservatives in rural areas and if they pull out of the union that would be attractive, but Meh-hico close by and big cesspools like Austin & Houston means lots of zombies, not sure I am not better off in NW WI.
How about more rugged areas like Northern Idaho, NW Montana...?
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guess I need to pull out the old atlas
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Louisiana. Sales tax (varies parish to parish) at my house is 8.75%. Does have a state income tax (currently around 3%). Property tax: The first $75k is non taxable, making it tolerable. If you live south of I-10, though, you're gonna think coon-asses talk funny.
I lived soth of I-10 ... Between Highland Rd and Perkins to be exact !
Close, but no cigar. You can't hear French being spoken in the morning cafes. ::laughonfloor::
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The first thing to do is find an area surrounded by Red counties.
via: http://drudgereport.com/ (http://drudgereport.com/)
THE NEW AMERICA
(http://drudgereport.com/cm.jpg)
COMPANIES PLAN MASSIVE LAYOFFS AS OBAMACARE BECOMES REALITY...
Utah company fires 100, blames Obama...
CEO reads prayer to staff, announces layoffs...
ROMNEY CAMPAIGN ELECTION SOFTWARE CRASHED ON ELECTION DAY... CHICAGOLAND: Thousands Line Up For Job Fair...
'They Better Give Me A Walmart Gift Card Or Something'...
Hispanic group demands national amnesty for 11 million illegals...
Pot votes in CO, WA raise specter of weed tourism...
Armored trucks with mounted cameras to roam FL city's streets...
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This interactive map shows by county, hover your mouse over the county and the percentage is revaled.
http://graphics.latimes.com/2012-election-results-national-map/#county (http://graphics.latimes.com/2012-election-results-national-map/#county)
Then different maps here are interesting, have past election ones too, the three color one is interesting.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2957563/posts?page=1 (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2957563/posts?page=1)
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I know some talked about moving to a cold state. Let me just say even though we can be butt freezing cold here in Minnesocold. I would not move here!
We just elected a democratic house and senate to go along with a major loony lefty governor. We are now a deep blue state. I am screwed!
I live in the heart of St. Paul and we have no, none, zip, zero, nada elected republicans in office in this socialist city and the @#$*% residents of St. Paul just voted on raising taxes again for the St. Paul Schools. My property taxes are absurd even though the housing market is stagnant the powers to be thought I did not pay enough taxes and the #$%^%@*$ hit me hard.
I am very seriously thinking of moving to South Dakota. I can not bring myself to move to badgerland.....
(http://www.gopherpucklive.com/forum/images/smilies/Goldy_Kills_Bucky2.gif)
Magnum, South Dakota is a great choice. We have a farm in N.E. SD and love it there. Im from WI originally so like you, I know cold winters. But there is abundant water, fish & wildlife, fertile ground, sparce population, and the folks that ARE there are good, down to earth, conservative people.
I actually WANT to live where there is a solid winter. Ice fishing! Very productive way to put up a good variety of fish. Another asset is that Ill be able to rely on the cold of winter being the most peaceful time. People tend to hunker down, are less mobile, and only the hardiest will take up residence.
The downside could be heating fuel. Not alot of trees. Most of the trees are on 12 to 18 acre home sites. Ours has good sized woods, but we will bring firewood in from outside the area and save the wood for insurance. Great area for wind and solar.
Alaska is awesome but we are moving down soon. Our winters in Anchorage are milder than the midwest and there are many favorable charactristics and resources, but when the SHTF we would be cut off from all our family in the lower 48. Besides, I miss whitetails and walleyes!
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I alternate my location, as I am fortunate to have housing in two places. I spend most of my time in Charlotte due to the demands of work, but also spend quite a bit of time in the NC mountains close to the Tennessee border. That is where I would rather be full time, but until recently Charlotte had been better in terms of career development and population of young single females :). But most of my calculus changed dramatically last Tuesday. It became suddenly confirmed that stuff like career development was premised on the idea that there is a future to be had in this country. "The future" is a lot less tangible to me now.
But anyway, yes the area of eastern TN and western NC would not be a bad choice at all for those looking for somewhere. As a whole TN seems more reliably conservative, but either side of the TN/NC border is pretty much the same from what I have observed.
Pandora have you considered that possibility? Much closer move than TX.
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I alternate my location, as I am fortunate to have housing in two places. I spend most of my time in Charlotte due to the demands of work, but also spend quite a bit of time in the NC mountains close to the Tennessee border. That is where I would rather be full time, but until recently Charlotte had been better in terms of career development and population of young single females :). But most of my calculus changed dramatically last Tuesday. It became suddenly confirmed that stuff like career development was premised on the idea that there is a future to be had in this country. "The future" is a lot less tangible to me now.
But anyway, yes the area of eastern TN and western NC would not be a bad choice at all for those looking for somewhere. As a whole TN seems more reliably conservative, but either side of the TN/NC border is pretty much the same from what I have observed.
Pandora have you considered that possibility? Much closer move than TX.
Actually, we are considering TN quite seriously, and it would be the TN side of the border. If we're going, I'd like to just get all the way out of NC.
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State borders will be meaningless in the end unless state governments tangibly resist the national government.
Our federal government is a sham. It is now a national government. States have no more autonomy - and in some regards less - than Chinese provinces.
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State borders will be meaningless in the end unless state governments tangibly resist the national government.
Our federal government is a sham. It is now a national government. States have no more autonomy - and in some regards less - than Chinese provinces.
I'm aware, but I was encouraged a bit by TX, IA and AR standing up to the State Dept. by keeping the UN's "poll watchers" out. TX was also the state that intended to throw out the TSA at the airports -- until they caved. Still, it seems to me at some point the Feds will have gotten so overbearing, yet toothless, that the States will draw some lines -- at their borders.
Some in NC are encouraged that we now have an R Governor and Legislature, but nobody ran against the AG, Roy Cooper, who is a recalcitrant D. I don't have much hope for the politicians in this State to grow some balls.
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If going Tennessee I would probably look around Carter County. The area around Roan Mountain is very nice, and close enough to Johnson City for work or whatever commercial activity might be required.
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If going Tennessee I would probably look around Carter County. The area around Roan Mountain is very nice, and close enough to Johnson City for work or whatever commercial activity might be required.
Looks cozy, temps seem moderate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnson_City,_Tennessee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnson_City,_Tennessee)
http://www.cartercountytn.gov/index.html (http://www.cartercountytn.gov/index.html)
TN has a sales tax too though. ::facepalm::
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If going Tennessee I would probably look around Carter County. The area around Roan Mountain is very nice, and close enough to Johnson City for work or whatever commercial activity might be required.
Looks cozy, temps seem moderate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnson_City,_Tennessee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnson_City,_Tennessee)
http://www.cartercountytn.gov/index.html (http://www.cartercountytn.gov/index.html)
TN has a sales tax too though. ::facepalm::
There's no income tax, though. And they just won a GOP super majority in the General Assembly.
In NC, we have both, and a property tax on our vehicles.
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If going Tennessee I would probably look around Carter County. The area around Roan Mountain is very nice, and close enough to Johnson City for work or whatever commercial activity might be required.
Looks cozy, temps seem moderate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnson_City,_Tennessee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnson_City,_Tennessee)
http://www.cartercountytn.gov/index.html (http://www.cartercountytn.gov/index.html)
TN has a sales tax too though. ::facepalm::
There's no income tax, though. And they just won a GOP super majority in the General Assembly.
In NC, we have both, and a property tax on our vehicles.
No income tax you say? ::thinking::
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Yeah, no income tax in TN. Sales tax is fairly high (9.5% IIRC), but it's probably a worthwhile tradeoff. Plus I much rather see taxation on the consumption rather than production side (though most governments naturally conclude "why not both!").
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Glock, does TN tax vehicles as property?
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Glock, does TN tax vehicles as property?
Pan, we have a wheel tax....And it varies by county. You can haul a trailer here and do not need a plate. We also do not have a death tax. A few years ago, the dems here attempted to backdoor a state income tax. I believe it is why so many were defeated. Other than memphis, which is a waste of property, I believe there are only two other "blue" counties in the state....That being davidson county (nashville) and possibly one other, can't seem to remember which one or where.
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When I picked my daughter up from work Friday she said as she got in the car, "I talked to a couple of friends today. One word, Mom. Tennessee."
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When I picked my daughter up from work Friday she said as she got in the car, "I talked to a couple of friends today. One word, Mom. Tennessee."
Learn how to sing rocky top and come on in.
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Any good Italian food there? ::hysterical::
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Any good Italian food there? ::hysterical::
I'm figuring there are some of Italian-descent there, so there probably is. Should we go, then that would be a "definitely", just not in restaurant-form.
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Any good Italian food there? ::hysterical::
I'm figuring there are some of Italian-descent there, so there probably is. Should we go, then that would be a "definitely", just not in restaurant-form.
They may run us out of town if we don't deep fry things. ::hysterical::
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Chicken fried veal parmigiana, mmmm good.
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Compromise? Deep-fried ravoli is awfully tasty.
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Compromise? Deep-fried ravoli is awfully tasty.
To each his own, but yech.
We deep-fry certain stuff -- don't believe JF. My mother deep fries all the vegetables for Christmas Eve, and a lot of the fish as well -- calamari! mm mm mmm -- but none of it has a heavy breading.
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You just, you just put 'em in that
hot grease naked, how cruel.
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You just, you just put 'em in that
hot grease naked, how cruel.
Crew-el?! Moi?!
Non! We roll the broccoli and cauliflower in a light coating of egg and breadcrumbs. The fish -- calamari! mm mm mmmm -- get a flour dredge, including the eel and the smelts.
Shrimp served cocktail-style, cold; cod in a cold salad (meh); escargot w/garlic and butter and damn! I always forget the seventh fish.
That's what Ma does. We're usually down here by ourselves, so we do a pound and half of shrimp "cocktail", a salad and a loaf of homemade Italian bread.
Wow. We zipped right past Thanksgiving to Christmas food.
This is not "location" stuff, people! Can you not control yourselves?! ::unknowncomic::
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I just don't know what to do. I hate to say it but I have to stay employed. I have a family to take care of and a wife that won't leave her aging mother. If I sold my house I would be just on the + side (maybe $20K-$50K profit) but I have nearly nothing in the bank and 2 401k's and 2 IRA's. If it were just me I'd cash out all of the retirement money (pay the tax) sell everything and find a nice secluded area in North Texas or some other "Red" location, find an under the table job busing tables or short order cook or something to try and stretch what ever $$'s I had. I just don't know.
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This heaven for me.
Arancini ( rice croquettes ) Italian recipe (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDAbKAjXzu8#ws)
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I just don't know what to do. I hate to say it but I have to stay employed. I have a family to take care of and a wife that won't leave her aging mother. If I sold my house I would be just on the + side (maybe $20K-$50K profit) but I have nearly nothing in the bank and 2 401k's and 2 IRA's. If it were just me I'd cash out all of the retirement money (pay the tax) sell everything and find a nice secluded area in North Texas or some other "Red" location, find an under the table job busing tables or short order cook or something to try and stretch what ever $$'s I had. I just don't know.
Then wait/stay. (My unsolicited and possibly unwanted advice.) Make some security-type preparations for where you are -- water/food/fuel/you know the drill.
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I just don't know what to do. I hate to say it but I have to stay employed. I have a family to take care of and a wife that won't leave her aging mother. If I sold my house I would be just on the + side (maybe $20K-$50K profit) but I have nearly nothing in the bank and 2 401k's and 2 IRA's. If it were just me I'd cash out all of the retirement money (pay the tax) sell everything and find a nice secluded area in North Texas or some other "Red" location, find an under the table job busing tables or short order cook or something to try and stretch what ever $$'s I had. I just don't know.
Then wait/stay. (My unsolicited and possibly unwanted advice.) Make some security-type preparations for where you are -- water/food/fuel/you know the drill.
She's right,basic safety and food and water preps are the way to go at whatever level you can. That still puts you far and away ahead of most out there.
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Camping is a good family activity and it helps
bring the theoretical and practical together.
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I just don't know what to do. I hate to say it but I have to stay employed. I have a family to take care of and a wife that won't leave her aging mother. If I sold my house I would be just on the + side (maybe $20K-$50K profit) but I have nearly nothing in the bank and 2 401k's and 2 IRA's. If it were just me I'd cash out all of the retirement money (pay the tax) sell everything and find a nice secluded area in North Texas or some other "Red" location, find an under the table job busing tables or short order cook or something to try and stretch what ever $$'s I had. I just don't know.
Then wait/stay. (My unsolicited and possibly unwanted advice.) Make some security-type preparations for where you are -- water/food/fuel/you know the drill.
She's right,basic safety and food and water preps are the way to go at whatever level you can. That still puts you far and away ahead of most out there.
Did ... did he just say I was right?! ::falldownshocked::
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Cashing in 401 k will be expensive. Not only do you pay a penalty, but I believe you must then pay the prevailing tax rate.
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I just don't know what to do. I hate to say it but I have to stay employed. I have a family to take care of and a wife that won't leave her aging mother. If I sold my house I would be just on the + side (maybe $20K-$50K profit) but I have nearly nothing in the bank and 2 401k's and 2 IRA's. If it were just me I'd cash out all of the retirement money (pay the tax) sell everything and find a nice secluded area in North Texas or some other "Red" location, find an under the table job busing tables or short order cook or something to try and stretch what ever $$'s I had. I just don't know.
Do what you always have done: The best you can. No where is "safe", and you don't have to earn nothing. Stay employed. Just cut back where you can. Look for ways to milk the system for income. Can you get money for the govt to pay for her mother's care? Can you then hire your wife to do it? Earn less, and you qualify for more. That study they did a while back showed a family 4 on welfare working 40 hours a MONTH at minimum wage could have the equivalent take home pay of a family with a 60K income. The IRA and 401K are no longer safe. You should cash them out regardless. Put the money into buying preps. Guns. Ammo. Long term freeze dried food. Water filter. Fuel storage. If you have any left over buy junk silver or 24k gold chain. Maybe pay down the house. Maybe. Chances are in the end everyone will squat and ownership will be relatively meaningless.
I have the opposite problem-- My prep is largely done and I have a pretty good chunk of change in the bank after the sale of my house in town. I need to do something with the money. In an ideal world, I would buy a second, larger property, with other like minded individuals with their own large stake to put down. Getting a second place and prepping it makes sense from a redundancy perspective, but really its hard to maintain two places. Add in livestock and a greenhouse and its near impossible, unless you can go back and forth easily, or have a second group helping to maintain the second locale. With my little stake already in the ground here in Colorado, I don't really want to give up all I have done, nor get too far from it - or town - I plan to work in some capacity up til the collapse. Moving to TX or TN would take me outside of a rational range to get back to the prepped home. I could try to sell it, but I would certainly loose money over what I have put in.. My company pays to have me in this region, so a move would probably mean job loss as well. If a state actually left the Union, I would consider doing all of that, but Red don't mean Red. The liberals will go to anyplace successful. They are in WY.. , they are moving to TX and you can bet they will be migrating to SD soon. Soon as their disastrous policies being to affect them, they move to get away from the effects, and then vote to implement them all over again. The Fed will continue to reach everywhere - even in the the Red states.
Seclusion isn't always the best either. Our property is where everyone can see our business, and on the main road in/out of the subdivision. If the community here bands together that is a good thing. If it doesn't my security is going to get to be very tough, that is if security is needed - I don't expect roving Mad Max gangs up here. However defending the place against a SWAT team isn't going to be feasible.
We are gonna have to with the decisions we have made and make do the best we can with them.
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Cashing in 401 k will be expensive. Not only do you pay a penalty, but I believe you must then pay the prevailing tax rate.
Know what is more expensive? Having the dollar collapse, a bank holiday declared, and the account converted to govt bonds or devalued into new currency while its frozen. Cry for me, Argentina. Worse, the IRAs and 401Ks represent the next biggest pile of ready cash to stave off the collapse - so they may very well try to seize them before the SHTF. Add into that the tax rate jumps that are very likely to go into effect next year and you are paying more than if you take it out before Jan 1. We hedged ours. We took 1/2 out 4 years ago. We will take the other half now. Also , there are special situations where is can be taken out without the penalty- check to see if you qualify. Solar still has a 30% dollar for dollar tax rebate as well, and with Cap and Trade, you will need it, and it will offset the pain of the 10% penalty.
.
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I agree with Weisshaupt: Concerning 401(k)s and IRAs, take the tax hit this year and withdraw all funds. Who knows what the personal income tax rate will be when it's time to withdraw the funds? Not only is there the spector of Argentina-style confiscation, but I think there will be an Executive Order of some sort affecting these plans in the name of 'economic fairness and justice'; in other words, the
poor Owebama Niggaz don't work enough or make enough to have a 401(k), so nobody should have one. On top of that, as employment drops, so will contributions. As the market tanks, more of those still working will no longer 'invest' for their retirement. At that point, the whole concept of saving for one's retirement through such a program will be moot. Get the cash now, convert what you can to metals and preps and with the rest make sure you keep small bills instead of 20s.
To have a 401(k) or IRA means you trust the government that you can have your money back in 20 or more years. As we've seen with the last four years, nothing is guaranteed.
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Yeah, I think the wealthy are already ahead of the game, much of the recent decline is large fish leaving the pond so they don't get their asses carved up next year...the writing is already on the wall.
I am cashing out my retirement funds and taking the tax hit now, it will be less than the futurre confiscation and way better than getting completely hosed.
As far as "moving" I am in the same spot Ben, hell maybe worse, doesn't matter though. Bank can have the home if I bug out, I could only sell it on a short sale now anyway since the market has gone to worse than crap. Everything else will be paid for or paid off. I won't have my regular job much longer, I'll shovel horse sh*t for pocket change if I have to, just losing all interest in feeding this beast. Maybe I'll snag some gubmint grant money in lieu of SocSec contributions extorted from me for all these decades and lose it in a boating accident.
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Don, can you give me a run-down on what the gun laws are there, or a link where I can go for that information? I believe TN and NC have reciprocity as far as concealed carry.
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Don, can you give me a run-down on what the gun laws are there, or a link where I can go for that information? I believe TN and NC have reciprocity as far as concealed carry.
Pan, this should give you the info you need.
http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/tennessee.pdf (http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/tennessee.pdf)
http://www.tn.gov/safety/handgunmain.shtml (http://www.tn.gov/safety/handgunmain.shtml)
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I just don't know what to do. I hate to say it but I have to stay employed. I have a family to take care of and a wife that won't leave her aging mother. If I sold my house I would be just on the + side (maybe $20K-$50K profit) but I have nearly nothing in the bank and 2 401k's and 2 IRA's. If it were just me I'd cash out all of the retirement money (pay the tax) sell everything and find a nice secluded area in North Texas or some other "Red" location, find an under the table job busing tables or short order cook or something to try and stretch what ever $$'s I had. I just don't know.
Then wait/stay. (My unsolicited and possibly unwanted advice.) Make some security-type preparations for where you are -- water/food/fuel/you know the drill.
She's right,basic safety and food and water preps are the way to go at whatever level you can. That still puts you far and away ahead of most out there.
Did ... did he just say I was right?! ::falldownshocked::
I was tired when I said that. ::oldman::
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FWIW -
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/this-is-the-most-anti-obama-county-in-the-u-s-it-aint-worth-a-damn/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/this-is-the-most-anti-obama-county-in-the-u-s-it-aint-worth-a-damn/)
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FWIW -
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/this-is-the-most-anti-obama-county-in-the-u-s-it-aint-worth-a-damn/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/this-is-the-most-anti-obama-county-in-the-u-s-it-aint-worth-a-damn/)
Just a cover story for the 100 percent Obama counties.
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FWIW -
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/this-is-the-most-anti-obama-county-in-the-u-s-it-aint-worth-a-damn/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/this-is-the-most-anti-obama-county-in-the-u-s-it-aint-worth-a-damn/)
Just a cover story for the 100 percent Obama counties.
;) Yes, good call, it is a CNN report after all. (Plus they like singling out rednecks to ridicule as being especially "out-of-touch" & "racist" & whatever...)
:P
Libiots! ::asskicking::
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Yes and they always dutifully report poor grammar verbatim. When they are interviewing a typical hood rat on the other hand, they always make an effort to clean up the grammar of the respondent when it goes to print.
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It is a good choice though, wiki says it has a little history:
"Its county seat is Guthrie.[2] King County has the third smallest population of any county in the United States, ranking behind only Loving County, Texas, and ... . The county was named for William Philip King, who died at the Battle of the Alamo.
The 6666 (called four six Ranch), founded 1883, is situated in King and adjacent Dickens County. ... ."
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2012 Maps to the county level, squashed/expanded to represent actual population (http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/2012/)
Based on County win for Obama/Romney
(http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/2012/countycartrb512.png)
Based on % vote, with purple in the middle
(http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/2012/countycartpurple512.png)
and based on county voting more than 70% republican vs Democrat..
(http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/2012/countycart3070384.png)
And there you have it. The Rule of the City Mouse over the Country Mouse. You know, until the country mice decide the City mice shouldn't get any more food. The Solid red area in the second map corresponds to Southern Idaho and Utah ( I think)
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Per OReilly two minutes ago, the majority of votes
to Obama were from folks who earn 30K or less.
That means not enough people, like those 3 million
we lost who voted for McCain, DID NOT VOTE.
There were not enough earners voting. Not enough
people who make over 40K voted. My question to
any beotching about the outcome is: DID YOU VOTE.
It's depraved and disgusting that there are those,
not here but out in the world, that we associate
with DID NOT VOTE and they are the fault.
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Per OReilly two minutes ago, the majority of votes
to Obama were from folks who earn 30K or less.
That means not enough people, like those 3 million
we lost who voted for McCain, DID NOT VOTE.
There were not enough earners voting. Not enough
people who make over 40K voted. My question to
any beotching about the outcome is: DID YOU VOTE.
It's depraved and disgusting that there are those,
not here but out in the world, that we associate
with DID NOT VOTE and they are the fault.
Gunsmith and I absolutely DID VOTE. For Romney. We'd have crawled over broken glass to vote against Obongo. My parents and brother DID VOTE for Romney in NJ -- not much help there, I admit, nevertheless, they did.
And, BTW, I spoke to my brother yesterday, first time since the election. He told me he walked around in a state of dismayed shock all day that Wednesday.
Now, for the future ....
For me, voting for Romney was not as painful as for some, but I'm here to tell you and mark me well:
THAT'S IT.
I have voted in my last nose-holding election and that goes for 2014. Anybody who has a problem with that, or will, should tell me now, and I'll jump off this forum and leave y'all to it, because it's not up for debate, negotiation, or a question of "glands".
That is all.
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Per OReilly two minutes ago, the majority of votes
to Obama were from folks who earn 30K or less.
That means not enough people, like those 3 million
we lost who voted for McCain, DID NOT VOTE.
There were not enough earners voting. Not enough
people who make over 40K voted. My question to
any beotching about the outcome is: DID YOU VOTE.
It's depraved and disgusting that there are those,
not here but out in the world, that we associate
with DID NOT VOTE and they are the fault.
Gunsmith and I absolutely DID VOTE. For Romney. We'd have crawled over broken glass to vote against Obongo. My parents and brother DID VOTE for Romney in NJ -- not much help there, I admit, nevertheless, they did.
And, BTW, I spoke to my brother yesterday, first time since the election. He told me he walked around in a state of dismayed shock all day that Wednesday.
Now, for the future ....
For me, voting for Romney was not as painful as for some, but I'm here to tell you and mark me well:
THAT'S IT.
I have voted in my last nose-holding election and that goes for 2014. Anybody who has a problem with that, or will, should tell me now, and I'll jump off this forum and leave y'all to it, because it's not up for debate, negotiation, or a question of "glands".
That is all.
Before you go.....Can we have the boobie emoticon? ::whoohoo::
Sorry, thought we needed a little levity.
I'm too tired to cry or care. I've already stated I'm in selfish mode, want a compromise to prolong our demise long enough for me to gather as much stuff as I can. If I can time it, I want to go buy a mountain of stuff on credit before the crash.
I talked to one of my old employees today. Worked for my old company longer than I had, 25 years. Good lady, did a great job for me.....She is destroyed with the closing of my old branch. We discussed this stuff on another thread, they closed it up, or the decision became easier, with the re election of obama. Her husband didnt have a high school diploma, but they are hard working people, proud, probably qualified for some stuff, but wouldn't take it.
I told her to take what she can get. Draw unemployment, food stamps, housing.....I don't know if they will. Frankly, she couldn't believe I suggested it and I attempted to explain the world has changed.
So I'm depressed. A lot of good people are gonna get hurt. I feel I've let her family down in a way.
On second thought,a boobie emoticon really wouldn't help matters.
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Yes, yes, and yes.
Every time I hear or read about who did and did not vote I get more steamed. The demographers know exactly who did not vote. I want them to hone in on that three million McCain voters that did not turn out. I want to know exactly who they are. I want to know who those above 40K that did not turn out are also. Those are the ones, those people are worse than the Democrat scum. They are the rot that feeds the scum. We need Tide, Clorox, vinegar and water; we need to mix it and pour it over these people. I guarantee they will dissolve on the spot.
(A boar bristle brush may be necessary on highly soiled areas.)
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Nothing has changed the past 30 years...it's candidate selection and the candidate's strategy and tactitcs...and the Ruling Class has held sway except for the Reagan elections of 1980 & 1984...the lesson is OBVIOUS...buck the Ruling Class and appeal directly to the people! What did the Tea Party do? They bucked the Ruling Class and appealed to the people! The GOP is in the clutches of the Ruling Class and it appears nothing will be done to challenge that from the inside or the outside. Palin had a chance to do that but bowed out this go-around. I think that was a mistake, but, whatever, it is done.
You are not alone Pan, not by far, so you ain't goin' anywhere darlin', not yet anyway! But I do expect Galt notices and that is as it should be. Where we can I hope we all stay in touch...I for one might enter a permanent melancholy if y'all abondone me!
:'(
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It's depraved and disgusting that there are those,
not here but out in the world, that we associate
with DID NOT VOTE and they are the fault.
They did, and the votes got "lost" - you don't get 99-100% of the vote except in 3rd world dictatorships.
That, and there is some evidence to suggest that team Obama hacked Romney's ORCA, to disable it, thus hampering the GOP ground game and their ability to "get out the vote"
IN a contest with people who think its "clever" to not follow the rules the only solution is violence. The game is rigged. They know its rigged. They let some counties go to 99% to show they know its rigged. They don't care.
Until the Right and the GOP learn that, there is nothing we can do. They use our tendency to follow rules against us. They use our tendency to act civility against us. They use or tendency to forgive against us. And they laugh when they do it, just as much as when Terrorists laugh at TSA harassing Granny instead of Olive skinned men 21-35.
There is no nonirritating with people who do not find the outcome of such negotiations binding. The Constitution isn't binding. Morality isn't binding. Nothing is binding to them if they see a chance to take advantage. You can't live and let live with people like that. They cheated. They will continue to cheat because they see no reason why they shouldn't. You have only one logical response.
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On second thought,a boobie emoticon really wouldn't help matters.
No, it won't and even if it did, the answer is still no.
I don't understand why you feel you let the woman's family down ... well, maybe I do. You're a decent sort who feels bad he can't help when he can't help. But you did help her; you told her to get on the dole, and, more importantly, why.
-
Nothing has changed the past 30 years...it's candidate selection and the candidate's strategy and tactitcs...and the Ruling Class has held sway except for the Reagan elections of 1980 & 1984...the lesson is OBVIOUS...buck the Ruling Class and appeal directly to the people! What did the Tea Party do? They bucked the Ruling Class and appealed to the people! The GOP is in the clutches of the Ruling Class and it appears nothing will be done to challenge that from the inside or the outside. Palin had a chance to do that but bowed out this go-around. I think that was a mistake, but, whatever, it is done.
You are not alone Pan, not by far, so you ain't goin' anywhere darlin', not yet anyway! But I do expect Galt notices and that is as it should be. Where we can I hope we all stay in touch...I for one might enter a permanent melancholy if y'all abondone me!
:'(
Nobody's abondone-ing you, Libertas. Let not your heart be troubled.
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::grouphug::
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I have voted in my last nose-holding election and that goes for 2014. Anybody who has a problem with that, or will, should tell me now, and I'll jump off this forum and leave y'all to it, because it's not up for debate, negotiation, or a question of "glands".
That is all.
To keep the pain real, no more extensions to unemployment payments, which is currently 99 weeks (IIRC). A vote for Owebama = a vote for OwebamaCare = a vote for higher unemployment.
I expect the Stupid Party to go along with an extension, and that is why I won't vote R again, hell I may not vote again. Why bother? No one in the R party seems to care about vote fraud.
Nope, no problems from this end.
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On second thought,a boobie emoticon really wouldn't help matters.
No, it won't and even if it did, the answer is still no.
I don't understand why you feel you let the woman's family down ... well, maybe I do. You're a decent sort who feels bad he can't help when he can't help. But you did help her; you told her to get on the dole, and, more importantly, why.
Pan, I feel bad because 5 years ago, I recognized the new direction this company took and had the means to do something else. Now her family will need to accept govt assistance, something we had discussed many times, something which turned both our stomachs.
I don't like watching good people hurt, especially those who could have qualified for assistance but never accepted it. Her family is proud, not haughty, but what I'll call a good pride. The phone call I received of the closing hurt and I don't like feeling powerless.
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On second thought,a boobie emoticon really wouldn't help matters.
No, it won't and even if it did, the answer is still no.
I don't understand why you feel you let the woman's family down ... well, maybe I do. You're a decent sort who feels bad he can't help when he can't help. But you did help her; you told her to get on the dole, and, more importantly, why.
Pan, I feel bad because 5 years ago, I recognized the new direction this company took and had the means to do something else. Now her family will need to accept govt assistance, something we had discussed many times, something which turned both our stomachs.
I don't like watching good people hurt, especially those who could have qualified for assistance but never accepted it. Her family is proud, not haughty, but what I'll call a good pride. The phone call I received of the closing hurt and I don't like feeling powerless.
I'm sorry, my friend. Truly.
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I gotta say, only the Caribbean islands and Vanuatu look appealing to me, I guess I'd lean toward Vanuatu as it is not in prime storm paths.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/hate-this-talk-about-raising-tax-rates-here-are-some-countries-with-no-income-taxes-whatsoever/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/hate-this-talk-about-raising-tax-rates-here-are-some-countries-with-no-income-taxes-whatsoever/)
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I AM NOT LEAVING MY COUNTRY TO THESE RAT BASTIDS.
/note to self: need more ammo
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I AM NOT LEAVING MY COUNTRY TO THESE RAT BASTIDS.
/note to self: need more ammo
I hear ya, I'm kinda stubborn too, just showing options...I can't afford a migration of that size anyway...
Ya stuck with me!
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I AM NOT LEAVING MY COUNTRY TO THESE RAT BASTIDS.
/note to self: need more ammo
I hear ya, I'm kinda stubborn too, just showing options...I can't afford a migration of that size anyway...
Ya stuck with me!
Hah! Maybe y'all are stuck with me!
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Maybe a taste of minority status is what it's gonna take? Not just politically, but ethnically and culturally too. Until white people learn to develop a sense of identity, all other efforts will be for naught IMO.
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I AM NOT LEAVING MY COUNTRY TO THESE RAT BASTIDS.
/note to self: need more ammo
I hear ya, I'm kinda stubborn too, just showing options...I can't afford a migration of that size anyway...
Ya stuck with me!
Hah! Maybe y'all are stuck with me!
Were in it together.
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I AM NOT LEAVING MY COUNTRY TO THESE RAT BASTIDS.
/note to self: need more ammo
I hear ya, I'm kinda stubborn too, just showing options...I can't afford a migration of that size anyway...
Ya stuck with me!
Hah! Maybe y'all are stuck with me!
Were in it together.
!
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We really should do an excersise in distances just to see how far how long it would be to meet at a certain point in the country.
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Annual IAL BBQ! ::whoohoo::
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We really should do an excersise in distances just to see how far how long it would be to meet at a certain point in the country.
What's the geographical center of the country, which state? That's the point. We're scattered at almost all far points of the country, from Washington state to Florida, New York to Colorado, and then there's our Canadian friend.
(http://www.united-states-map.com/usa948c.gif)
Looks like Kansas/Missouri to me.
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Yup. Lebanon, Kansas.
http://www.kansastravel.org/geographicalcenter.htm (http://www.kansastravel.org/geographicalcenter.htm)
Looks quiet. Wonder what the maximum accomodations are?
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LOL. Libertas, you went so far as to narrow it down to a city/town?
They don't have the accommodations, there'll be one close by that does.
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LOL. Libertas, you went so far as to narrow it down to a city/town?
They don't have the accommodations, there'll be one close by that does.
I'm an accountant, I'm anally retentive! ;D
Maybe Rush's hometown is close enough? Seems to have more to offer.
::saywhat::
http://www.visitcape.com/ (http://www.visitcape.com/)
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanon,_Kansas (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanon,_Kansas)
Lebanon is a city in Smith County, Kansas, United States, in the north central part of the state. As of the 2010 census, the city population was 218.[6] In 1918, a scientific survey established that the geographic center of what was then the United States (now the contiguous "Lower 48" states) lies near the town and a monument was subsequently erected at the site.[7] This trivia fact was referenced in the 1969 film "The Computer Wore Tennis Shoes"
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My point was that we could play hop scotch from one bad place to a better place with friends waiting to help. If Soup needs to bail he knows which way to go and so on and so on.The plan being HOW do we get there and who will be there. What needs to go with us and how do we pull it off between us.
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::)
There goes Texas...they're going to get Californicated!
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Californias-Population-Moving-Out-182914961.html (http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Californias-Population-Moving-Out-182914961.html)
::exitstageleft::
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The city's motto is "Keep Austin Weird" and it will go to any length to justify it.
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Rawlings List
http://www.survivalblog.com/retreatareas.html (http://www.survivalblog.com/retreatareas.html)
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Thanks for the link, Weisshaupt.
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Idaho #1.
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Heh, how about this? Pandora, TN. ;D
Not much around it and them hills to the south and east have a whole lotta nothing! (Lots of breathing room!)
http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=Pandora&state=TN (http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=Pandora&state=TN)
And hey it is still warmer than where I'm at!
http://www.friendlyforecast.com/usa/weather.php?db=273736%26%3F-Forecast-Pandora-Tennessee (http://www.friendlyforecast.com/usa/weather.php?db=273736%26%3F-Forecast-Pandora-Tennessee)
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Heh. Whaddaya know!
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I have family very near there, on the NC side of the border. It would be a very good place to consider, actually. Mountain folk have a healthy distrust of government. Remember when the Feds were camped out in the NC mountains trying to hunt down Eric Rudolph? More than a few times shots were fired into their encampment.
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News director for Chattanooga NBC just tweeted this:
TN one of just 8 states with more people moving in than moving out. Others are WA, OR, AK, TX, ND, NC, NH. (via Atlas Van Lines study)
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That's interesting, being an AVL study it indicates all these migrants are producers. There must be many migrants to sweet spots such as Crackifornia because of the multitude of free stuff. Ben, get out while you can.
ETA: New Hampshire, what's up with that?
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ETA: New Hampshire, what's up with that?
Oh that is easy. There is a Libertarian conspiracy to take over that State - because the numbers indicate that would be the easiest one. I think the numbers lie.
http://freestateproject.org/ (http://freestateproject.org/)
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Mike Adams ( infowars) on leaving the US to avoid Collapse ( summary: don't) (http://www.naturalnews.com/034404_preppers_collapse_bugging_out.html)
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ETA: New Hampshire, what's up with that?
Oh that is easy. There is a Libertarian conspiracy to take over that State - because the numbers indicate that would be the easiest one. I think the numbers lie.
http://freestateproject.org/ (http://freestateproject.org/)
I call BS on that too, NH has a bit of a flakey rep, what are 20k gonna do? Take over a town or a rural county? Still surrounded, right? And the state government isn't what I would call especially conservative or even libertarian...
http://www.nh.gov/ (http://www.nh.gov/)
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Mike Adams ( infowars) on leaving the US to avoid Collapse ( summary: don't) (http://www.naturalnews.com/034404_preppers_collapse_bugging_out.html)
Good points, but #5 is not a hard fact as it only applies in a catastrophic event scenario, in that event you are stuck where you are when the EMP goes, or the nuke, or the whatever. In terms of odds, there are many more scenarios and cascade type events that are more likely to occur than the Big Event, granted it only takes one Big Event to blow the probability factors to hell, but chances are there will be some preliminary indicators of a general economic/political collapse that means if you are smart and beat feet you can and should make it to a BOL. Hedge your bets if you have a BOL by having some preps at your in town residence & emergency items in your primary vehicle. It may well mean you have to ride out the initial Big Event with what you have with you, hunker down a bit and let the first die-back occur, migrate to your nearest prepared location, repeat process, etc. It may not be perfect and there is no guarantee you'll make it to where you want to be or even that once you're at where you want to be you have much more time to survive, but something is better than nothing, and if it allows younger generations time to survive in the new environment that is at least something worthy to aim for as well.
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Agreed.
Even though I know exactly where I am and every road in and out I created 12x12 map flash cards sectioned into five separate routes. Who knows where the problem will present itself or where there may be a stumbling block.
The long way home may be the shortest route to safety.
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Hedge your bets if you have a BOL by having some preps at your in town residence & emergency items in your primary vehicle. It may well mean you have to ride out the initial Big Event with what you have with you, hunker down a bit and let the first die-back occur, migrate to your nearest prepared location, repeat process, etc. It may not be perfect and there is no guarantee you'll make it to where you want to be or even that once you're at where you want to be you have much more time to survive, but something is better than nothing, and if it allows younger generations time to survive in the new environment that is at least something worthy to aim for as well.
I think he is right that if you CAN live at your BOL, then you should. Its just one less logistical problem to be overcome. If you are not there, during the "big event" your BOL may be discovered and raided before you arrive. I worry a bit about that in our scenario. The greenhouse and PV are conspicuous if you live in the neighborhood. As I meet people I say I am the guy with the solar panels and the hippie dome and they all know where I am .. . They work great as "don't bug me, I am obviously liberal" camouflage, as long as folks don't know better, and there and the neighborhood is rural, so in general folks look out for one another- but there is no guarantee that will continue after an EVENT. . If things are really bad though, they see food and power and may loot those while leaving my crappy vinyl sided double-wide alone. I may have to pull the panels down, and break a couple of poly panels on the greenhouse to make it look like its already been "hit" - but I may not get time to do that if the event is sudden and I am trapped in "town" - of course, the new "town" I am in is sub 10,000, and not 100,000+, and I am 45 minutes away from the big population centers. I am not so much worried about the EMP pulse (which would kill my panels and inverters too!) and the greenhouse itself is unlikely to be massively damaged.. people will break in and raid the crops, they don't care about the structure. But a Martial Law with travel restrictions would make it very difficult. The only way around such roadblocks is on foot, and I am too far to hoof it with children. Maybe on horse back. Maybe. They of course can't watch every little jeep road, but I may have to wait till late spring to get through on those.
However there is something to be said for some degree of diversity. If I had unlimited funds,I would be prepping a place in Denver, a good sized farm outside of Denver, a place in the mountains - or maybe two in different States and one or two places overseas. Options are good, even if there is a risk of an option falling off the table. In Argentina a lot of rural folks had to move into the cities to find jobs, and supplies as the trucks didn't deliver to rural towns anymore. Ironically, in many cases, the cities/town were safer. Criminals are more bold when you are by yourself and no help is coming. Even my new house "in town" may turn out to be too rural.
As he says in the article - wherever you are won't be ideal for every scenario. You do what you can with the constraints you are under, and make it work the best you can. This isn't a game,there are no rules and "winning" means you survive and possibly even prosper and thrive.
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News director for Chattanooga NBC just tweeted this:
TN one of just 8 states with more people moving in than moving out. Others are WA, OR, AK, TX, ND, NC, NH. (via Atlas Van Lines study)
http://www.businessinsider.com/atlas-vans-moving-map-2013-1 (http://www.businessinsider.com/atlas-vans-moving-map-2013-1)
Maps and stats to the migration make it all the more interesting.
HT/Ace
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News director for Chattanooga NBC just tweeted this:
TN one of just 8 states with more people moving in than moving out. Others are WA, OR, AK, TX, ND, NC, NH. (via Atlas Van Lines study)
http://www.businessinsider.com/atlas-vans-moving-map-2013-1 (http://www.businessinsider.com/atlas-vans-moving-map-2013-1)
Maps and stats to the migration make it all the more interesting.
HT/Ace
ND is really benefiting from the oil boom.
Hey Weisshaupt, there is only surviving and thriving, some may prosper at one better than others, but the latter will no doubt be dominated by the younger, naturally aggressive and clever people. Since most of us do not have unlimited funds, we can only do what we can. Be careful with faux raided look, it could invite other unwanted activity. Wonder if there is some hidden booby traps and such you could employ?
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That's interesting, being an AVL study it indicates all these migrants are producers. There must be many migrants to sweet spots such as Crackifornia because of the multitude of free stuff. Ben, get out while you can.
ETA: New Hampshire, what's up with that?
Wish I could, we will see what the future holds though.
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Join the Citadel Group in Idaho (http://cnsnews.com/blog/gregory-gwyn-williams-jr/patriotic-group-build-armed-defensible-neighborhood-fortress)
As I sad in another thread, the conservatives are turning inward. We know there is going to be a fight. We know that even if there isn't one, we don't want to have any more to do with the degenerates on the left.
This is telling:
While Citadel may sound wonderful to many who are reading this, the community has posted a warning on their home page: "Marxists, Socialists, Liberals and Establishment Republicans will likely find that life in our community is incompatible with their existing ideology and preferred lifestyles."
Emphasis mine. Hope that any do get in meet with "accidents"
It is further proof the GOP is dead. Their base has decided they are no different ( and they aren't) If they want to start competing with the Dems for demographic - let them. Hell, we should have started a party to do just that years ago - just to split the Democratic vote. Go Nader. I suspect that Ron Paul is paid by Dems to do the same. Nope folks like this are going to kill any Fed that decides to hassle anyone in the compound..
Citadel says that every patriot selected to live within the community "will voluntarily agree to follow the footsteps of our Founding Fathers by swearing to one another our lives, our fortunes and our Sacred Honor to defend one another and Liberty against all enemies, foreign and domestic."
Its Waco times 100, and the cowards in the White House will just target them - Men women and children, with drones.
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As I sad in another thread...
A Freudian slip perhaps? Or was it just me?
There was an interesting discussion in the comments of that CNS article (betwixt & between the trollish ones) about the practicality, the propriety, and the purpose of such a community. The trolls were there to fling poo, insulting anyone who doesn't think that our present circumstances in Øbomination ain't just the neatest thing. One of them tosses the red herring of "What good did the pubbies ever do?" as a deflection to the 900 pound gorilla which is, "If Øbomination is such a sweet deal, why are so many trying so hard to escape it?"
As for The Citadel project itself, I'm finding that I am perhaps insufficiently radical right enough to qualify for inclusion. Maybe it is just blowback from all the foolishness that has been shoved at us but on many sites I find my opinions of caution and moderation greeted with contempt and derision. I don't really GAS and I'm not inclined to back down or panic-react because someone doesn't agree with me, but I do find the proposition of being out of touch with both the left and the right a bit unsettling.
And maybe I'm reading more into their mission statement than really exists. It sounds to me like right-wingers playing at libertarianism with pure democracy as their model for governance. And jefferson as their inspiration? No thanks.
I wish them well, and hope that they thrive and prosper peacefully. I think I'll pass.
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Are you finding yourself "out of touch" with us here as well?
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Are you finding yourself "out of touch" with us here as well?
I don't think so - at least nothing is apparent. But then I enjoy everyone's company here and try not to make waves. The last time I scratched too deep it cost us a member.
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I just read this article and I think I have to agree with Weisshaupt's closing remark as reflecting my major concern, because I could see the Øbomination not wanting to waste the drones and risk having them shot down and look like a pussy in the face of this separatist threat and instead just lob in a low-yield nuke, I really wouldn't put that past him, and I really don't know if I could count on the people executing the mission realizing this is a major breach of their oaths of office and refuse.
And why would you want to advertise the community? Why not just build it and ignore the Feds?
But this effort and other warnings from Rush, Levin, Savage, Hannity, Charlie Daniels (see link below), Southern and Midwestern states (taxes, see link below) and such are illustrating two things - first, people know something is terribly wrong in their country and second, they are not looking to Washington for answers. This is all starting to come to a head and the wise people are preparing accordingly. The thing is people have different ideas about what to prepare for based upon their thoughts (right, wrong or indifferent) as to what can, should or will happen.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/01/13/us-usa-tax-states-idUSBRE90C08C20130113 (http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/01/13/us-usa-tax-states-idUSBRE90C08C20130113)
http://cnsnews.com/blog/charlie-daniels/precedent-teaches-us-left-really-wants-all-our-guns (http://cnsnews.com/blog/charlie-daniels/precedent-teaches-us-left-really-wants-all-our-guns)
We are wading into the Rubicon now and the current will only get stronger.
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Submitted for your contemplation:
Watauga County ‘mountain man’ fighting to keep his nature camp open
BOONE A road that peels off the Blue Ridge Parkway curves around mountain slopes until, at a keep-out sign, it turns to gravel and plunges downhill through the forest into a world nothing like yours and mine.
The buildings scattered in a clearing at the road’s end look like they might have been raised by pioneers. Massive, dove-tailed logs cantilever under wood-shingled barns and workshops. A whimsical treehouse built like a boat floats 30 feet off the ground.
No structures at Turtle Island Preserve, a 1,000-acre outdoor education center, came from an architect’s drawing board and few of their parts from Lowe’s. That’s become a problem for its nationally known founder, Eustace Conway, who doggedly lives in the old ways and teaches thousands a year how they can, too.
The problem is that, like Conway, his buildings don’t square with modern times. Erected without permits from lumber cut and milled on site, they don’t meet construction codes. Health authorities have cited violations. Watauga County has ordered Turtle Island to stop accepting visitors.
“Basically, they shut us down,” Conway said this week.
Lawyers and engineers are working on his behalf, searching for a solution. Nearly 10,000 people have signed petitions asking the N.C. Building Code Council to change codes or exempt Turtle Island. Conway will appear before the council Monday in Raleigh.
Read more here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/12/07/3713079/watauga-county-mountain-man-fighting.html#storylink=cpy#storylink=cpy (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/12/07/3713079/watauga-county-mountain-man-fighting.html#storylink=cpy#storylink=cpy)
My curiosity stoked, I did a websearch for a live aerial view of his property. What I saw was pretty typical for deep-rural - makeshift, disorganized, and unkempt. It's possible that if he were my next-door neighbor I might be up in arms by his antics as well. But mostly what I saw was some guy off "doing his own thing". I also saw the typical heavy hand of government asserting itself even in the middle of nowhere (literally).
What this is telling me is that my impressions that I will invariably become a total outlaw (or succumb to the machine) and need as much as humanly possible to fly under the radar.
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::cussing:: tyrants!
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Saw that too, 'Soup. And you do not want to get me started on "building codes".
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As I sad in another thread...
A Freudian slip perhaps? Or was it just me?
Perhaps. But I am also a really bad typist, and even worse proofreader.
There was an interesting discussion in the comments of that CNS article (betwixt & between the trollish ones) about the practicality, the propriety, and the purpose of such a community. The trolls were there to fling poo, insulting anyone who doesn't think that our present circumstances in Øbomination ain't just the neatest thing. One of them tosses the red herring of "What good did the pubbies ever do?" as a deflection to the 900 pound gorilla which is, "If Øbomination is such a sweet deal, why are so many trying so hard to escape it?"
For the liberal its never enough for them to say " Good luck with that" - You have to want to be part of their tribe, and be derided if you don't. Everyone must want tobe one of the "cool kids" or the Cool Kids' status is threatened.
As for The Citadel project itself, I'm finding that I am perhaps insufficiently radical right enough to qualify for inclusion. Maybe it is just blowback from all the foolishness that has been shoved at us but on many sites I find my opinions of caution and moderation greeted with contempt and derision. I don't really GAS and I'm not inclined to back down or panic-react because someone doesn't agree with me, but I do find the proposition of being out of touch with both the left and the right a bit unsettling.
I am pretty sure the time for moderation is over. They other side has made it clear that absolute tyranny is their goal, and they are not interested in anything but 100% capitulation - and that is probably the basis of any push back you are getting. . Forming a walled community with an in house militia is pretty drastic, but so is the idea of minting Trillion Dollar coins, that one is being discussed seriously, means the other must follow. We have entered a time where the old rules no longer apply, and not one is certain what the new rules will be. Formation of something like this community is the definition of caution.
And maybe I'm reading more into their mission statement than really exists. It sounds to me like right-wingers playing at libertarianism with pure democracy as their model for governance. And jefferson as their inspiration? No thanks.
Jefferson said a lot that was right, but like all men he was flawed. I wouldn't want to live under any system defined by a single founder. We needed that mix. Madison is probably as close as we come to a synthesis. However, I don't think Jefferson would have supported a pure Democracy, even if it had been practical in his time. Jefferson was often times impractical and far too idealistic - but it was probably just that quality that allowed him to give the best voice to the principles we hold dear. But it was also that quality that made him think the French Revolution was a great idea, and to believe a "Natural Aristocracy" of merit, would arise in a Democratic Republic. I have no idea what philosophy will rule at Citadel in the end. The point is, I would rather live in a pure Jeffersonian system and under Obama and what we have now. You can only choose from the choices before you. I am not headed to Citadel myself, but more power to them.
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Saw that too, 'Soup. And you do not want to get me started on "building codes".
They are jacking this guy up because (among other perceived offenses) much of his lumber is self cut and milled and consequently not "graded" or "certified". Are you sh!tting me?! I worked as a laborer building two different log homes (very upscale/high tech) in which we used many of the timbers from the property itself. I guess we must have just lucked out.
There's a lot about this guy and his outfit that turns me off. His operation looks like something out of mammy yokum and I prefer something a bit more ship-shape, but the pernicious persistence of bureaucrats on asserting themselves where they don't belong is my primary focus here. I'm surprised that the bastards didn't invoke ADA rules about ensuring that the treehouse was wheelchair accessible.
You know that these (insert Godwin's Law invocation here) will do the same (if not worse) with The Citadel project and anywhere else that people go to try to escape them.
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Predicting the future is no easy thing.
I will be curious to see how the citadel thing works out. I'm personally pulling for them but I am also skeptical.
In my mind, it isn't big enough.
And I would like to know more about the means of governance. The article doesn't really spell that out. MYOB will only take you so far.
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Wonder if “Unwelcoming” Means Boxcars and Relocation Camps?
Posted by Harvey at 3:00 pm
[High Praise! to I'm a Man! I'm 41!]
Background:
The Free State Project is an effort to recruit 20,000 liberty-loving people to move to New Hampshire. We are looking for neighborly, productive, tolerant folks from all walks of life, of all ages, creeds, and colors who agree to the political philosophy expressed in our Statement of Intent, that government exists at most to protect people’s rights, and should neither provide for people nor punish them for activities that interfere with no one else.
Their theory is that 20,000 politically active people would be enough to leverage control of the state government, whereupon they could get to work repealing liberty-crushing state laws as well as opting out of participating in many federal programs that tie onerous strings to their money.
One New Hampshire Democrat’s reaction to this “threat”:
“In the opinion of this Democrat, Free Staters are the single biggest threat the state is facing today. There is, legally, nothing we can do to prevent them from moving here to take over the state, which is their openly stated goal. In this country you can move anywhere you choose and they have that same right. What we can do is to make the environment here so unwelcoming that some will choose not to come, and some may actually leave.” (http://www.imao.us/index.php/2013/01/wonder-if-unwelcoming-means-boxcars-and-relocation-camps/)
More here: http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2013/01/06/new-hampshire-representative-says-free-state-libertarians-not-welcome/ (http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2013/01/06/new-hampshire-representative-says-free-state-libertarians-not-welcome/)
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Guys not to be a jerk but I've seen this guy on some reality show and it showed how some of those building are put together and how he repairs them. I would not walk in those buildings for any reason.
The guy has a great thing going as fart as living off the grid and all that but reusing bent nails isn't the best thing in the world. Undersizing nails and lumber isn't all the good an idea.
The man sells rough sawn lumber and fire wood to make a living. But man the buildings are a menace.
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Guys not to be a jerk but I've seen this guy on some reality show and it showed how some of those building are put together and how he repairs them. I would not walk in those buildings for any reason.
The guy has a great thing going as fart as living off the grid and all that but reusing bent nails isn't the best thing in the world. Undersizing nails and lumber isn't all the good an idea.
The man sells rough sawn lumber and fire wood to make a living. But man the buildings are a menace.
Nor would I. But if I were a building inspector I'd be inclined to work with this guy to try to help him get his act together before I pulled the azzhole card like they've done in this case.
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I'm of the opinion that a guy living a rustic life in the woods and selling a rustic experience to customers who understand what they are getting into should be no business of any bureaucrat. If liability is an issue, enforce business insurance that is typical, personally wise, and in the public interest.
If he can find a company that will insure him, and people who purchase his rustic experience know what they're getting into, then why should rustic buildings in the wilderness meant for the purpose of rustic living be subject to bureaucratic oversight?
I didn't read the article, so maybe I'm missing something.
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Sounds basically like he was left alone for decades until he appeared on the History Channel, and now all of a sudden the local bureaucrats have a keen interest in his operation.
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Sounds basically like he was left alone for decades until he appeared on the History Channel, and now all of a sudden the local bureaucrats have a keen interest in his operation.
Bingo!! He exposed himself! But don't shed a tear for him,he's making a ton selling the I live on nothing story.He was fine till he went public and people signed up for his courses. Most that show up have no clue that the buildings are barely holding up never mind legal(they don't have to be legal to be safe)but they aren't.
I saw some of his repairs on the show and replacing load carrying beams with boards that are so undersized that I made a comment to my wife to that effect the night it was on.
As for insurance,no insurance company on earth would cover his liability due to the fact that once again,nothing is safe. You just can't use undersized lumber(grade be damned)and reuse undersized nails to carry the load coming down from the roof.
He was there by himself the worst that happens is he kills himself but he's allowing the public in and that's all the opening the locals need to put a stop to it.
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Building Codes? Unsafe construction? Check out Bishop's Castle. (http://www.bishopcastle.org/#)
Bishop's Castle (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDQsy7aiVD0#)
Long story with this guy. Just started carrying rocks out of the National forest to build the thing. They tried to shut him down, than he sued, and won. Now he takes rocks out of the Forest by the truck load. I was taken to see him when I was 8 or so. He cursed up a storm, ranted about the govt, and he has only gotten worse since. He had one wall built then. Now its a sight to see. Maybe I should actually go see it one of thee days
He lets you walk around un-escorted and you can climb as high as you dare. You can have weddings there. Its a lawsuit waiting to happen, but he has signs everywhere telling you that YOU are responsible for whatever dumb ass thing YOU do.
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All this is easily fixed by having people sign waivers, right? Anything "high risk" like parachuting, bungee jumping etc, they have you sign a waiver, what's the fricken difference in these cases?! Govt has no right interfering, nobody is dousing people in gasoline and lighting them on fire, no state interest, if people sign a a waiver and ignore posted warnings...well, that's just Darwinism in action, Govt should butt the hell out.
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Citadel, once again IAL's (http://www.itsaboutliberty.com) initial (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,7141.msg87769.html#msg87769) observations (http://itsaboutliberty.com/index.php/topic,7141.msg87776.html#msg87776) were keen.
Christian Hyman/Sam Kerodin
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2004/jan/7/20040107-094235-2178r/ (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2004/jan/7/20040107-094235-2178r/)
http://securitysolutions.com/mag/security_helpfulness_becomes_extortion/ (http://securitysolutions.com/mag/security_helpfulness_becomes_extortion/)
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Climate looks swell...but I'm not going anywhere...
http://www.theblaze.com/advertorial/disenchanted-americans-start-life-over-in-tropical-belize/ (http://www.theblaze.com/advertorial/disenchanted-americans-start-life-over-in-tropical-belize/)
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If I go anywhere it's not going to be somewhere tropical. Too much feral humanity in warm climates. I'll take the boreal forests of Canada/Alaska. I'd have to get over my revulsion to gutting large game though.
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If I go anywhere it's not going to be somewhere tropical. Too much feral humanity in warm climates. I'll take the boreal forests of Canada/Alaska. I'd have to get over my revulsion to gutting large game though.
Start small and work your way to large game.It's not that big a deal.
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How to Skin & Clean a Rabbit... (Part 1 of 2) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaj3-t1z8Xo#ws)
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Kiww da wabbit, cwean da wabbit, eat da wabbit. Mmm...wabbit!
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Yeah it's weird, I have some mental hang up about the warm blooded and furry critters. I can decapitate and gut a fish with hardly a thought. Maybe I'll start with bird hunting as a bridge. Warm blooded but not furry!
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Guts be guts...kill it & grill it!
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Guts be guts...kill it & grill it!
It doesn't taste like chicken,it's better.
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Guts be guts...kill it & grill it!
It doesn't taste like chicken,it's better.
::whoohoo::
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And once again Idaho starts looking good to me!
(http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user3303/imageroot/2014/01/20140108_shame.jpg)
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-01-08/united-states-shame-what-your-state-worst (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-01-08/united-states-shame-what-your-state-worst)
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Yeah it's weird, I have some mental hang up about the warm blooded and furry critters. I can decapitate and gut a fish with hardly a thought. Maybe I'll start with bird hunting as a bridge. Warm blooded but not furry!
There is no blood lust in my soul. I don't hunt and never have. I will, however, an with no qualms, take out each and every chipmunk and groundhog in our back yard. I hate the varmints.
I also hate the varmints called liberals and communists. I haven't had the opportunity to take out any of them -------------------------- yet.
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If NC's shame is Teacher Pay (according to Libertas' map) because they are too low, "they" can KMA. With the 'product' they're turning out, they should be paying parents -- and the rest of us.
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OTH, you get what you pay for.
(Not taking sides here.)
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No, OC, often you pay for what you do not get. If paying more meant you got more, New Jersey would have the best educated students, with the highest test scores. They do not. Pretty much middle of the road scores for the highest pay does not seem like they get what they pay for at all.
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It's for the children= get ready for a cavity search of your wallet.
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No, OC, often you pay for what you do not get. If paying more meant you got more, New Jersey would have the best educated students, with the highest test scores. They do not. Pretty much middle of the road scores for the highest pay does not seem like they get what they pay for at all.
True. But think about what happens when the lowest pay is involved.
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As it happens, NC teacher pay ranks at 46th in the nation. (http://wfae.org/post/nc-ranks-46th-teacher-pay-are-fears-justified) Of course, the cost of living is lower here, comparatively speaking, than some of the higher paying states, although I have no idea what's up with Wyoming. (http://www.teacherportal.com/teacher-salaries-by-state/)
But, in my opinion, that is "neither here nor there". Aka, it doesn't matter.
If any want a discussion about teachers and their pay, we can start another thread in the "education" section because I have plenty of non-happy-crappy to say about the issue.
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Education + Politicians + Lottery = more money for politicians to scam & steal.
Both Michigan and Florida used the excuse that getting the lottery would be great for education, while I lived there. Well the only thing in both states that happened, all of a sudden all lottery money went into the 'general fund' to be handled by the politicians, and the education system keeps on failing.
Now Colorado has vetoed to legalize 'pot' for the benefit of education, and a couple of other states are talking about the same scam.
Wake up America!!!!!!!
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Same for every other funding scam...tobacco settlement, trans taxes, whatever...goes into the general fund and blown on rent-seeking trash...some are called teachers. Yes, I said it! Many teachers are rent-seeking trash...because they put their welfare and their union ahead of the chirren, then hide behind those chirren and accuse others of hating chirren and teachers if they fail to submit to the annual tithe some call a levy!
To Hell with them, call me whatever you want...it's not going to change my mind and suddenly make me agree to your extortion scheme!
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Education + Politicians + Lottery = more money for politicians to scam & steal.
Both Michigan and Florida used the excuse that getting the lottery would be great for education, while I lived there. Well the only thing in both states that happened, all of a sudden all lottery money went into the 'general fund' to be handled by the politicians, and the education system keeps on failing.
Now Colorado has vetoed to legalize 'pot' for the benefit of education, and a couple of other states are talking about the same scam.
Wake up America!!!!!!!
Almost the same thing happened here in NC. We from other states (mine was NJ) who knew the score tried to tell 'em what would happen. Did they listen? No. So, once the whinging started -- because the State education budget was reduced by the lottery money amount -- we got to say 'toldja bitchez'.
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Now Colorado has vetoed to legalize 'pot' for the benefit of education, and a couple of other states are talking about the same scam.
Wake up America!!!!!!!
Hey I voted to legalize Pot. I figured the more mellow they are the easier they will be to round us when the time comes, and the more likely they are to forget to vote - or do anything. Let it Burn.
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Education + Politicians + Lottery = more money for politicians to scam & steal.
Both Michigan and Florida used the excuse that getting the lottery would be great for education, while I lived there. Well the only thing in both states that happened, all of a sudden all lottery money went into the 'general fund' to be handled by the politicians, and the education system keeps on failing.
Now Colorado has vetoed to legalize 'pot' for the benefit of education, and a couple of other states are talking about the same scam.
Wake up America!!!!!!!
My recollection for Michigan was that the lottery proceeds were to be directly applied to fund education. What was not said that all other funding would be withdrawn dollar for dollar so that in effect lottery money simply displace other money so that the other money could be spent elsewhere. No net increase in education funding, just a direct tax increase on those who pay to play. ::cussing::
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....and the more likely they are to forget to vote - or do anything.
Unfortunately, old age has the same effect.
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Education + Politicians + Lottery = more money for politicians to scam & steal.
Both Michigan and Florida used the excuse that getting the lottery would be great for education, while I lived there. Well the only thing in both states that happened, all of a sudden all lottery money went into the 'general fund' to be handled by the politicians, and the education system keeps on failing.
Now Colorado has vetoed to legalize 'pot' for the benefit of education, and a couple of other states are talking about the same scam.
Wake up America!!!!!!!
My recollection for Michigan was that the lottery proceeds were to be directly applied to fund education. What was not said that all other funding would be withdrawn dollar for dollar so that in effect lottery money simply displace other money so that the other money could be spent elsewhere. No net increase in education funding, just a direct tax increase on those who pay to play. ::cussing::
Your recollection is correct - not just Michigan though Florida did the same thing. Florida still boasts 'giving X amount to education', but not reporting the equal reduction from the state. But the 'lawmakers' have the extra in the general fund. [So they can spent it wisely (http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv176/rustybayonet_2009/Things/sarcasm.gif) (http://s681.photobucket.com/user/rustybayonet_2009/media/Things/sarcasm.gif.html) ]
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We started the lottery in Tennessee "for the children".....and I don't really care how the poor spend their money but I HATE pulling into a market and WAITING on some shlub to purchase their lottery tickets. I don't know about every other state, but here there are around a kajillion games which can be played. When my slurpee is melting, I get ill.
And our education system is no better.
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There are LINES of suckers buying lottery tickets here. Throwing good money after bad.
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The darker the spot the more imperartive it is to avoid!!!
(http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user3303/imageroot/2014/01/20140113_live.jpg)
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-01-13/where-world-do-people-live (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-01-13/where-world-do-people-live)
::exitstageleft::
Boy...west of the Mississippi and east of Californicated sure looks purdy!
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Yeah, the old lottery for education scam. It goes into the same "lock box" that your Social Security TAX goes into.
Regarding teacher salaries, for literally my entire conscious life I've heard the whining about how underpaid they are. Well education majors in college are statistically among the very dumbest and with the weakest entry scores. When they get into the teaching profession they're very difficult to get rid of for incompetence. In some places, like NYC, getting rid of one is so close to impossible that it's easier and cheaper to just assign them to the so-called "rubber rooms" where they continue to be paid but have nothing to do.
The USA spend more per capita on primary and secondary public education than almost any country in the world. We spend more per capita than they do in countries like Finland, Germany, etc, and those countries' students run circles around ours. If a private charity had so little of every dollar actually reach the end goal, it would be illegal. The never ending sob story that demands we keep shoveling money into the gaping maw of public education is more about funneling money to unions (and by extension the Democrat Party), and maintaining sinecure for useless administrative apparatchiks, than it has ever been about making little Johnny and Susie into competent, self-sufficient adults.